What would you charge?

S

SamIam

New member
I walked past a new black BMW 7 series today sitting in a restaurant parking lot at lunch today. Black, looked shiny, but as I got closer, I saw what looked like a 3-D version of the Statue of Liberty projecting from the hood. Wow, either this guy is super patriotic, or someone messed up his car. I left a note on it saying I can fix your hood.



He called before I was done with lunch and asked me to stop by. Anyways, he said it was only or mostly the hood, and asked how it could happen. I told him someone buffed it incorrectly. He said he used a chamy on it and asked what that could do to it. I told him probably cause some scratches. Anyways, he asked if I was bonded, I told him no. He was concerned about turning over his $80K car to me. I told him I show him my black Audi A8 and remove some marring induced by my wife wiping it down. He said great, come on over, and teach me what I need to know. He also asked, what would you charge? I told him I didn't know till I got a better look. He said he was going to charge the dealership anyways.



What would YOU charge to buff out a hood and remove a bunch of buffer induced swirl marks? By the way, I plan on using 1Z Paint Polish, maybe Ultra Polish by PC, and Glanz Wax, maybe topped with some S100, not sure about the S100.



Thanks,



Sam
 
Evaluate the situation as it pertains to future business...First you have to build his trust in you...Second the client has to have confidence you can obtain results that are satisfactory to him,not you!..I would use the marketing approach that the client should pay for your polishes at a very modest cost..What does it really cost you?...$3-4?....say $10 to him...Then if he is satisfied he should let you do the whole car and you will probably get his friends by word of mouth...A little good will on your part can and will go along way...it is a gamble but not a very large one that could bring you a lot of future revenue..Remember the reason you went into this business was probably based on you love to do this kind of work not how much money you can make...Take care of him and show him how good you really are,after 35+ years in this business I promise you you won't be sorry..If he turns out to be not such a desired client and stiffs you...what have you really lost?....if he turns out to be what I think he will be,it wil be a major hook-up for you....Neil Chadwick,Norfolk,VA
 
Neil Chadwick said:
Evaluate the situation as it pertains to future business...First you have to build his trust in you...Second the client has to have confidence you can obtain results that are satisfactory to him,not you!..I would use the marketing approach that the client should pay for your polishes at a very modest cost..What does it really cost you?...$3-4?....say $10 to him...Then if he is satisfied he should let you do the whole car and you will probably get his friends by word of mouth...A little good will on your part can and will go along way...it is a gamble but not a very large one that could bring you a lot of future revenue..Remember the reason you went into this business was probably based on you love to do this kind of work not how much money you can make...Take care of him and show him how good you really are,after 35+ years in this business I promise you you won't be sorry..If he turns out to be not such a desired client and stiffs you...what have you really lost?....if he turns out to be what I think he will be,it wil be a major hook-up for you....Neil Chadwick,Norfolk,VA
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I understand your point, but if he only charges $10 for the hood and the guy decides he then wants the whole car detailed, he is going to balk at paying $100 or so to properly polish and seal the paint, especially if swirl removal is needed. Based on $10 for the hood, the guy will probably think $40-50 is reasonable for the whole car. If you would then agree to that price and the customer is happy, then he tells his friends he has a detailer who only charges $40-50 to polish and wax cars and you then end up doing a bunch of car for a cheap price or maybe making a lot of people mad when you won't do their car that cheaply.



Personally, I think it is better to start off with a proper price scale and make sure your work matches what you are charging.
 
