Which pre wax cleaners to use?

I

imported_RedlineIRL

New member
I am wondering which pre wax cleaners I should use prior to using Blackfire Wet Diamond and Wolfgang Fuzion. I don't need anything abrasive that needs to be applied by machine, since I can get by using a mild chemical cleaner applied by hand. I know that BFWD is more or a sealant, while Fuzion is a blend of carnuba and a polymer. I want to avoid using any cleaners that are acrylic based. What is out there for each of these products, and will not prevent them from bonding properly?
 
Blackfire has their Gloss Enhancing Polish, which, despite the name, has no abrasives - it's more of a pre-wax chemical cleaner with fillers. Wolfgang has a similar product, their Paintwork Polish Enhancer.
 
I'd want to use something that fills...AutoGlym SRP comes to mind.



RedlineIRL said:
... I want to avoid using any cleaners that are acrylic based.
Click to expand...
Why's that? :think:



umi000 said:
Blackfire has their Gloss Enhancing Polish, which, despite the name, has no abrasives - it's more of a pre-wax chemical cleaner with fillers
Click to expand...



I have that stuff, I simply love it on satin/matte black bits under the hood and on the undercarriage. Might be a very good choice in this case.



I never noticed it being abrasive, but back when it first came out somebody said that it was :think: I get a bit of transfer off the black bits, but that could easily just be oxidation, considering what I'm using it on.
 
Accumulator said:
Why's that? :think:
Click to expand...

From what I understand acrylic all in ones, cleaners, etc contain a polyehtylene acrylic which is acidic by natue, which can cause minor etching of the paint. Even if its on a minute, not easily detected level, I still don't want to use anything that can do this to the finish.





What about P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleanser? Is it inteded to be used with carnubas? Or should it be fine with BFWD and Fuzion?
 
My choice would be either Clearkote's Red Machine Glaze or Optimum Finish. Not sure if Werkstat's Prime Carnauba contains any acrylic but if not, that would be another great option.
 
The Sonax I mentioned above removes all old waxes and oils and leaves a shiney, squeaky clean, LSP ready finish. I was pleasantly surprised when I used it. I have used many cleaners and the Sonax gets a thumbs up from me. Also it is on sale at Autogeek right now. I also like Scottwax's idea of RMG.
 
RedlineIRL said:
From what I understand acrylic all in ones, cleaners, etc contain a polyehtylene acrylic which is acidic by natue, which can cause minor etching of the paint. Even if its on a minute, not easily detected level, I still don't want to use anything that can do this to the finish.
Click to expand...



The amount of surface etching is miniscule; all it does is to provide a micro anchor to bond the product to the paint, really nothing to worry about. Being acidic its ’resistant’ to bird excrement and acid rain
 
RedlineIRL said:
From what I understand acrylic all in ones, cleaners, etc contain a polyehtylene acrylic which is acidic by natue, which can cause minor etching of the paint. Even if its on a minute, not easily detected level, I still don't want to use anything that can do this to the finish...
Click to expand...



As per what TOGWT posted, the functional/real-world aspect of this is that it simply doesn't matter. Sure never noticed any such effects on my paint, and I inspect with maginfication. But OK, your call, thanks for explaining your reason.



What about P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleanser? Is it inteded to be used with carnubas? Or should it be fine with BFWD and Fuzion?
Click to expand...



I've never tried it other than with waxes (and I didn't care for it anyhow) so I really :nixweiss
 
RedlineIRL said:
What about P21S Gloss Enhancing Paintwork Cleanser? Is it intended to be used with carnubas? Or should it be fine with BFWD and Fuzion?
Click to expand...



Although I love this stuff - and the ridiculously similar S100 Shine Enhancing Cleanser - it is a somewhat oily product so it may not cooperate with your Blackfire sealant. It goes on and spreads smoothly and wipes off very easily. It will remove previous wax/sealant but that is the extent of its chemical cleaning abilities. It also has light glazing effects in that it can hide very minor swirls.
 
