What am I doing wrong? 7424

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imported_motoo344

New member
Alright, for the life of me I cannot correct paint. I have been trying to figure this out for a while now, usually I just get frustrated and have to stop. I have a 2000 Camaro SS and the paint is pretty bad, the whole thing looks like it was painted with swirls already included in the paint. I went out today and tried to give it another go with some different products.



I have been reading non stop for the last 2 months about this stuff. I even have a guide specific for the products I tried using today.



Meg's 105 orange

Meg's 205 white



This actually looks worse, at least to me, what am I doing wrong?



This is the side I did not try to correct before:

IMG_1032.jpg






This is the side I did try to correct before:

IMG_1033.jpg




After side I tried to correct:

IMG_1036.jpg




Closeup:

IMG_1037.jpg






So what am I doing wrong here? What am I missing, I have obviously left some sort of buffer mark on there. Also, what is all that pitting?
 
Is it a factory paint job?



Maybe you are not letting the products break down enough or working them too long.
 
motoo344- IF you're using a ~6" pad, I'd suggest you switch to a smaller one; I only do correction via PC with 4" pads.



It's not unusual for M105 to leave hazing as it doesn't really break down (at all) and is a fairly aggressive product. The idea is that it replaces the original marring with less-severe compounding haze, which is then polished out with a milder abrasive (e.g., the M205).



The compounding haze can be minimized by working the product for the correct period of time, using a QD like Meguiar's #34 when buffing off the residue, and buffing off very gently with soft, plush MF towels.



I find it's often necessary to use some intermediate step between M105/orange and M205/white; something like M205/LC tangerine.



Note that it can take quite a few section passes with each product to correct GM clear.



The pitting is, well...pitting, or else, if the panel has been repainted, it *might* be solvent-pop (sign of a poorly done repaint). I wouldn't expect to do much about it; IME such stuff is usually only fixable with a repaint.
 
Thanks for the quick replies. I am using bigger pads. Should I try from the beginning with my smaller pads? I would say I was working the 105 for 3 minutes follwed by rubbing it with microfiber and some ipa.
 
motoo344 said:
Thanks for the quick replies. I am using bigger pads. Should I try from the beginning with my smaller pads?
Click to expand...



Just happened to be online at the moment :D



Yes, I'd suggest trying the smaller pads, which will allow you to apply more pressure while still keeping the pad rotating.



And I'd probably try working smaller areas.



Be sure to prime the pad(s) properly ala KBM and to clean/replace and reprime as necessary.



I would say I was working the 105 for 3 minutes follwed by rubbing it with microfiber and some ipa.
Click to expand...



That's a LOOOONG time to work M105 IMO, at least if working the size of area that I'd tackle. One "section pass" might amount to only 6-8 "machine passes", meaning that you'd move the PC across left-right then back right-left enough times to do the area once (maybe three motions across the surface), then up-down enough to do the area once that way (maybe three more), and that might be about it for one "section pass". M105 flashes quickly, it's not the sort of product I'd work for minutes.



At this point the M105 shouldn't be completely dry; I don't like working it until it's dry.



When I buff off the not-quite-dry residue, I prefer the QD over IPA as IPA contributes zero lubricity. Yeah, it strips any oils/etc., but that's not my primary concern when buffing off the residue. I'm more concerned with not inflicting any additional hazing, in other words, I want to get the M105 off the paint as gently as possible.



It's important to consider that the M105's abrasives do *NOT* break down. Not at all. They'll still cut the paint just as much when you're finished as they will when you start...maybe even more because the carrier agents/oils dissipate and are no longer there to buffer the abrasives and keep things moving smoothly along.
 
Thanks I will give it another go. I had heard gm clear is tough hopefully the smaller pad will help. I've been doing well with other areas in detailing just I've just been having trouble with paint correction.
 
No luck, unfortunatly I only have orange, white and blue pads in smaller sizes. I cut my working area in half and used the orange pad with 105. I made "three section passes," I followed by buffing with quick detailer and a microfiber. I followed this up with the white with 205. It still looks the same, minus the fact that there is no hazing, the swirls are laughing in my face.
 
Doylestown, Bucks County. Its about 15 minutes from the toll bridge in New Hope/Stockton.



