Post polishing wipedown, alternatives to IPA?

I

imported_RedlineIRL

New member
What have you all found to be the best option to use after polishing to make 100% sure that all polishing residdual oiils and lubricants are left, and that only the true fnish is being revealed? I know IPA is probably the most poular method, but I have found that sometimes that even few IPAs still doesn't get all the filling out. Plus I kind of want to get away from it since I have read that I could cause some fnishes to swell, thus not reveal the true surface and more imporatnly make it less dense and succeptable to being dammaged from polishing.



I know that there are a few citrus based products out there, such as the Pre Wax Cleanser from Griots, and supposedly Optimum Powerclean can be used if dilluted properly. Have any of you all used mineral spirits or PrepSol, if so how safe and effective are these to use for final inspecting? Or are these too harsh of a product to use?



Do you all have any reccomendations for anything that can be used and is readily available locally?
 
I use Valugard New Car Prep for this purpose. Since we're talking solvents, everything I've read about Prep-Sol, 3m Tar remover, etc indicates they're okay. We're applying, little sit for a little while at most, and then wiping off, nothing damaging. My understanding also is that these products designed for use on paint don't contain ingredients harmful to it.
 
I use Menzerna Top Inspection. It strips any fillers, and doesn't marr the paint when used with a good quality microfiber.
 
IPA will not damage a quality paint finish, either OEM or refinish.

Simple, and if you look at what is in the solvent systems used today, IPA in one form or another is present.

It is compatible, it will not damage a quality finish.

Bill menitoned using the New Car Prep, which the same non-damaging system is used.

However, it may leave a small "petro" based residue, and therefore after I used it to remove residue, always followed with a light wipe of IPA to insure complete removal of any opitical petrocarbon residue.

Grumpy
 
I'll be sure to always do the IPA wipe down after the initial NCP/ solvent wipe down. Thanks Ron!
 
Some will "swell" the paint substrate, no doubt.

Usually clorinated versions.

Butly cellosolve components used in many all purpose cleaners may create minor swelling as well.(I could spend a lot of time posting some serious concerns created by butly based all purposes and synthetic transit coating removers did to thousands of new vehicles that never got out of the assembly plants storage yards.)

Rule of thumb, if it "swells" the paint, it is attacking the chemical bond of the paint film, which usually means one may observe some damage later in the life of the paint system.

Lacquer thinner, xylene, toulene, acetone, MEK, etc are examples of solvents that may not show any adverse effects immediately after being used on a modern clearcoat system, however history has shown that at sometime in the future, the damage will become apparent.

When I was teaching the PrepExcellence detailing course at AI, students often questioned the same thing which enthusist ask,"why can't I use lacquer thinner, PrepSol, etc when I detail, after all the bodyshops use it?"

Why not, well a bodyshop is using these to remove any silicone residue, etc and are going to sand, prime and repaint the vehicle, so no concern.

Not true for the home or "professional" detailer, they are not refinishing the vehicle.

So, a few weeks or months or even a year or two passes and they can't understand why some area's of the clear is going away.

They did it, they just took the easy way and were not educated on what damage clorinated solvent blends may do to these modern paint systems.

Grumpy

Grumpy
 
Sounds to me that there are a lot less truly *safe* solvents out there than we may think. I'm guessing if one only has IPA and nothing else, repeated wipe downs with it might be the closest thing to being able to remove all of the LSP and even at that, that probably won't get rid of all of it. In that case, you would just have to move ahead and start the polishing step.
 
If a quality paint job, cured out correctly, IPA,even used undiluted, will not damage the paint system.

The variable on removal is what is "in" the compound/polish, etc used.

Hit it fresh after buffing, IPA with one or two applications will remove the residue in 99% if cases,

Grumpy
 
Not sure about that. I found that it was best to have all testing that I did, redone by the vehicle manufacturers labs and the paint vendor to insure the correct findings.

