What to buy?

C

captpyro

New member
Hi everyone!

I am new to this board and I am getting educated as I read everything!

I just picked up a 08 VW Passat Lux with Deep Black Paint and want to start off on the right foot with proper paint protection for years to come. Also I have just purchase a pc 7424 for this car.



My questions to all of you are:



Does this car have the hard clear coat finish?

What are the best products out there for this color/finish?

Are these products easy to work with?



Thanks in advance for your knowledge and help



Captpyro
 
welcome to the obsession! off the top of my head some product lines that are user friendly would be optimum, chemical guys, and clearkote.
 
Captpyro, grats on the new car! That Passat is sweet, for sure. Black cars are beautiful, but as our very own ptaylor says, "Black isn't a color, it's a part time job".



Suggestions...



Go read this Guide to Detailing - Autopia.org start to finish. It'll take about an hour to get through it all. In particular, you want to pay extra attention to the washing part. then read this one: http://www.autopia.org/forum/detail...accumulator-s-non-marring-wash-technique.html Every swirl you see on a car is caused by something touching the paint. Usually during the wash process. It's absolutely painful for me to watch the neighbors washing their cars, as I can just picture all the swirls and marring being caused as they go. 99.99% of your car care should be focused on getting your washing technique down to where you are not causing any swirls/marring. A really good rule of thumb is to not touch your paint (at all. with anything.) unless you absolutely have to. And don't *ever* even consider using an automatic carwash unless it is completely touch free. Automatic car washes are the absolute fastest way to screw up your new car's paint. And never, under any circumstances, let your car dealer, mechanic, or anyone else wash your car.



Since your wash process needs to be very gentle (any marring at all is going to be very visible on that black paint), you need to consider using an LSP (Last Step Product.. car wax or sealant) that is going to be very easy to clean; dirt needs to come off of it easily using a very gentle nudge. For the most part, that means sticking with good carnauba based waxes, instead of a synthetic sealant.



You'll also need one that is durable. You'll have to touch your car to apply wax. Since you're trying to reduce the amount of times you touch your car, you want a wax that will last a long time. Collinite Insulator Wax 845 is extremely durable, washes well, and is very cheap. If you would like to try out a synthetic sealant type LSP, I've had very good luck with Ultima Paint Gaurd Plus. It's expensive, but it's also one of the best sealants I've used. It's durable, provides very good environmental protection, and is one of the easiest-to-clean sealants around.



As far as other stuff you're going to need, most of those questions will be answered in the links above. It's gonna take a bit of time to go through all that information, but it is definitely time well spent.
 
I don't.. I haven't detailed any VW newer than an 02, and it's clear wasn't hard. I'm sure someone will chime in on how hard the 08's clear is.
 
+1 on 845, great stuff. if you don't want to polish it all the time you might consider a glaze with some filling properties.
 
captpyro said:
..[what products should I try?]...

Should I use any product under the Insulator Wax 845? What about the Klasse products..
Click to expand...



Welcome to Autopia!



I'd expect your clear to be pretty hard, but the only reason it'd *really* matter is if/when you try to polish out any marring; if it's really hard you'll find this to be pretty difficult, at least if you expect 100% perfection (so, well, don't expect that ;) ).



I *always* recommend 1Z brand polishes for people just starting out. They're effective and incredibly user-friendly. With scads of products from most every maker on my shelves, I still reach for 1Z quite often. I recommend their Paint Polish as I suspect their milder Metallic Polish with Wax will be too mild for your clear. But hey, I'd *really* suggest you buy them both so you have a medium and a very mild polish on hand.



If you think your paint is in great condition, and you want to keep this *very* simple, just get the Metallic Polish with Wax and use it before the Collinite. I'd be hard pressed to think of any product that'd be easier to start out with.



Collinite works great over these 1Z polishes (which leave a little wax behind, so if you're tuckered out after all the polishing you can wait and wax after the next wash).



Sources for 1Z and Collinite: Welcome to Exceldetail.com! or Aloha & Welcome to Our Oasis for All Your Auto Detailing, Auto Detailing Supplies, Auto Detailing Equipment, Auto Detailing Products, & Auto Detailing Accessories for all your Automobile Detailing



The Klasse AIO is a versatile product that's nice to have around, but I dunno if you *really* need it. Their Sealant Glaze (which I do use on one of our vehicles) probably isn't best for you as it's utterly unforgiving of any flaws (they show up whereas a wax like Collinite will hide them a little, as will the 1Z polish) and it's not all *that* user friendly. The Collinite will provide just as much protection anyhow. IMO they oughta just offer a money-back guarantee on the 1Z/Collinite combo, I bet they'd never give back a penny.



