Presidential Detailed: Freshly painted EG, almost ruined by a hackjob.

OK, but couldn't they just fade into the surrounding panel(s) rather than redo say, the whole door? Some of today's clears do a nice job of melting into existing paintwork.
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The ONLY time this is even remotely OK to do is on sail panels on an older

car with no break line to the roof (99 Camry, etc.). And this will fail in time.

Think film build and severely reduced UV protection. The blending procedure

doesn't "melt" the clear into the old. The bond is mechanical (why we sand).

The "melt" is just an illusion; kinda like a glazed/waxed job hiding swirls.



A better visualization might be:



Clear protective films. The weakest area are the edges, unless the

entire panel is wrapped.
 
Im no paint expert when it comes to actually painting the car, but if I remember correctly the owner told me that the painter was going to "blow" in the edges??



Regardless, I do agree the entire car should probably be repainted. There was supposedly 4 coats of clear laid, but with the tape line in the 1/4 panel, I really have no clue what the painter nor the hack job actually performed on this thing. My job was simply to make the car look like it did when it rolled out of the booth again, Im assuming neither the detailer prior nor the painter are taking any blame leaving the customer in a bad spot.
 
Whatever he meant by "blow the edges" wont do. He'll either, lightly shoot

some paint (probably what he meant) masking eveyrthing off accept the edges

or just brush (not air brush) them in. Those burns might as well be key scratches.



4 coats is possible. Now it probably has less than 2 coats.



Someone spent a lot of time wet sanding to get it that flat...

Anyhow, YOU did a great job and is out of your hands.
 
Flashtime said:
Whatever he meant by "blow the edges" wont do. He'll either, lightly shoot

some paint (probably what he meant) masking eveyrthing off accept the edges

or just brush (not air brush) them in. Those burns might as well be key scratches.



4 coats is possible. Now it probably has less than 2 coats.



Someone spent a lot of time wet sanding to get it that flat...

Anyhow, YOU did a great job and is out of your hands.
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Im just as curious as you as to what this guy plans to do..haha! Thanks though!
 
Flashtime said:
The ONLY time this is even remotely OK to do is on sail panels on an older

car with no break line to the roof (99 Camry, etc.). And this will fail in time.

Think film build and severely reduced UV protection. The blending procedure

doesn't "melt" the clear into the old..
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Eh...I don't want to turn this into a real :argue and maybe the way I treat my cars factors in, but I have blended areas that are 100% fine after many years, and not just one one or four of my vehicles either :nixweiss



The Spiess-Hecker clear that appears to work best for this was explained to me as doing the "melting" thing; even very aggressive work at the point where it stops and the oe paint begins shows *zero* separation of build-films (different from how things used to work out back in the day).



Sorry, I realize how I'm coming across. Just differing experiences I suppose. I guess I just don't want people to assume that blending will *always* cause problems when it never has for me except a) when the work was done badly and b) back when paint technology was very different.
 
Accumulator said:
Eh...I don't want to turn this into a real :argue and maybe the way I treat my cars factors in, but I have blended areas that are 100% fine after many years, and not just one one or four of my vehicles either :nixweiss



The Spiess-Hecker clear that appears to work best for this was explained to me as doing the "melting" thing; even very aggressive work at the point where it stops and the oe paint begins shows *zero* separation of build-films (different from how things used to work out back in the day).



Sorry, I realize how I'm coming across. Just differing experiences I suppose. I guess I just don't want people to assume that blending will *always* cause problems when it never has for me except a) when the work was done badly and b) back when paint technology was very different.
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I added an aftermarket hood and front fascia to my Mustang 3 years ago.

My painter also used Spies-Hecker to blend the color into the fenders using their water based paint and high solid clearcoat.

I have since put over 35,000 miles with no noticeable effects.
 
The Spiess-Hecker clear that appears to work best for this was explained to me as doing the "melting" thing; even very aggressive work at the point where it stops and the oe paint begins shows *zero* separation of build-films (different from how things used to work out back in the day).



Sorry, I realize how I'm coming across. Just differing experiences I suppose. I guess I just don't want people to assume that blending will *always* cause problems when it never has for me except a) when the work was done badly and b) back when paint technology was very different.
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It's coming across fine! And I do understand what you're saying.

The word "melt" probably shouldn't be used as it's giving the wrong

impression; just like "color sanding." And a few others... And i know

you're speaking from your own experience (unique).



Second page, under "Special Notes:"



http://pc.dupont.com/dpc/en/US/html/visitor/common/pdfs/b/product/sph/SpiesHecker/1031_07.pdf



Dupont Clear coat blending procedure (what i use). Third paragraph:



http://pc.dupont.com/dpc/en/US/html...roduct/dr/ChromaSystem/H-19279_ClearBlend.pdf



First page:

http://www.metropaint.com/pdfs/K-15910_AeroRep.pdf



Blending additives/solvents and technique/method is virtually the same

for all paint manufacturers. And none that i know of will warranty such

a repair; and they are clear about this. There is no "melting" or, rather,

a chemical bond happening.