If you set up the sale correctly he will know right from the beginning what range you charge for a full detail,how much of a deal he really is getting and the nature of the work....if you base everything you do on the almighty dollar you will join the rest of the detailers who don't have the luxury of choosing their customers and the quality of cars you work on daily....but being forced to do the gross,mistreated,who cares cars just to make money and stay afloat....After all the years I have done this I now have the option of saying no to whomever I feel.....I do National show winning cars,private collections and have an exclusive agreement with a top notch body/resto shop to do all their work before the customer get their car back..some restos exceed 100K.....some cars have value in excess of 500K!!..my work starts at $100/hr...I have only gotten to this level because I earned it and had to produce the quality results combined with service day in and day out.Sometimes this required doing spot work for a client or helping out one of their friends in a bind..Usually a N/C by me..I have NEVER advertised my business or myself in 35+ years so a N/C now and then or a quick spot repair for little money is the best and most cost effective way to promote yourself...The only advice I will galdly pass along is as a consumer when someone comes at me with a price approach I always go the other way...when someone approaches me with a confident,let me show you attitude and is willing to make the first move I will always give them a chance and become very loyal and galdly spread the word to help them...when you are passionate about something the money always comes...when you are into anything for just money,it shows.....it will always be your choice!!
 
Neil, like I said, I see where you are coming from, but I see detailers all the time end up going down because they offer too many deals or are too willing to haggle on price. I made the mistake when I was first starting out of trying to be the cheapest in town to get business. All I ended up with is crap cars and bargain hunters. Once I raised my prices, I started getting a better class of cars. I also haven't had to do any type of advertising since 1996, save for a listing in the yellow pages (listing only, no ad). Word of mouth is the best form of advertising there is and when the new customer calls, they are already sold on your services and simply want to set up an appointment.



If someone is just starting out detailing, yes, you may have to cut a deal or two, but you need to be very upfront about your regular prices.



I also agree if you are only about money, you will fail. If you are about the quality of the work, the money will soon follow.
 
In the original post from SamIam just the fact he would like an opinion on price suggests he doesn't have the years behind him to make that judgement...The tips I gave him are wisdom from my experiences and the fact that I have probably been detailing and restoring cars and having it my source of income longer than most people on this board have been alive?........The purpose of this forum is to share our wisdom,knowledge and experience.......So understand my answer....It is to help a less experienced professional...It is also very bad advice to give anyone price guidelines even on this forum...What sells for $10 in your area might sell for $20 in mine.Rent in my area might be 3x what you pay..Insurance might be 5x..also without ever seeing the job and it's overall condition even a guidelline can be risky...agree?...No advice is far better than bad advice
 
Neil,



With all due respect, you're not the only person here with wisdom, experience, and knowledge of the business. There are many here with decades of experience.



You're right when you state we're all here to share.... so let's share. You're entitled to your opinion of "bad advice" but how about let the recipient decide what is good and bad? People need guidelines to help them make decisions. You offered yours, Scott offered his, I offered mine, etc. That's what this community is all about. Don't stifle it with, "I've been doing this longer than you've been alive" stuff. That doesn't play well here.



You may be an old hand at detailing but you're new to this forum and community. I hope you understand where I'm coming from and become a contributor to Autopia instead of trying to be Big Daddy. We're not children here, please don't treat us like one.



Respectfully,



- - Bretfraz - -
 
Neil Chadwick said:
The tips I gave him are wisdom from my experiences and the fact that I have probably been detailing and restoring cars and having it my source of income longer than most people on this board have been alive?
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And that makes your advice much better than mine how? I also speak from experience. I've been detailing 12 years now, nearly 10 of that full time as my only source of income. I know the mistakes I made starting out when it comes to pricing and I don't want to see others do the same thing. If you want to get high end clientel, you cannot be too cheap. Someone who pays $70,000 for a BMW 7 series isn't worried about saving $10 here and there provided they get quality work. If Sam tells the guy he will remove the swirls and reseal the hood for $10, the customer is going to seriously wonder why he is willing to do the job so cheaply...most likely thinking he is either using poor quality products or is desperate for work. Either scenario is not good, nor is it professional.



When I first starting detailing full time, my first real high end customer (who had a Rolls Silver Spur and a lowered and body kitted 560SEL) seemed offended when I offered him a multicar discount. He told me never to be afraid to ask for what I thought my work was worth. I believed that to be good advice and nearly 10 years later, I still regularly detail his cars (currently a Bentley Continental SC, Lamborghini Diablo, Mercedes S600, Cadillac EXT, 3 Harleys and a 44' coach).
 
