Which to use for winter LSP?

I

imported_RedlineIRL

New member
Well it looks like the weekend is going to hold out and be actually quite warm here, so that means time to get a final application of a durable LSP in. I got a few new LSPs a while back, so some of the ones I have I don't know the true durability of them. While I don't mind testing and trying out new products during the warmer months of the year, this time of the year is where durability counts (I don't really like the idea of hand washing and then trying to apply LSP in 30 degree weather:)). So I was hoping you all could give me suggestions on the most durable route.



So here's the details on the vehicle I am working on and the environment its in: GM victory red (bright red), kept in really good condition no polishing or corrction needed. It sits outside 24/7, and since the nights are almost always humid here, there is usually a buildup or dew on all horizontal surfaceby the morning.



I want to use something that will resist and shed dirt and water the most, especially on the hood since heat is being added to the equation with the dirt and moisture. Since the car sits outside dealing with humidity and dirt is always a battle. Since frequent hand washing probably won't be possbile, I need something I can count on to protect the finish, even if it is covered with weeks worth of grime.





Here a list of the products I have to choose from. Before applying either of these, the car will be getting a once over with KAIO



BFWD

FK1000P

DG601 prior to DG105





Given what I am looking for, which of these combinations do you suggest using?
 
Blackfire is probably not your best choice. Opticoat would be the best but 105 or FK1000P will be fine.
 
SuperBee364 said:
Opti-Coat.... wait, that wasn't on the list. In that case, stick with the 1000P. You'll be glad ya did. :D
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Trust me, one of my goals for next year is to use OptiCoat.:)





I'm sure it has been done, I could really find much by searching, but has anyone done a side by side test with FK1000P and DG 105? I'd be curious to see the durability and beading of the two, and how they react over time.





With FK1000P being a paste wax, has anyone figured out a good way of using it with the PC7424? What about by hand, what is the best method for appling it and with what kind of applicator?





I'm guessing it's probably best to wait at least to wait 10 or 12 hours before applying a second layer with FK1000P or DG105, but will applying a second within a couple hours be fine? Or will this just basicaly wipe off the first layer that was applied? I am kinda working under a time constraint, and I wanted to get it all done at once since next weekend is supposed to be much colder:(
 
RedlineIRL said:
I'm sure it has been done, I could really find much by searching, but has anyone done a side by side test with FK1000P and DG 105?
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Can't help with that, never tried the DG stuff. But I can say that nothing excect *HEAVILY* layered KSG has ever lasted for me the way FK1000P does. One layer is just OK, and you gotta be careful how you layer it (more on that below) but with more than one it's simply amazing. Yeah, YMMV, but still....



With FK1000P being a paste wax, has anyone figured out a good way of using it with the PC7424?
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Sometimes it can be a bit of a "hard wax", so I would'nt use a pad larger than 6". I've done it by machine, but honestly I think by hand is a better approach with this product. Easier to get it on thin and without disturbing previous layers (no way I could imagine doing that by machine).



While I'm a *BIG* fan of LSPing by machine, this just isn't the product for that IMO.



What about by hand, what is the best method for appling it and with what kind of applicator?
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I use a foam applicator, but then I generally prefer that (as opposed to MF/etc.).



I'm guessing it's probably best to wait at least to wait 10 or 12 hours before applying a second layer with FK1000P or DG105, but will applying a second within a couple hours be fine? Or will this just basicaly wipe off the first layer that was applied? I am kinda working under a time constraint, and I wanted to get it all done at once since next weekend is supposed to be much colder:(
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Here's where you can run into trouble IME. The FK1000P can do the solvent-action thing and mess up if you layer it too soon, and even 24 hours isn't always long enough. I got some nasty pseudo-holograms when I waited a day or two between applications.



In your case that's a bummer, huh? But I'd still just do one now and if/when weather/etc. permits do another. I bet you'll have *some* opportunity to do that, and it's not like that one application will be dead in a month or so. With my Tahoe, I did one coat in Dec. and by mid-January I thought it might be uh-oh time, but doing a second one then worked great and I *still* haven't had to redo the roof or hood (that's right, eleven moths later).



Use something like FK425 or Fk146 after each wash, it'll help the FK1000P hang on by providing a bit of a sacrificial layer.
 
A few more questions here on FK1000P





How do you all apply and wipe FK1000P? Do you do a section at a time, the entire vehicle first, etc? I don't want to make the same mistake like I have with 845 and doing the entire vehicle then wiping, I ended up with a lot of streaks that required repolishing to get them off.





I know that more than one layer of any LSP is usually recommended, but does a second layer of FK1000P really increase the dirt resistance and slickenss compared to just one layer? For the peace of mind, I will probably apply a second layer a week later, but I was just curious
 
RedlineIRL said:
A few more questions here on FK1000P





How do you all apply and wipe FK1000P? Do you do a section at a time, the entire vehicle first, etc? I don't want to make the same mistake like I have with 845 and doing the entire vehicle then wiping, I ended up with a lot of streaks that required repolishing to get them off...
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I do the whole vehicle before buffing off, but then I pretty much always do that even with products that "you aren't supposed to use that way". Never got any streaks from FK1000P though, just doesn't seem like that kind of product to me.





I know that more than one layer of any LSP is usually recommended, but does a second layer of FK1000P really increase the dirt resistance and slickenss compared to just one layer? For the peace of mind, I will probably apply a second layer a week later, but I was just curious
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Yeah, while opinions/experiences vary with second coats of many LSPs, with FK1000P it's a surprisingly significant diff! The second coat boosts the already good dirt-shedding and slickness, but more importantly it seems to *REALLY* improve the durability...like "much better than just 2X". No idea why, but it sure works out that way for me.



