Water Spots 1, PC & Me 0

K

kdlp

New member
Did my first bit of machine polishing and all went well except for the water spots.... I was able to eliminate many scratches, and over all the project turned out well, but the one thing the PC and 105/205 couldn't seem to eliminate were what appeared to be water spots. Generally the vertical surfaces came out fine.... but the hood and roof.... not so much.



The gear I was using: PC, 4" LC Medium (tangerine colored) Cut and Light (light blue) cut, Meguire's 105/205.



The technique: The car is an old Subaru (2000) and was washed, dried and clay barred. I then worked 18" by 18" sections with the LC Medium Cut 4" pad with the 105. The PC was running at speed setting 5. I over lapped by half the pad width and applied enough pressure to keep the pad spinning at a good pace. When I saw I wasn't getting great results I really slowed down (1" per second or so) and made sure I had fresh product on the pad. I also followed that up with 205 on the light cut pad.



The result: As noted before, I got great scratch removal results, but if you catch the right angle to a flourescent light you can see what appear to be water spots. By the way, I live in an area (Alaska) where there is no acid rain.



So what should I try? High cut pads? More pressure? More speed? Moving even slower? ....all of the above?



Any advise greatly appreciated.



kdlp
 
PhatHoodDetail said:
try a chemical polish like pinnacle paintwork cleansor
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After using M105, 4-in pad, etc? Those spots are etched - more paint removal is needed if it can be safely done without thinning the paint. It may be from some other chemical fallout -- just not water. For example, if you just happened to be behind a truck hauling some nasty leaky stuff.
 
IMO those "water spot" kind of areas are generally bird poop etches that have been there a long time. You shine 'em up good with a polish, but you can still see them at the right angle. As Bunky said, you may be able to take them out if you have enough paint.
 
Unless I'm mistaken, the tangerine and light blue pads are the LC Hydrotechs. If that's the case, the blue is the heavier cutting pad of the two. Maybe try again w/105 on the blue (Cyan) pad?
 
mikenap said:
Unless I'm mistaken, the tangerine and light blue pads are the LC Hydrotechs. If that's the case, the blue is the heavier cutting pad of the two. Maybe try again w/105 on the blue (Cyan) pad?
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I am leaning towards etching as well. His technique sounds great, and the 105 should have destroyed the water spots. Heck my UC destroys water spots faster than it takes out swirling.
 
Noting that I did pretty much (not completely) remove such etching on my Yukon via PC/4" even after it resisted ebpcivicsi's efforts with a rotary/twisted wool/Diamond Cut (!)...IMO it's unwise for most people to take off that much clear. Ever plan to repolishg those areas? And Subie clear isn't all that thick.



Oh, and I can't help but think that 18" x 18" is a lot bigger area than *I* work with M105/PC/4". Not that everybody oughta do as I do or anything...
 
mikenap said:
Unless I'm mistaken, the tangerine and light blue pads are the LC Hydrotechs. If that's the case, the blue is the heavier cutting pad of the two. Maybe try again w/105 on the blue (Cyan) pad?
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Mike - You are exactly right, they are Hydrotechs.... I used the pads back-asswards, I should have probably used the Blue pad with the 105.



kdlp
 
kdlp said:
Mike - You are exactly right, they are Hydrotechs.... I used the pads back-asswards, I should have probably used the Blue pad with the 105.



kdlp
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Heh heh, ah...I skimmed right past that :o



Still, don't go nuts and overthin the clear.
 
Accumulator said:
Noting that I did pretty much (not completely) remove such etching on my Yukon via PC/4" even after it resisted ebpcivicsi's efforts with a rotary/twisted wool/Diamond Cut (!)...IMO it's unwise for most people to take off that much clear. Ever plan to repolishg those areas? And Subie clear isn't all that thick.