Accumulator said:
As per what TOGWT posted, the functional/real-world aspect of this is that it simply doesn't matter. Sure never noticed any such effects on my paint, and I inspect with maginfication. But OK, your call, thanks for explaining your reason.
Click to expand...

Just curious, do use acrylics on a frequent basis? It makes me wonder if years of use of an acrylic product can cause any harm. If you inspect with magnification and haven't seen anything, that passes in my book







MCA said:
Although I love this stuff - and the ridiculously similar S100 Shine Enhancing Cleanser - it is a somewhat oily product so it may not cooperate with your Blackfire sealant. It goes on and spreads smoothly and wipes off very easily. It will remove previous wax/sealant but that is the extent of its chemical cleaning abilities. It also has light glazing effects in that it can hide very minor swirls.
Click to expand...

If its oily I'll pass then. I remember Pinnacle Paintwork Cleansing Lotion having an oily feel to it, didn't like it all all.





The Sonax says it contains mild abrasives, is this something that can really be used by hand without having to work the product in? I am just looking for something that I can wipe on, let haze, and wipe off. Not looking to bust out the 7424 for this
 
RedlineIRL said:
Just curious, do use acrylics on a frequent basis? It makes me wonder if years of use of an acrylic product can cause any harm. If you inspect with magnification and haven't seen anything, that passes in my book
Click to expand...







I've use Klasse (both KAIO and KSG) for many years, sometimes on vehicles where the paint was *extremely* thin, as in "ready to fail". Zero problems.



Best example: I used the Klasse twins on the MPV that had all sorts of "shouldn't work"/"that area's gonna fail!" spot-repairs and clear that was so thin my painter couldn't believe I hadn't hit basecoat..... and there were no problems at all. Heh heh, not having heard of the potential risks, I used the Klasse twins to *preserve* that vehicle's ready-to-die paint and it worked great.



And yeah, the P21s GEPC and Pinnacle's PCL are kinda similar (as is Zymol's HDC). I prefer the PCL out of those three, but I would only use it before a wax, not a sealant.
 
I'm with Accum on this, used Klasse for my base for years, all types of paints, never a problem. Topped it with everything you can think of and it all works well.
 
I decided to give the SONAX Premium Class Paint Cleaner a try. Hopefully it doesn't induce marring by hand, test section first of course, and plays well with BFWD
 
You want be disappointed. I have used many cleaners. The Sonax will leave a perfect LSP ready finish. Let us know how you like it.



RedlineIRL said:
I decided to give the SONAX Premium Class Paint Cleaner a try. Hopefully it doesn't induce marring by hand, test section first of course, and plays well with BFWD
Click to expand...
 
If you just want a paint safe chemical cleaner that will strip out old wax/sealant and leave your paint nothing on it, why not use the cleaner like optimum power clean. You don't even need to buff, just rinse. So you don't need to worry about swirls from buffing.
 
Like the other more mature detailers (how's that for PC ;)) I've been using Klasse since 1960 on both classic and modern paints and even under a microscope (non-electron) I've never been able to detect the etching, I'd be the first to stop using it if it did.



In no particular order



1. Zaino Z-PC Fusion Dual Action Paint Cleaner - a water-based formula with tri-particulate, diminishing abrasive system (no fillers or oils) that removes minor scratches, swirls, oxidation, wax build-up and other surface blemishes, ideal for polymer sealants



2. Dodo Juice Lime Prime Pre-Wax Cleanser - Dodo Juice Lime Prime is a pre-wax cleanser formulated to clean, polish and prepare the paint surface ready for a layer of Carnauba wax.



3. Werkstat Prime Strong - employs acrylic polymers for better durability and protection and also an incrementally stronger polishing agent to address more paint imperfections. This formula takes Prime a step toward a finishing polishes and can eliminate the need for a separate finishing polish in many instances. Prime: Strong can address light marring and swirling more effectively, yet the polishing agents--though stronger--are still gentle enough for regular use. It makes a beautiful, easy hand polish for those without machine polishers, and it works quite well as a chrome polish and sealant.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top