PC vs. UDM vs. Festool: Vibration comparision results are in

tod071 said:
I have a PC, Festool, and Metabo on its way and have used all 3. Long story short, PC is being sold. Festool gives everything that the PC can offer, plus 2 more settings above it. (PC5/6=Festool3/4). It also gives you the ability to do simple corrections from the rotary side, equivalent to about a 1, maybe 2 on the Metabo. While I still wouldn't replace both pc and rotary with the Festool, the combo that I chose is the Festool/Metabo. Oh, and I don't get ringing in my ears from the PC anymore either :D Vibration is also significantly less on the Festool, not to mention the soft start, which you normally find only on rotaries.
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Thanks for the info. helps a lot!



Howard
 
ZoranC said:
There is some mentioning of Festool and it's "cousins" across detailing boards for those that dig. Totoland Mach was biggest poster. When it comes to noise UDM is bit better than PC. Festool is, again, way ahead in that category too.



When it comes to correction abilities between these three I aborted that test as I realized circumstances are such I wouldn't be able to provide best answer to that question. However, I can talk about perceptions of power.



UDM does not bog down as easy as PC. I can easily bog down PC with 5" pads. I can bog down UDM too but it takes more to do that by margin that is big enough that bogging down is not in your way.



And bogging down Festool? Fuggedaboutit. That thing keeps running. Yes, you can still bog it down but it takes sooo much it is same as if you can not bog it down because you would never use so much pressure, not even accidentally, during normal course of work.



So, can Festool correct better than UDM? Again, I am not able to provide that answer yet. However, logic says yes. I am not using logic of "Festool has more amps" because one could on the other hand say it has shortr throw. I am using logic "Totoland Mach used to use it daily on number of BMWs, if Festool was not better than PC he would be using PC".



Still, hopefully I will be able one day to provide definite answer on that. In the meantime I will keep posting updates.
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Yeah.....I asked Totoland recently on another site how he likes the Festool as he's had it for about 8 months. Sounds like he uses it mostly for plastic parts while using a rotary for the rest.



Howard
 
Ben Kenobi said:
That was an excellent video MobileJay. Did you happen to see that they have an automotive applications website? I found it when looking at their international site, it's very interesting. Festool Automotive - Elektrowerkzeuge und Druckluftwerkzeuge Does anyone have experience with their rotary polisher the Pollux 180 E? Nice tools, I'm curious how much the RO 150 is here.
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Damn, they even have their own polishes(dont know if they are for paint though) and pads. Well I don't know if they make their own pads or they are from other companys, but its on that site. I wonder how the polishes work.
 
Scottwax said:
Keep the PC, get the Cyclo carpet brushes, bolt one on and use the PC to clean carpets and mats. I have two PCs, one is dead so I'm going to have it fixed and set it up for carpet duty. :bigups
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Excellent tip. I was ready to give up a brand new 4" BP & pad too, but now I have even more use for the PC.
 
So is the UDM better than the Festool, or just a different geared machine. I'd imagine the Festool is the way to go for professionals.



Still love my Rotary! No replacement at all.
 
I have no idea but I am assuming that UDM is better than PC and Festool is better than UDM and under a rotary of course. but no one knows yet
 
MobileJay said:
I have no idea but I am assuming that UDM is better than PC... but no one knows yet
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Why no one with both machines seems unwilling to do a side by side comparison of the two using the same pads, same polish and same speed under halogen lights is competely beyond my ability to comprehend. Absolutely the only thing that matters to me (and probably 99.9% of the rest of autopia) is whether or not the UDM corrects better/faster than the PC. The rest of the stuff is just fluff.
 
Scottwax said:
Why no one with both machines seems unwilling to do a side by side comparison of the two using the same pads, same polish and same speed under halogen lights is competely beyond my ability to comprehend. Absolutely the only thing that matters to me (and probably 99.9% of the rest of autopia) is whether or not the UDM corrects better/faster than the PC. The rest of the stuff is just fluff.
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Scott, part that I do not comprehend is why would expert of your caliber wait on the input of others that will most likely be less competent to do such test than you?
 
others already have the machine so they should post. In order for scott to do the test he would have to buy the machine, if he didnt like it then hes out the money. Unless it was givin to him strictly for testing and then returned, but that might not happen. my 2 cents
 
ZoranC said:
Scott, part that I do not comprehend is why would expert of your caliber wait on the input of others that will most likely be less competent to do such test than you?
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What? I should buy a $150 polisher to do the test? Are you going to give me the money? I already have a PC and Cyclo. Why would I buy another RO/DA buffer just to test? If it doesn't correct any better than a PC, then I wasted $150.



Several people already have both. The whole reason for the UDM to exist is to provide a more powerful version of the PC. I have yet to see a test that compares the two on that basis.
 
Scottwax said:
What? I should buy a $150 polisher to do the test? Are you going to give me the money? I already have a PC and Cyclo. Why would I buy another RO/DA buffer just to test? If it doesn't correct any better than a PC, then I wasted $150.
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What I was saying is that if you are interested would some tool work better for you you are among most competent ones to answer that question.



