whats the cheapest way/mod to improve performace?

NogaroS4Buffer said:
My car gains a minimum 60hp and 80ft/lb torque(dependant on brand) from a chip and there is no doubt about that:xyxthumbs.
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I find it amazing the a car manufacturer would detune it cars by 33%. There may be two reasons. 1/ the engine can not handle this extreme tuning leading to engine failure or 2/ the chip reprogramming and claimed results are over-stated.

An engine is nothing more than an air pump. If there are restrictions in the intake and exhaust that are not addressed a chip can only do so much. If in the case of turbo/supercharged engine the turbo can only increase intake capacity if the volume of air equal or excess its needs. There again lies the problem of cleansing the cylinders if the exhaust side is not dealt with. Basically, a chip alone can not produce such extreme gains unless the components it augment has this built-in capacity. If this is the case why didn't the manufacturer just sell their cars with this programming? :nixweiss
 
I have wondered and thought the same things myself. From what I read, the chips put alot more stress on the turbos, and are commonly cause for turbo failure.



This puzzels me becuase I can't image what exactly the chip would do that would cause the turbos themselves to fail before the engines. The only thing I can think of is increasing the amount of boost. I don't doubt that VeeDubs and Audis have very strongly built bottomends, but it seams the engine would have problems before the turbo themselves would.



Awhile ago I e-mailed APR about this question and this was the response they gave me.



I think I would have to disagree with your friends perception. Our chips do indeed produce the claimed power and you can see graphs of this on our web page. I have included the link to the graph. Our chips work by remapping the air/fuel ratio and moving the boost curve upwards in response to this. More fuel, more air (read boost), more power. I hope this helps a bit. Let me know if you have any other questions. Thanks. Jeremy Auvil
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Most Turbos have their weak link being the rotor bearings. Even with separate oiling systems with after run flowing capacity these bearing still tend to fail.

Never buy a used car with a turbo. These are usually stressed ( heat and pressure related)engines in which the previous owner felt the decrease in performance and/or leaks. 60hp from a chip on a 4-banger. My 71 VW Superbettle only had 60hp to start with. Isn't electronics wonderful.:wavey
 
Go check out the s4 forums at audiworld.com and you will find many, many people with chipped cars that have not had problems. The twin turbo v-6 engine is plenty strong enough to handle that power. The RS4 in europe runs 380hp with the same engine and slightly larger turbos.
 
For a correctly designed ECU upgrade as applied to a given vehicle, the turbo is usually not what fails as a result of the upgrade, typically it is the engine bearing or connecting rods failing as a result of over boost and or running too lean for prolonged periods. I think turbo failures are usually a result of mis use and also the loss of oil seals is another big factor, IMO
 
People!



We are on the year 2002...................



Electronic managament systems have grown A LOT.......audi´s and VW´s Bosch management systems are bulletproof......although you are changing fuel curves and boost pressures, they will adapt the curve as to make sure you do not get lean, or detonate......for sure, you will mess up your turbo if you run at WOT all the time, but the difference will be that the turbo will last 1000000 miles instead of 2000000 miles........this 1.8t engines are really well suited for boost, they were originally designed for turbocharging, with iron blocks, larger watter passagues, everything!



I know most of you will not believe, but I couldnt believe it also, till I chipped my audi TT (180 hp, 2wd).......I cant floor it in 1st gear due to wheelspin now......those who do not believe should be given a test drive........we agree that the engine will not last soooo long, but, who cares, I am quite sure most of the people here will have changed their cars before damage strikes.....



The S4 has 265 hp (at least in my country) and will reach around 350 with ONLY the chip......add exhaust, intake, and bigger IC, and you are near 400 hp.....no kidding......I´ve driven a chipped S4, and it´ll give a 911 turbo a good workout.....



BTW, boost will not kill your turbo.......shutting down your car after doing 150mph will......a turbo timer is essencial after flooring it......



I have a video, I cant remember where I got it, one of those VW fans pages, of a APR stage 3 golf racing against a S4......guess who won.....



:bounce
 
Dont want to be a PITA, but we all must remeber that you must also woory about how you trabsfer that power to the ground! Transmissions in cars are made for the specific HP and Tourqe or the engine..this is particuarily true with imports like hondas! But goes with any car, you MUST upgrade your transmission to handle the extra power in order to not grenade your transmission! But everything is a trade off.:rolleyes:
 
forgot.. if you are a turbo-er using nitrous, with a progressive timer, you can make curves to compensate for turbo lag!
 
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