Grumpy
 
The ratio used and the amount of dwell time are likely the critical factors. It sounds to me that there is a need for a wider selection of completely safe polish residue/LSP removing products. You'd think they'd be as commonplace as QDs, huh?
 
Ron Ketcham said:
If a quality paint job, cured out correctly, IPA,even used undiluted, will not damage the paint system.

The variable on removal is what is "in" the compound/polish, etc used.

Hit it fresh after buffing, IPA with one or two applications will remove the residue in 99% if cases,

Grumpy
Click to expand...

What % IPA do you reccomend then and at what dillution ratio? With some polishes I have used before a few wipes of IPA didn't get all of the residues out, so that's why I was looking into something that may be more effective. Is it better to spray or wipe the IPA onto the surface and allow it to evaporate instead of wiping it, or will the evaporation just allow the residual oils to puddle across?



So you're saying that PrepSol isn't really all that safe nor a good idea to use then? What about glass cleaner?
 
Heat + solvent also contributes to paint swelling



[Fresh paint is still full of escaping solvents. Buffing heats up paint. Solvents, resins, and other ingredients in paint swell when you heat them up (You know the whole liquid/gas thing that helps bombs work…I’m not a chemist, but I know something is working there.) By measuring this same paint daily for 3 months, you will see that paint thickness has a life of its own.] Jason Rose



(See also “A new perspective on paint defect return” – by Jason Rose, Autopia.org)



Kinetic friction (heat) is transferred to a solvent (IPA or fresh paint) causing it to both expand (Charles' law (also known as the law of volumes) the paint film and soften it.



Post polishing wipedown, alternatives to IPA?



Up to now the most common wipe down solution has been 90% isopropyl alcohol diluted with distilled water at a 1:10 dilution. Depending on the manufacturer’s requirements the oils used in polishes for surface lubrication can be various grades, the denser the oil the harder they are to remove with a solvent-based wipedown. Isopropyl alcohol (IPA) primarily encapsulates the oils, but once the alcohol evaporates the heavier oils may resettle on the surface.



As an alternative a 1:10 solution of a Limonene (citrus-based) cleaning solvent (Wurth Citrus Degreaser or P21S Total Auto Wash) and distilled water. This multi-purpose, citrus base, concentrated degreaser emulsifies grease and oil without harsh acids or alkalis, enabling their removal, their 100% biodegradable formula out performs hazardous solvent degreasers. Both products can be diluted with distilled water to the desired strength





http://www.autopia.org/forum/guide-detailing/136477-wipedown-wipe-down-process.html#post1447598
 
What about Hi-Temp's Prep Wash? Safe long-term?



I've been using this product after polishing. It seems to do a good job of removing polishing oils.
 
From everything I've ever read, the Hi Temp Prep Wash is okay. Removing polishing oils and residue seems fairly uncomplicated, but what I'm wondering is when it comes to LSPs, are the products typically used on the market to do that are effective and totally okay? It seems to me that there are only very few that truly are.
 
Guess most people here already know my take on this, but here goes anyhow, for the umpteenth time:



I absolutely*LOVE* the PrepWash for removing polishing oils, much more effective IME than IPA. When multiple (and I don't mean just four or five) tries with IAP couldn't get those [expletive]ing M205 oils out of the M3's Byzanz Metallic or the Yukon's Carbon Metallic (what's with those two paints in this regard?!? They retained oils like I couln't believe!), the Prep Wash did the trick, though even that took two or three tries.
 
Any drug store IPA, 70%, 90% whatever.

Mix 50/50 spray, pour, wipe, just get the surface wet and keep it wet with the solution for a minute or longer.

Don't let it dry, if it does you just wasted time and product. Got to wipe it off while the oils are still in suspension.

Wipe off with a clean, soft cloth.

The use of glass cleaner depends on what the formula is. Many contain a butyl content, which is one of the main contributors to streaking, plus the butyl is not really all the great for paint.

Grumpy
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top