What's the deal with Dawn?

[Upscale Detail]

As a professional detailer, I get the "Dawn" question all the time. It's rather ironic in a way, because we spend so much time talking about and putting effort into getting that wax to STAY ON!!!



Taking off wax is easy and I don't think you need to use something as harsh as Dawn. I am not a big fan of Meguiar's products, but I do like their Gold Class Shampoo. Use this double strength and trust me, it will take every bit of wax, polymers, silcones, whatever, off the surface (short of contaminants that require other stuff). I use the same shampoo double strength to clean wheels, and it also makes a great lubricant when it becomes necessary to clay your entire vehicle--suds and slickness hold up beautifully.



Dawn dishwashing liquid will never touch the surface of my 540i--oh, no! I don't think so!



Peggy Becker

Upscale Detail

Reston, VA

 

[Toyo98]

I'm with lino....car care companies have spent a lot of R&D time to develope products that work on the types of soils associated with the automotive environment. And, if you want to remove wax...why not use a pre wax cleaner...that's what they are designed to do..prepare your paint for the next step...whatever your choice may be...synthetic or natural.

:bow :bow :bow

The right products and the right tools for the right purposes will do the magic. Of course, your mileage may vary. About the Dawn thing, looks like it still will be alive and kicking until "someone" sees the light at the end of the tunnel...hopefully, soon..........:nixweiss

 

[imported_memnuts]

:bow :bow :bow

The right products and the right tools for the right purposes will do the magic. Of course, your mileage may vary. About the Dawn thing, looks like it still will be alive and kicking until "someone" sees the light at the end of the tunnel...hopefully, soon..........:nixweiss

No one is advocating using Dawn for one's routine car wash, but the one time use for the initial cleaning recommended by Zaino to remove all the oily contaminates of carnuaba waxes will do nothing to harm a vehicle's finish, trim, of rubber components. To put thing in perspective, Dawn in solution (mind you Dawn's pH is quite reduced than the initial concentrate's pH and really has no bearing on harshness of the washing solution). Dawn contains surfactants that are quite efficient in removing oils not the alkalinity. The statement in the Z instructions maybe misleading by stating that the alkalinity is the functional component in Dawn.

No sense in us perpetuating this functional mis-statement.



Many vehicles are driven in everyday harsher situations (rain fog, snow:scared,etc ) and fair quite well. A Dawn wash will not etch your paint if used properly but has anyone ever had their paint etched by rain, which is not always acidic? Real world 1 Dawn 0



By all means use products marketed and design for this purpose but do not demonize a readily available quick-at- no-cost prep solution that works and in reality will not cause any paint damage.



:wavey

 

[Antonio Wright]

No one is advocating using Dawn for one's routine car wash, but the one time use for the initial cleaning recommended by Zaino to remove all the oily contaminates of carnuaba waxes will do nothing to harm a vehicle's finish, trim, of rubber components. To put thing in perspective, Dawn in solution (mind you Dawn's pH is quite reduced than the initial concentrate's pH and really has no bearing on harshness of the washing solution). Dawn contains surfactants that are quite efficient in removing oils not the alkalinity. The statement in the Z instructions maybe misleading by stating that the alkalinity is the functional component in Dawn.

No sense in us perpetuating this functional mis-statement.



:wavey

Whatever. That solution was tested on DISHES not automotive paints. You still can't dispute the fact that the makers of DAWN themselves say under no circumstances you should use thier product to wash a car. This thread, debate whatever you want to call it is dead. Use what you want.



Personally, I see it as cutting corners and going at things cheaply. I guess that is just me. *I* strive for 100% not 99.9%.

 

[imported_memnuts]

Personally, I see it as cutting corners and going at things cheaply. I guess that is just me. *I* strive for 100% not 99.9%.

Personally, I analysis the science and the facts and progress from there. When 2 + 1 is stated to equal 4. I step back and ask why. :xyxthumbs

 

[White95Max]

What I find very interesting is that the majority of vehicles owners use products like Dawn, Joy, etc as their normal vehicle wash. Their paint may not meet Autopian standards, but neither is it falling off , their side mounting discolored or rubber molding cracking into volcanized rubber.

Maybe the joke is on us.

Yes. When I was 16 and really got interested in keeping my car clean, I was using dish soap to wash my car every 2-3 days, and this went on for months. Nowadays I know better, but I get compliments on my paint's appearance all the time. Since I washed my car with dish soap frequently without any wax protection and it didn't do anything, I don't see anything wrong with using it once a year to remove wax.