But as SuperBee364 has already suggested, the *biggest* thing is to learn how to wash without marring the paint. That's *far* more important than which product(s) you use or anything else. The bottom-line goal really oughta be to not induce any scratches and that's a *LOT* easier said than done.
 
Thanks everyone, there is so much to know and learn.

Question for Accumulator,

If I go with the 1Z polish and Collinite products which pads, mfg and color, should I use with a pc?



capt pyro
 
Accumulator said:
Welcome to Autopia!



I'd expect your clear to be pretty hard, but the only reason it'd *really* matter is if/when you try to polish out any marring; if it's really hard you'll find this to be pretty difficult, at least if you expect 100% perfection (so, well, don't expect that ;) ).



I *always* recommend 1Z brand polishes for people just starting out. They're effective and incredibly user-friendly. With scads of products from most every maker on my shelves, I still reach for 1Z quite often. I recommend their Paint Polish as I suspect their milder Metallic Polish with Wax will be too mild for your clear. But hey, I'd *really* suggest you buy them both so you have a medium and a very mild polish on hand.



If you think your paint is in great condition, and you want to keep this *very* simple, just get the Metallic Polish with Wax and use it before the Collinite. I'd be hard pressed to think of any product that'd be easier to start out with.



Collinite works great over these 1Z polishes (which leave a little wax behind, so if you're tuckered out after all the polishing you can wait and wax after the next wash).



Sources for 1Z and Collinite: Welcome to Exceldetail.com! or Aloha & Welcome to Our Oasis for All Your Auto Detailing, Auto Detailing Supplies, Auto Detailing Equipment, Auto Detailing Products, & Auto Detailing Accessories for all your Automobile Detailing



The Klasse AIO is a versatile product that's nice to have around, but I dunno if you *really* need it. Their Sealant Glaze (which I do use on one of our vehicles) probably isn't best for you as it's utterly unforgiving of any flaws (they show up whereas a wax like Collinite will hide them a little, as will the 1Z polish) and it's not all *that* user friendly. The Collinite will provide just as much protection anyhow. IMO they oughta just offer a money-back guarantee on the 1Z/Collinite combo, I bet they'd never give back a penny.



But as SuperBee364 has already suggested, the *biggest* thing is to learn how to wash without marring the paint. That's *far* more important than which product(s) you use or anything else. The bottom-line goal really oughta be to not induce any scratches and that's a *LOT* easier said than done.
Click to expand...



Amen to that. If everyone used Accumulator's wash technique I wouldn't be able to turn my hobby into a second income.



Even the famous "two bucket technique" isn't good enough to prevent marring on alot of clears. Yucky soap, a bad wash media, rubbing too hard, not rinsing the grit out often enough... there's so many factors to consider to get a washing technique down to zero marring. As you said, it's much easier said than done.



I use a variation of your technique. The main difference being that I BHB the entire car at once after laying down a thick layer of foam. I rinse the BHB often, of course, but I don't have a steady stream of water/soap coming from a foam gun right at the front of the brush as I go. My BHB is sooo gentle that even if it was dipped into straight sand and rubbed on the paint it wouldn't cause marring. The long bristles prevent any real force from being applied as the bristles will just bend. The BHB is so gentle that it is often not capable of exerting enough force on a surface contaminant to dislodge it; I've done washes on my wife's SUV where it was as dirty after I washed it with a BHB as it was before I started washing it. Hence the need for an LSP that readily gives up anything sticking to/in it. The less force required to dislodge (clean), the less risk of marring.



All this is assuming that I'm using a wash media at all. Most of the time I don't. And I've really been cutting back on the ONR washes. I've started to look closely for marring after ONR washes lately, and honestly I haven't been very happy with what I've seen. I am *not* blaming the ONR at all. I know that I'm just doing something wrong. That being the case, I've gone back to my traditional washes that I know are mar free.



I have been pretty happy with ONR washes after a tradtional wash, to remove the stuff that the BHB wasn't able to. No marring at all. I think it's because the vast majority of the bigger contaminants are gone by this point, and only a minor amount of small particles are left to be removed, which are easily handled safely by ONR. This process allows me the safety of my BHB during the traditional wash, yet also allows me to safely get the stuff off that the BHB wasn't capable of getting.
 
captpyro said:
Hi everyone!

I am new to this board and I am getting educated as I read everything!

I just picked up a 08 VW Passat Lux with Deep Black Paint and want to start off on the right foot with proper paint protection for years to come. Also I have just purchase a pc 7424 for this car.



My questions to all of you are:



Does this car have the hard clear coat finish?