I will admit it is frustrating but I am trying to stay with it. I have followed the cliff notes for the KB method which I have found here. I am either doing something wrong or my pc isn't powerful enough to correct my camaro. I used the same steps I did on the camaro and tried it on a test section on my 2004 Jetta and my dads 1991 Mercedes sl500. It was hard to tell if I accomplished anything on the Jetta because its a silver, but I appeared to do some minor corrections. I believe it worked on my dads Mercedes the test panel I did looks pretty good minus a deeper scratch. I spent 20 minutes starring at this test panel with my brinkman halogen and work lights and couldn't find any swirling. So either I am blind or I accomplished something. :hifive:



Additionally, with the pitting, I noticed there is some bigger 'pits' on both my Jetta and dads Mercedes. I am assuming they are from bird droppings or something else acidic. They seem pretty deep, at what point aren't these correctable?



I was seriously considering trying to start my own little business because I am just out of college and have no idea what I want to do with my life. I have always had an interest in working with cars and running my own business. I had some experience when me and a buddy started an independent record label a few years ago. However, my experience with paint correction has made me seriously reconsider, I seem to be able to grasp everything else but this.
 
Why don't you start a thread in the regional forum and see if there is an Autopian who will stop by or let you come to their place to give you some tips. Doylestown...didn't that used to be the hose clamp capitol of PA?
 
Thanks, I was thinking about that, but I do not know many people in the detailing community. Although, it never hurts to ask. Just out of curiosity, at what point do you know that the pc isn't strong enough to correct paint? A lot of reading I have done suggests pc is great for light-medium swirls and scratching, but anything major a rotary is really they way to go. I mean I could definitely tell there was an improvement in the SL500 which had light swirling. I am pretty sure this car has spent its almost 20 year life in a garage, it only has 72k miles. My Camaro on the other hand spent a lot of time outdoors and it shows. The swirls are so heavy the seem like a solid color...if that makes sense. The PC didn't really seem to take a dent out of the swirls.
 
People get serious correction out of the polish/machine combo you are using. I know you don't know many people in the detailing community, that's why you're here! Post a new thread in the regional forum, and make sure you put your location in the title "Paint correction help in the Doylestown PA area" or something. Lot of helpful people here.
 
mootoo344- Sorry to hear you're not making progress on the Fbody :think:



I'm assuming that you're applying a decent amount of pressure.



To clarify- go over the area about six times and then buff off the residue. Buff off the residue after every "section pass". Plan to do numerous section passes.



Maybe you just need a more aggressive approach. While I've done pretty impressive correction via PC, it can take forever (and I don't mean just a half hour per panel by a long shot, even with M105).



Before turning to a rotary, I'd buy a Flex 3401.



But before I bought that, I'd try 4" wool pads with the M105 (source: Cyclo Toolmakers ). But oh man...that's getting pretty aggressive for work via PC.



On the pitting, the only way to correct that will usually be via wetsanding or *MAYBE* with a rotary. BUT you run the risk of making things worse instead of better depending on the severity/nature of the problem. Seriously, I'd just live with it or have it repainted.



Advice you won't like hearing :o I wouldn't consider doing this stuff professionally if I were you. At least not at this point. Frustrations related to not making progress on your car is one thing, similar problems with a *customer's* car are something very, very different.
 
By what you are saying I might not have spent enough time on it. I definitely agree, I would never go into paint correction without more seat time and positive results. It has sparked my interest because I like cars. Anyway I had some success with the pc on the Mercedes although it took a while. I have access to a rotary and some parts left over from a car I fixed up so I am going to give that a go. If the pc is going to take this long I'll probably go nuts lol. It's a valuable tool no doubt but Id like to at least try the rotary. That's what scraps for!
 
mootoo344- OK, just be a bit careful with the rotary and *keep it moving*.



Before I got the Flex I did my serious correction via rotary and then switched to the PC, so that approach might work well for you.
 
Thanks for all the help, I really do appreciate it. I have read that a lot of people like the rotary and follow it with the pc for reducing any marring or to add sealant. I have heard to keep it moving, I've read several things such as the 'peak' method or whatever its called. Starting at low rpm 600 then to 1200, 1500, 1200, 600 again. The rotary I will be using will be a makita.
 
motoo344- One of my rotaries is a Makita, and I think you'll like how the trigger action works.



I'd tape off edges, corners, and anything you don't want to get polish splattered onto.



The learning curve with a rotary isn't as nice and steep as anyone would like, but it's pretty easy to do so-so work with it, and that's often good enough if you're following up with the PC anyhow. It's when you want to do *REALLY* good work with it (e.g., finishing out hologram-free), that you need a lot of practice/experience.
 
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