BTW, I used Dawn to remove my NXT that was on my car over the weekend, and the car still beaded extremely well after the Dawn wash. Either Dawn isn't nearly as strong as people believe it is, or NXT is VERY durable.

 

[Toyo98]

Personally, I analysis the science and the facts and progress from there. When 2 + 1 is stated to equal 4. I step back and ask why. :xyxthumbs

:bow :bow What the heck, I stick with 3D. It's just Dawn !.....:bow :bow

 

[bufferman71]

you could go to your local paint supply store and ask for some wax and grease remover. use one rag to put on and one to take off. removes anything on paint, (wax,polish)

 

[Steve @ Guru]

You still can't dispute the fact that the makers of DAWN themselves say under no circumstances you should use thier product to wash a car.

A few things to consider:



1) The makers of Dawn also make the Mr. Clean Auto Wash System. It costs $15 + $6 for refills. A 64oz bottle of Dawn (of which you use at max .5oz per wash) costs $3.99. It's entirely possible that they would rather see you buy their $15 system for the car, AND their $4 wash for the dishes...



2) P&G doesn't say "under no circumstances," they say, "We don't recommend them for cleaning your car." It could be because they don't want people stripping their wax, or it could be b/c Dawn can kill grass (next to the driveway), or it could be because of reason #1 from above.



3) P&G has all of these wonderful heartwarming stories about how Dawn helped save baby ducks that were coated in oil from a major oil spill. I'd think that if it's delicate enough to wash a baby duck, that my car's paint should be able to handle a once or twice a year wash with the stuff...



4) Wash your hands with Dawn, then wash them with IPA or PrepSol. Which feels better? (None really feel great, but which sucks less oil from your skin?)



Just a few thoughts to consider.

 

[DETAILKING]

Steve hit it right on. I think of dawn as a strong car wash. I would only use it as a prep step to get the car really clean. My BMW is 3 yrs old and I have only used dawn on it twice. I actually use dawn as a clay lube. I wash the car with it, soap up a panel, and then clay the panel and rinse. I always follow with a normal carwash to remove any film that dawn might of left. I would much rather use dawn than a solvent like Ethanol, Naptha, prep-sol, Kerosene (most bug and tar removers). I mean why take out the rubbing compound with a light polish will do?



Just to tell you a bit about "manufacturer recommendations," I worked for a manufacturing company a few yrs back. We made an all purpose adhesive sealnt for INDOOR USE ONLY, and then half way through the batch, loaded up the packaging machines with the "marine line" tubes and put the same crap in the ultra water resistant marine line containers are double the price.........

 

[Toyo98]

LMAO.



When in doubt, always follow the manufacturer’s instructions. If it’s not recommended, don’t use it. Otherwise, use it at your own risk.

Here’s one of the questions and answers from PG (Dawn) site:



Question

Can I wash my car with dishwashing detergent?





Answer

Your car surface and the dirt that gets on it are a lot different from the food soils and dishes that dishwashing liquids clean effectively. We don't recommend them for cleaning your car.



The End.

 

[imported_memnuts]

LMAO.



When in doubt, always follow the manufacturer’s instructions. If it’s not recommended, don’t use it. Otherwise, use it at your own risk.

Here’s one of the questions and answers from PG (Dawn) site:



Question

Can I wash my car with dishwashing detergent?





Answer

Your car surface and the dirt that gets on it are a lot different from the food soils and dishes that dishwashing liquids clean effectively. We don't recommend them for cleaning your car.



The End.

"When in doubt, always follow the manufacturer’s instructions. "

No "doubt" here able Dawn's usage. The recommendation was made by a car painter. Someone with "real" experience with paints and body care.



We are respectfully still missing the point. No one is recommending using Dawn as a car wash. Just a one time degreaser. If you do a search on Dawn I wrote a procedure on how one can use Dawn in this fashion.



Again no one is advocating using Dawn or any household intented product as a chronic cleaning tool.



We all here know there are more specific tools (products) for degreasing but to tell a novice or someone that really understands the function of diluted Dawn (1 cap in a gallon of water) in this incidence will cause any damage to vehicle exterior components is unfounded.

Please list any degreaser that recommends its chronic usage.



Dawn as a one time or once a year degreaser - Yes

Dawn as your weekly car wash - No



Big difference.



Good points Steve, White95Max and DK

 

[detailforfun]

Personally, I analysis the science and the facts and progress from there. When 2 + 1 is stated to equal 4. I step back and ask why. :xyxthumbs

When someone tells you 1+2=4, take 3 steps backwards, hold your wallet, turn around, and run FAST.