FK1000P isn't *quite* like KSG, where one layer is awfully short-lived for me and heavy layering is downright mandatory, but I don't get the "better than Collinite!" effects unless I do add at least that second layer.



Doing more than two gets problematic (doable, but tricky) due to the chance of pseudo-holograms, and even for the second one I'd wait at least a week and preferably longer. Also, apply subsequent layer(s) *VERY* gently lest you disturb the existing one and get the problem started.
 
RedlineIRL said:
A few more questions here on FK1000P





How do you all apply and wipe FK1000P? Do you do a section at a time, the entire vehicle first, etc? I don't want to make the same mistake like I have with 845 and doing the entire vehicle then wiping, I ended up with a lot of streaks that required repolishing to get them off.





I typically work ahead one or two panels, then go back and remove. I've had issues when leaving it too long.



I know that more than one layer of any LSP is usually recommended, but does a second layer of FK1000P really increase the dirt resistance and slickenss compared to just one layer? For the peace of mind, I will probably apply a second layer a week later, but I was just curious
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Acuumulator's comment on two coats is spot-on, I'd recommend the same if you seek maximum effect (appearance, longevity and shedding).
 
Not necessary to let 1000P set/cure for 24 hours. The 2180, yes.

Removal of the 1000P indicators is not that difficult if one follows this simple method.

1. "Break the was" as Floyd used to explain it. That means one does not attempt to remove all the indicators in one wipe.

One should lightly wipe the surface with a folded towel, removing just part of the indicators.

There will be some of the indicators, etc visable, just don't go playing "rub-a-dub" at that point.

2.Follow the "break wipe" by using a clean towel or bonnet to finish up the wipe off process.

This is how we taught all the employee's at the mold release firms we provided the product to.

Works great, just have to follow instructions.

Grumpy
 
Ron, thanks for the clarification/correction. I thought (in general) it was best to leave these products sitting for 24 hrs.



How long should the product sit prior to removal assuming the temp is 60F or better?



Thx.
 
By the time you apply the product to the top surfaces, sides, it's ready to come off.

1000P does not have a lot of liquid solvents in it, so the cure of the micro waxes starts pretty much as soon as it is applied.

Just needs a few minutes for the small amount of solvent in it to flash, that starts the curing.

Grumpy
 
I just applied two layers of FK 1000p and wow... the finish is like a soft glass. It's very pleasing to the eye. I've read so many comments about the stuff, when applied properly, giving the illusion of extra clear coat applied to the car. I'd say these comments are true.



Thin coats applied with LC red pad by hand worked swell. The sealant residue was very easy to buff off.
 
Blinky- Glad you're happy with it!



Ron Ketcham said:
..1000P does not have a lot of liquid solvents in it, so the cure of the micro waxes starts pretty much as soon as it is applied.

Just needs a few minutes for the small amount of solvent in it to flash, that starts the curing.

Grumpy
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I guess I'm just....uhm, special :o



I've had such nasty pseudo-hologram issues when layering the stuff that I'm *NOT* gonna reapply for at least a week. Having considered all the, uhm..pertinent variables, I just can't see how people can layer it more quickly than I can :nixweiss
 
Blinky said:
I just applied two layers of FK 1000p and wow... the finish is like a soft glass. It's very pleasing to the eye. I've read so many comments about the stuff, when applied properly, giving the illusion of extra clear coat applied to the car. I'd say these comments are true.



Thin coats applied with LC red pad by hand worked swell. The sealant residue was very easy to buff off.
Click to expand...



Glad to hear that - I have noticed the same on my car. FK1000P is awesome stuff and when dried properly it does look like an extra layer of clear coat.



Accumulator - there are probably a bunch of variables - it could be the weather, the batch of the wax or even just the paint.
 
2005GTPinMD said:
Accumulator - there are probably a bunch of variables - it could be the weather, the batch of the wax or even just the paint.
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Right. Though the conditions were truly optimal (dry, pleasantly warm, low humidity) and I had waited more than 24 hours. Eh, who knows....and yeah, that GMC Carbon Metallic was one *VERY* tricky paint for some reason.
 
Accumulator said:
I guess I'm just....uhm, special :o



I've had such nasty pseudo-hologram issues when layering the stuff that I'm *NOT* gonna reapply for at least a week. Having considered all the, uhm..pertinent variables, I just can't see how people can layer it more quickly than I can :nixweiss
Click to expand...





I've certainly experienced the same. I think the darker colors make the condition FAR more noticeable.



OTOH, when the planets are in alignment, and everything in the world is right, a double-application of 1000p is about as good as it gets! :)
 
RedlineIRL said:
When you all refer to the pseudo-holograms with FK1000P, is it just a haze from the solevents in the wax that washes off?
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No, it's more serious that that. I was able to sort out the problem by buffing with MFs and FK425, but I had to get mighty aggressive about it and I'd hate to try that on softer clear. Noting that I *was* working on a big vehicle, sorting this out took pretty much a full afternoon. Redoing it (something to strip it, then KAIO, then fresh FK1000P) woulda been a *LOT* faster, but then I would have ended up with less FK1000P on there (no, I had no evidence that my buffing away the issues removed so much FK1000P that I was left with just one coat after all).



This isn't as serious an issue as the pseudo-holograms one can get with Collinite 476S, but it's still considerably worse than some minor "oh, I'll just wipe that away, no problem!" type of thing.
 
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