What are the best products out there for this color/finish?

Are these products easy to work with?



Thanks in advance for your knowledge and help



Captpyro
Click to expand...



Okay, so you got the new car fever - better treat it right away or it'll get serious!



I was where you are a couple of years ago after I bought a ride following several lease deals. The best advice I might offer is to learn as much as you can here (and elsewhere) about auto detailing. Learn the best way to wash the car, then learn about claying, polishing and LSP applications.



Most of all, stay on top of keeping that new car new - you can save tons of time and effort if you do routine maintenance rather than clean a rat hole once a month. There are some pretty good schedules available that suggest routine things to do weekly, monthly, quarterly etc. Okay, so maybe you don't need a checklist, but it IS easier to detail a well kept ride than one that's beat on. Get a spill inside or a bird bomb outside - deal right away as waiting is almost always BAD.



Realize that there are thousands of really good car care products out there. Some folks here will share some knowledge of products they've used and liked or disliked, but nobody could afford to try them all and objectively evaluate them against each other - some will even ignore the manf directions, inventing their own method, then blame the product for failure - so take it all with a grain of salt - you will have to try some and form your own opinions (read the labels!).



Don't be afraid to try some 'new things'. In my mid 50's, I was a bit old(er) school so for example, when I first heard of [ONR] Optimum No Rinse (wash 'n shine) I was really skeptical - but this stuff is really something! And there are other products as well that can make the 'chore' of keeping that new car new much easier.



Last, although there are soooo many products marketed for the car care enthusiast, don't abandon all common sense. For instance, I already had a Bissel Proheat 2x carpet/upholstery cleaner for the house that works excellent for the cars as well. Just as my shop vac does. Some things are a must and you may pay extra - others are already in the cupboard if you don't exclude them because they don't say 'auto' on them.



Oh yea, and did I read you bought BLACK. Almost nothing looks better than a well polished black ride - keeping it that way is real magic. Don't kill yourself trying - accept that it's gonna look dusty an hour after you detail. Wash routinely the correct way, but don't go nuts. Get a therapist now...<hehe>
 
To add to what abbeysdad just wrote...Better get a second job as well to pay for the obsession.



Wait, I meant a third job...You just bought your second job (Black). Welcome.
 
captpyro, if you can, go for the Flex DA over the PC. The Flex DA has much more power to correct paint defects than a PC does, but it's still much safer than a rotary.



If you're going to go with a PC, I'd recommend the following pads:



2 Lake Country 4" Black CCS pads

2 Lake Country 4" White CCS pads

2 Lake Crountry 4" Orange CCS pads.



You'll use the orange pads to correct the paint (remove swirls and defects), the white for polishing out any remainiing marks from the correction step, and the black as your final polishing step to max out the gloss.



If you go with a flex, you won't be able to use pads that small. I'm not positive, but I think that the smallest pads you can use with a flex are 6.5".
 
captpyro said:
If I go with the 1Z polish and Collinite products which pads, mfg and color, should I use with a pc? ..[And what're BHBs and ONR?]...
Click to expand...



In case you didn't find them already, BHB= Boar's Hair Brush (get from Griot's or AutoGeek, others did not test well IME); ONR= Optimum No Rinse wash, which some people have good results with (myself *not* included).





Expanding on/rehashing some of SuperBee364's pad suggestions- Lake Country Pads for 1Z Consumer Line Polishes (I dunno from all the differnet pads on the market these days :o ):



Ultra/Extra Polish- Yellow Cutting or Orange Light Cutting (get the 4" size with an apporpriate backing plate). Use for aggressive work.



Paint Polish- Orange Light Cutting or White Polishing. If you use the Orange, follow up with the White. Again, I recommend 4" pads but others do OK with larger ones.



Metallic Polish with Wax- White Polishing or, for *VERY* gentle work (as in, nearly functionally nonabrasive) Black/Gray Finishing. For this, larger pads are OK but don't expect the Metallic Polish to take out much marring, it's too gentle.



Collinite- I generally prefer White Polishing pads (functionally nonabrasive on harder paints) but some people prefer the Black/Gray finishing pads. Again, larger pads are OK if you prefer them. Or just do the waxing by hand.



There are lots of good pad choices; use the Cutting/Polishing/Finishing categories of whatever brand with the polishes as listed above and you should be OK.



BUT- as implied by SuperBee364, the *ONLY* way I can do efficient *or* effective correction on harder paints with the PC is by using the 4" pads. E.g., a 6.5" cutting pad simply doesn't work worth anything for me. For less aggressive polishing, they might be OK, but there's a world of difference in how the PC behaves with the different size pads.





But for correction
 
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