Your experience/results are obviously good. But that is far from the norm.

Lucky you, really. But not a lot of folks maintain their rides like you do.

Even if the car is well maintained, this clearcoat blending should ONLY

be done on sail panels on a beater with no roof break line.



Eh...I don't want to turn this into a real and maybe the way I treat my cars factors in,
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There is no "maybe."



thump_rrr, basecoat (color coat) blending isn't the same thing..
 
Flashtime- Thanks for all the informative links, those did clear up a lot of the *misconceptions* I had, I do appreciate it (and thanks especially for not blowing me off as an argumentative jerk). I had a lot to learn and you provided just the right info.



Note that in the second link, they say it's not OK to blend, but then in their pic they show a blend part way up that sailpanel :think:



Regarding the link to RL Hudson, I would've thought the old-school lacquers were more like a thermoplastic than a thermoset as I don't think of them curing in quite the same way as other paints :confused:



I do find it interesting that I've been so fortunate and I can think of a few areas in particular that I'll now be watching like a hawk! Specific example: around the fuel filler door on the MPV's left quarter I had a ~4" x 6" area spotted in (kudos to Mike at Stoddard, it's 100% unnoticeable). Reclearing the whole quarter (properly) wouldn've been a huge production, so the little blending job seemed like the only sensible way to handle it.



Just to see what he says, I'm gonna bring this stuff up when I take my M3 in for some pre-sale paintwork. I don't want anything to come back and bite the next owner. What might be OK for me could be awful for somebody else, huh?



The only blend that's ever failed for me *was* with ss (metallic) lacquer, a ?factory/point-of-import? spot-in on the Jag that drove me nuts for over 20 years before I found somebody good enough to redo it to my satisfaction (and yeah, I realize the repair will become more obvious over time :( ).



Thanks again for schooling me, I'm gonna start adding in some serious caveats whenever I post about blending repairs. YMMV indeed!
 
Thats Fresh said:
yikes! im glad he found you. great job.
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Accumulator said:
Flashtime- Thanks for all the informative links, those did clear up a lot of the *misconceptions* I had, I do appreciate it (and thanks especially for not blowing me off as an argumentative jerk). I had a lot to learn and you provided just the right info.



Note that in the second link, they say it's not OK to blend, but then in their pic they show a blend part way up that sailpanel :think:



Regarding the link to RL Hudson, I would've thought the old-school lacquers were more like a thermoplastic than a thermoset as I don't think of them curing in quite the same way as other paints :confused:



I do find it interesting that I've been so fortunate and I can think of a few areas in particular that I'll now be watching like a hawk! Specific example: around the fuel filler door on the MPV's left quarter I had a ~4" x 6" area spotted in (kudos to Mike at Stoddard, it's 100% unnoticeable). Reclearing the whole quarter (properly) wouldn've been a huge production, so the little blending job seemed like the only sensible way to handle it.



Just to see what he says, I'm gonna bring this stuff up when I take my M3 in for some pre-sale paintwork. I don't want anything to come back and bite the next owner. What might be OK for me could be awful for somebody else, huh?



The only blend that's ever failed for me *was* with ss (metallic) lacquer, a ?factory/point-of-import? spot-in on the Jag that drove me nuts for over 20 years before I found somebody good enough to redo it to my satisfaction (and yeah, I realize the repair will become more obvious over time :( ).



Thanks again for schooling me, I'm gonna start adding in some serious caveats whenever I post about blending repairs. YMMV indeed!
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You learn something new everyday here at Autopia ;)



shine said:
Great recovery!
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Thanks!
 
I am a victim of this same BS just got my car painted and wacked detail job! Can anyone recommend someone in the Fort Lauderdale area who maybe bring my car to life? Greatly appreciate it.



Or Billy next time your coming to my area PM me Thanks!



Excellent, beautiful job!
 
82 500sl AMG said:
I am a victim of this same BS just got my car painted and wacked detail job! Can anyone recommend someone in the Fort Lauderdale area who maybe bring my car to life? Greatly appreciate it.



Or Billy next time your coming to my area PM me Thanks!



Excellent, beautiful job!
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I can come down to take care of it for you, PM Sent.
 
Wow, that is just unreal... I bet the guy who painted the car was pissed that his new paint job got ruined by that hack.



The owner is lucky you were able to make it look like new again



Amazing job!!
 
Thanks Rick, and yes the painter was pretty upset, I dont know how they didnt get the situation rectified besides the owner spending more money. I think the painter wanted to see what I could bring back and then just touch up the parts that were left damaged?
 
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