Scottwax said:
And that makes your advice much better than mine how? I also speak from experience. I've been detailing 12 years now, nearly 10 of that full time as my only source of income. I know the mistakes I made starting out when it comes to pricing and I don't want to see others do the same thing. If you want to get high end clientel, you cannot be too cheap. Someone who pays $70,000 for a BMW 7 series isn't worried about saving $10 here and there provided they get quality work. If Sam tells the guy he will remove the swirls and reseal the hood for $10, the customer is going to seriously wonder why he is willing to do the job so cheaply...most likely thinking he is either using poor quality products or is desperate for work. Either scenario is not good, nor is it professional.



When I first starting detailing full time, my first real high end customer (who had a Rolls Silver Spur and a lowered and body kitted 560SEL) seemed offended when I offered him a multicar discount. He told me never to be afraid to ask for what I thought my work was worth. I believed that to be good advice and nearly 10 years later, I still regularly detail his cars (currently a Bentley Continental SC, Lamborghini Diablo, Mercedes S600, Cadillac EXT, 3 Harleys and a 44' coach).
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Too true Scott. A good customer (who later became my investment advisor) got really pissed at me once when I suggested that we could formulate a maintainence package that would save him a little money on getting his new Range Rover detailed. He didn't care about saving a little money - he wanted to be serviced like a king and have his truck look perfect ALL THE TIME. I did so and charged accordingly and he has brought me more business than I know what to do with over the years. People who drive expensive cars don't give a rats *** about saving a few bucks - they want to be serviced in a manner they feel they are entitled to for being successful enough to own such a vehicle. Just my $0.02.
 
Man oh man, what a pi**ing contest....

Sometimes its worth it to even do it free, we all learn a trick or two with every job we do. Ya have to figure, if the guy likes the work you have performed, hes likely to say, "go ahead and do the whole thing", then you charge him accordingly.....The guys drives a 7-series for cryin out loud.....Theres nothing wrong with teazers, there isnt a business in business, who hasnt done something extra for someone down the line, and didnt charge them a bit extra......

Its thought provoking, to say the least...I for one, may just do a free job, on a car I would love to do, just to have it in my portfolio...Would that client tell his/her pals about my work ? I think so, if he liked the work, and Im confident he would.... I think what would bring the conversation up quicker with Sam's client, is not the fact the he "thinks he was overcharged", but the fact that " he hardly charged me a dime", "But i gave him a $20.00 tip"....Good Karma to boot....

he is going to balk at paying $100 or so to properly polish and seal the paint,
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Scott, the guy drives a 7-Series ? $100.00 ? Cmon, thats not reasonable at all....

People who drive expensive cars don't give a rats *** about saving a few bucks - they want to be serviced in a manner they feel they are entitled to for being successful enough to own such a vehicle.
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BINGO......
 
Patrick said:


Scott, the guy drives a 7-Series ? $100.00 ? Cmon, thats not reasonable at all....
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:confused: Huh? What do you mean?



$100 is in line for light swirl removal, polish and seal. It's a 2.5 to 3 hour job max. Full detail would run $150-175 or so, depending on what was needed specifically.
 
You mentioned he would balk at paying $100.00

I just think if this guy drives a 70k car, $20.00 to repair the hood and earn his confidence, is a small price to pay, and $100.00 for an exterior job should be insignificant, hes getting as close or better, than what the car looked like at delivery....

If your saying $100.00 for an exterior job, i would agree, and yes, 175 or so for a complete is definately in line with my pricing as well........

Although Im not as quick as you, your per hr rates would result in being higher...

Ex: I did a 00 black Escalade, over the weekend, 5 hrs total, reg price 219.95... (-10% for flyer discount)= 197.96/5hrs=39.52, right where i want to be at......You could probably fo it in 4 tops, net profit for you would have been 49.49 p/h....not bad dinero!!!
 
Patrick-what I meant was that if you do his hood, removing the swirls and resealing it for a low price, the owner may think that low price will translate to the whole car if you are not upfront about it before you start.



Actually, if you leave the car swirl free, it will be better than delivery, at least based on what I see from BMW dealerships around here!
 
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