Problems with PC, PB SSR2.5, SSR1

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carguy5598

New member
I was polishing a Tectite Grey MB with moderate swirl marks today. I first washed with dawn, claybared with Sonus (with dawn as a lubricant), and then washed again with dawn. I dried with the costco microfiber towels and then used a Sonus Orange pad with PB SSR2.5. I spread the product with the PC set at 2 and then for the final two passes pushed it up to 6. I did the hood, each panel on the door, 1/4 panels, roof, trunk etc. I removed all the product in one shot after finishing the last panel with a fresh microfiber towel. Then using the green pad same application technique I applied PB SSR1. I finished with 2 coasts of Zaino Z-2 Pro + ZFX using the Sonus blue pad (PC at 3) with a Z6 cleaning in between. Im not overly impressed with the PB products (but Im assuming I didn't use the proper technique). Most of the swirls were not removed. The zaino did add a nice glossy shine to the car. I would appreciate some pointers before I start on a Maserati and finally end up doing my own vehicle a silver BMW. Again any help would be appreciated! Thanks in advance!
 
Depending on condition, multiple passes with a product like SSR2.5 may be required. Have you successfully removed similar swirls before? So this was just a problem with the SSR's? Or was this your first try at swirl removal?
 
This was my first shot with a polish other than meguairs hand polish. I recently purchased a PC with the intent of doing all the family cars. My mom takes her car to automated washes and as such has man swirls on her paint. I hand wash the other cars so there are no swirls. My dad recently acquired a Maserati which was delivered with some nice dealership swirls =P
 
Yeah, I would suggest experimenting in one are before doing the entire car and applying a last step product then stepping back to find you are not satisfied. Seems like colossal waste of time to me. When I apply 2.5 I start at about speed 4 - 5 on the PC. I think if you research it you will find that anything slower is not aggressive enough. Also, a car with mutliple exposures to tunnel washes will probably require multiple passes and an aggressive pad just as Setec has stated. I use a yellow Propel pad with 2.5 to remove the swirls on my truck. How old are your other cars that have no swirls? Inspect in direct sun to insure that there really are "no swirls".
 
Also make sure your pace with the PC is slow. This was the same experience that I had my first time trying to remove swirls with a PC. I had seen rotary use in the past and rotary's move at a moderatly quick pace...with PC you want to just crawl across the surface..I can't describe it correctly but work SLOW...and work back and forth a few times on 6 at this pace and you'll be as effective as possible.
 
The first few times I used a PC, I was frustrated as well. I thought just going through the motions would remove the swirls. Not the case. You have to inspect each area before moving on. Eventually, your technique will improve as you learn what works and what does not. I find that when I first start on a new / different car, I end up having to go back over a lot. Halfway through the car, I get the hang of how much product / speed / pressure to get most of it on one pass with a couple touch ups.
 
AudiOn19s said:
Also make sure your pace with the PC is slow. This was the same experience that I had my first time trying to remove swirls with a PC. I had seen rotary use in the past and rotary's move at a moderatly quick pace...with PC you want to just crawl across the surface..I can't describe it correctly but work SLOW...and work back and forth a few times on 6 at this pace and you'll be as effective as possible.
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Precisely, I cant stress that fact enough. Its not necessarily the pad or product, just your speed.. By the way, it was porbably PB's that brought that glossy shine to the Benz, not the Zaino.
 
Correct one area to perfection using a progression of polishes from higher abrasive to lower (2.5-1.0). You might also consider using a final polish like Z-PC Fusion or Menzerna PO85RD to extract that last little bit of gloss and smoothness.

Work the PC. This is just an automated hand buffing/polishing tool. The pad and polish progression selection are doing the "work". Vary the PC pressure as the polish breaks down. Work the polish until most of it is gone and the surface correction becomes apparent. Keep a mental or written log on your progression sequence to perfection. Repeat this protocol and do remainder of vehicle.

If the LSP is a "major" contributor to the final gloss, the paint has not been Prepped to perfection prior to its application.



One Dawn wash is sufficient. This should be performed after using the PB polishes. Your initial cleaning prior to polishing can be done with a normal auto shampoo.



Be patient. Learning to get the most from a PC and learning its limitations takes time, practice and most of all patience.

Enjoy the learning curve of polishing and do not get frustrated. In time your vehicle will make you :drool: with a good prep and Zaino as the LSP. :dance
 
Also if it was a newer MB thier harder clearcoat may have been keeping you from obtaining the results you were looking for. One pass with a PC is usually not enough if the swirls are bad enough.
 
a.k.a. Patrick said:
Precisely, I cant stress that fact enough. Its not necessarily the pad or product, just your speed.
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Agreed. Let the PC do the work, not your arms. When spreading out product, I set the speed on 5 and I move the PC 4-6 inches per second. To break down polishes, I crank it up to 6 and slow down to maybe 1 inch per second which clears the polish out and breaks down the diminishing abrasives.



A real good indicator that you are not working a polish long enough (or using too much) is any difficulty in removing it.
 
Thanks for the help guys. We did a friends black 330i today. His car was riddled with swirls and scratches (automated washes).



Due to time restrictions the process was simplified a bit. The car was powerwashed using a 40 degree fan. Washed with dawn, claybared (Sonus), washed (dawn), PBSSR2.5 on flat panels with ornage pad, PBSSR1 on every panel, Z-6, Z-2 + ZFX, Z-6, Z-2 + ZFX.



Again not entirely impressed with the removal of swirls (my friend did his own car, and I told him to go very slowly). I did the trunk myself and although many swirls were removed with SSR2.5, when the final coat of Zaino was applied I guess either some swirls were highlighted or new swirls appeared.



In any event the panels (roof, trunk, hood) that we used 2.5 in addition to PB 1 had a much better shine (ignoring swirls). From a distance it looked like a high quality mirror. The side panels had a nice shine as well but nothing comparable to the panels that had a prior coat of 2.5.



Now I guess he didn't go slow enough over the panels.



Also the backing to the orange pad ripped off (after two uses) this isn't normal is it?

The Sonus backing plate got hot to the point where the velcro started to peel a little from the backing plate.

Lastly whats the best method to clean the pads since I start my car tomorrow and don't want to use "dirty" pads.
 
Also the backing to the orange pad ripped off (after two uses) this isn't normal is it?

The Sonus backing plate got hot to the point where the velcro started to peel a little from the backing plate.
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No its not normal. It can happen for several reasons, from pad defect to applying too much pressure at high speed. It sounds like the latter, since your backing plate got hot as well. You need to apply just enough pressure to hear the PC labour slightly, then back off a touch. The pad shouldn't distort excessively and ensure its centred properly.



For that reason, when I use the Sonus orange, I only take it to 5 with a touch less pressure due the stiffness of that pad. Its a strange pad that requires a slightly different technique to the other Sonus and LC pads. When used properly it leaves a great finish considering the aggressiveness of the pad.





Lastly whats the best method to clean the pads since I start my car tomorrow and don't want to use "dirty" pads.
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I use some dish soap in a bucket of warm water, let soak for 30 min, massage the pad until all the polish is gone, gentle spin on the PC in a bucket, let air dry. :xyxthumbs
 
Another option is Optimum Polish with a burgandy Meguiars pad (you may get some marring on softer paints) then follow with the same polish and the yellow Meguiars pad (or your favorite cutting then polishing pads). The new Detailer's Pride Super Swirl Eliminator and a burgandy Meguiars pad works well too but you will get some dusting.
 
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