Also, I know that it would be nice to have side by side test and that nobody posted that yet, however few people that have reputation of knowing their stuff posted that UDM is correcting better. SpoiledMan for one said UDM corrects at 4.5 what PC would need 6 for. Is that not at least some assurance UDM does correct more?



P.S. You wouldn't be out $150. I would guess you wouldn't have problem selling it with very little loss.
 
ZoranC said:
Also, I know that it would be nice to have side by side test and that nobody posted that yet, however few people that have reputation of knowing their stuff posted that UDM is correcting better. SpoiledMan for one said UDM corrects at 4.5 what PC would need 6 for. Is that not at least some assurance UDM does correct more?
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Not enough to get me to spend $150. I want to see side by side comparisons under halogens. There are several good detailers here who have both. I can't buy every single product and tool out there to test, that is what this forum is for, so we can share information.



P.S. You wouldn't be out $150. I would guess you wouldn't have problem selling it with very little loss.
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I buy one, test and it post results showing no clear advantage over a PC and you honestly think I could sell it with very little loss if that was the case?
 
I posted my review on the official UDM thread:



me said:
For me the UDM is my first polisher and here's my experience with it:



I found the orbital motions at first to be unsettling, especially on the lower speeds. Even though it was my first machine polish I cranked it up to speed 6 to fix some deep scratches on my parents' Camry (this car hasn't been waxed or polished from the day we got it in 98 and also haphazardly washed every few months.) I tried speed 4 and 5 first but they didn't do enough for the deep swirls so I cranked it up. The vibrations are kind of large but it's ultimately smooth. Once I got used to the feel of a random orbit I was very comfortable with the machine. After I finished my hood, I didn't even notice the vibrations. For finishing, I was even able to comfortably control the machine with one hand (I was tired.)



Now what really impressed me was how the UDM just kept on truckin even though I really leaned into it. on the trunk I practically lifted myself pushing down on the machine and it didn't give the slightest hint of bogging down. I can't compare to the PC but as far as power tools go, I'm not used to anything that can support so much pressure. It broke down the polish admirably quickly. When I get my technique down to a science I'm sure I can do my car in about an hour to an hour and a half (heavy polish/compound + final polish.)



I couldn't get out a lot of the scratching though (I was using Intensive Polish.) I got out 100% of the surface swirls but deeper ones I couldn't touch. I don't know if that's a function of the polish or the polisher but I assume it's the polish because the polisher broke the polish down really quickly at that speed and pressure. When done the paint was pleasantly warm, not hot, despite the amount of pressure, the speed, and how slow my passes were, so the margin of user-error on the UDM is as huge as random orbitals advertise. With a heavier cutting polish I'm sure I could get the deeper scratches out. I'll have to order some to test that out but I really think the IP gave up well before the UDM did. I'll be looking forward to finding the UDM's limit potential.



I'm trying to find bad things to say about the UDM so as to not make it sound like I'm just an Autopia fan boy but the only flaw I found was the on/off switch that everyone already complained about. It's somewhat conveniently located but a little too easy to access. I never accidentally turned it on but I have a feeling I will sooner or later. I just gotta be mindful and I may be able to avoid plastering my garage walls. I think a rocker switch may be better but most likely more difficult to manufacture.
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What I've found out since then is that the polish indeed gave out well before the polisher and all I needed to do was do one or two more focused passes per section (I was doing 2 wide passes per section.) Also now that I've a little more use with the UDM I found the vibrations to be VERY tolerable. I tried again to apply my LSP with one hand on the UDM at speed 3, 4, and 5, and it was comfortable throughout, although speed 3 did get a little jittery using only one hand. The balance at high speeds is confidence inspiring.



Since the UDM is my first polisher I can't compare to the PC so I know I'm not very useful to the seasoned detailers but any machine newbies looking for a good machine, the UDM is it.



Heh, sorry Scottwax and all, I can't do a good side-by-side since I don't have a PC.
 
Scottwax said:
Not enough to get me to spend $150.
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I guess then lack of direct comparison so far shouldn't be a big deal as it is nothing that little time and patience can not resolve.



Scottwax said:
I buy one, test and it post results showing no clear advantage over a PC and you honestly think I could sell it with very little loss if that was the case?
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Yes. In the worst case you would be out difference between what PCs are eBaying for and sale price of UDM, plus shipping, which should be approximately $35, $50 at max.
 
MobileJay said:
Damn, they even have their own polishes(dont know if they are for paint though) and pads. Well I don't know if they make their own pads or they are from other companys, but its on that site. I wonder how the polishes work.
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The polishes works very well IMO...better then many polishes used around here.
 
Correct me if im wrong but i recall DavidB offering a no question ask return policy so all you be out of is shipping cost!!!
 
Which is still money lost, as well as the hassle of shipping it back. It's not too big a deal but entirely avoidable.
 
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