 

[Scottwax]

Steve-good points, but concerning #3...maybe Dawn is gentle enough to use on baby ducks but it is strong enough to remove the crude oil stuck in their feathers!



=====================



I can certainly understand someone using Dawn to ready their paint for Zaino, but so many people (usually newbies) automatically wash their cars down with Dawn every time they rewax. My opinion is that unless you are beginning to use the Zaino system, stick with regular car wash soap.

 

[Toyo98]

Steve-good points, but concerning #3...maybe Dawn is gentle enough to use on baby ducks but it is strong enough to remove the crude oil stuck in their feathers!



=====================



I can certainly understand someone using Dawn to ready their paint for Zaino, but so many people (usually newbies) automatically wash their cars down with Dawn every time they rewax. My opinion is that unless you are beginning to use the Zaino system, stick with regular car wash soap.

You hit it right on the nose, Scottwax :bow :bow . Talk about 89% of the population (New York Times) will have the wrong idea that it is OK to wash their cars with Dawn. BINGO!



JMO.

 

[imported_rachelanne16]

Taking off wax is easy and I don't think you need to use something as harsh as Dawn. I am not a big fan of Meguiar's products, but I do like their Gold Class Shampoo. Use this double strength and trust me, it will take every bit of wax, polymers, silcones, whatever, off the surface (short of contaminants that require other stuff).

For real? I use EO car wash, but because my vehicle is parked outside under pine trees, I sometimes use it stronger than 1 cap/1 gal. Maybe even up to double-strength, sometimes. This could completely strip my SG?

 

[imported_memnuts]

You hit it right on the nose, Scottwax :bow :bow . Talk about 89% of the population (New York Times) will have the wrong idea that it is OK to wash their cars with Dawn. BINGO!



JMO.

A high percentage of that 89% probably use non-specific detergents to wash their vehicle already. . To be completely forecoming I once was one of them . Not because of a Zaino instruction but just being uninformed. I have never noted any paint damage over those 30+ years.

That is what I posted earlier in this thread to exemplify that these uninformed motorist still have viable finishes and other external components.

Have you ever spoken to a person interested in taking care of their vehicle in a better manner (Autopian style ) and the look of amazement when you mention that they should purchase a shampoo made for their vehicle's exterior cleaning? :shocked



I give the general public a little more credit for NOT reading into the general Zaino instructions and reaching the false conclusion that Dawn is okay for routine weekly washes. Hey, they have gone as far as to seek out one of the best protectants out there, so I think they can figure out the the Dawn step is a one time degreaser/carnauba eliminating step. I know the readers here, newbie or not, understand the concept. :xyxthumbs



I really think we are now really pulling at straws trying to demonize Dawn as a readily available Zaino pre-wash. :nixweiss

 

[Mr. Chemist]

If we use the appropriate product as designed for the task, then we are sure of the results.



To remove dirt, soils and road grime from our vehicles...car wash.



To remove wax from the paint of our vehicles....pre wax cleaners.



Keeps it nice and simple.



Has anybody thought about using car wash soap to do the dishes? Let's see you get that one past the wife....

 

[Toyo98]

If we use the appropriate product as designed for the task, then we are sure of the results.



To remove dirt, soils and road grime from our vehicles...car wash.



To remove wax from the paint of our vehicles....pre wax cleaners.



Keeps it nice and simple.



Has anybody thought about using car wash soap to do the dishes? Let's see you get that one past the wife....

Welcome aboard...No side taking, but glad you are here.:xyxthumbs



Edit: forget to LOL........:lol :lol :lol

 

[HotRodGuy]

As a professional detailer, I get the "Dawn" question all the time. It's rather ironic in a way, because we spend so much time talking about and putting effort into getting that wax to STAY ON!!!



Taking off wax is easy and I don't think you need to use something as harsh as Dawn. I am not a big fan of Meguiar's products, but I do like their Gold Class Shampoo. Use this double strength and trust me, it will take every bit of wax, polymers, silcones, whatever, off the surface (short of contaminants that require other stuff). I use the same shampoo double strength to clean wheels, and it also makes a great lubricant when it becomes necessary to clay your entire vehicle--suds and slickness hold up beautifully.



Dawn dishwashing liquid will never touch the surface of my 540i--oh, no! I don't think so!



Peggy Becker

Upscale Detail

Reston, VA

that's odd, you'd think meguiars wouldn't make a car specific wash that strips wax.