Oh, and I can't help but think that 18" x 18" is a lot bigger area than *I* work with M105/PC/4". Not that everybody oughta do as I do or anything...
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Accumulator - You're a LOT more experienced (and brave) than I am with the twisted wool/Diamond cut.... I have some buddies at a nearby body shop that do that with a rotary and let's just say that I ain't that brave.... Oh, and after I realized that I had those "water spots" I did rework an area that was about a half square foot, very slowly, but didn't really see any significant improvement.



This car is a family car and basically this was all an experiment to learn the gear and secret sauces. I'll certainly revisit the hood (not concerned with the top as it's full of roof racks, etc. anyway) with the blue pads and 105... apparently no one thinks a more aggressive pad would help?



kdlp
 
kdlp said:
Accumulator - You're a LOT more experienced (and brave) than I am with the twisted wool/Diamond cut....
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Actually, it was ebpcivicsi who did that part of it (long story why he was working on it...), I woulda used a different wool and 3M Extra Cut (which is probably even riskier), but I hate using my rotaries. Just clarifying...



.... Oh, and after I realized that I had those "water spots" I did rework an area that was about a half square foot, very slowly, but didn't really see any significant improvement.
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Might oughta leave well enough alone.



This car is a family car and basically this was all an experiment to learn the gear and secret sauces. I'll certainly revisit the hood (not concerned with the top as it's full of roof racks, etc. anyway) with the blue pads and 105... apparently no one thinks a more aggressive pad would help?
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A more aggressive pad would cut more, but (yeah, yeah, I'm a broken record!) I dunno if that'd be a good idea. Options (listed, generally, more-to-less aggressive) include: SurBuf pads (no way I'd recommend you try that), Meguiar's burgundy cutting pad (if you can find it in 4"), Cyclotoolmakers/Edge 4" Yellow and/or Blue wool, LC PFW.
 
kdlp said:
This car is a family car and basically this was all an experiment to learn the gear and secret sauces. I'll certainly revisit the hood (not concerned with the top as it's full of roof racks, etc. anyway) with the blue pads and 105... apparently no one thinks a more aggressive pad would help?



kdlp
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If you're lucky enough to have an experimental vehicle, then go for it. But like many people have said, if its not coming off with 105, it's probably not coming off. Hell you could probably get water spots off with a finishing pad and 105. Can you post pictures of what you are calling water spots? It's most likely etching that has eaten its way too far below the surface to remove safely. Unless your PH is like 13, theres no way you should be getting water spots this stubborn. Your technique sounds great, if they were water spots they should have come off.
 
ThrillHo said:
Can you post pictures of what you are calling water spots? It's most likely etching that has eaten its way too far below the surface to remove safely. Unless your PH is like 13, theres no way you should be getting water spots this stubborn.
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Getting pics will be difficult as it's a daily driver and it has to be clean and in great light to see the defects. (I may get an opportunity in a couple of weekends, possibly sooner if the weather dries up.)



I should maybe explain a bit about the environment this car lives in... It resides in a rain forest... not the typical tropical type but an area where it rains (in some fashion) 23 days out of 30 and the temperature rarely exceeds 65 degrees. The car is never garaged except when I'm messing around with compounds/waxes, etc. There are no air-borne contaminants of a chemical type, but we do get one hell of a spruce pollen (like yellow dust, but a bit sticky) dusting during Spring.



The car was largely ignored in terms of washing/waxing, maintenance of a cosmetic order. It gets washed maybe once/twice a year and waxed less. When I clay barred it I spent more time folding over the clay bar than dragging the car.



In a couple of weekends I may go back and blue pad/105 - 205 the hood again. The rest of the car cleaned up remarkably well considering how little attention it gets.



My thanks for those who have offered advise and suggestions. For now, I'm on the low end of the learning curve so I do appreciate it. I was amazed at how effective the 105/205 combo was at getting out scratches. There had to have been 30 or 40 key scratches around the door lock that simply disappeared.



kdlp
 
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