PoorBoys Slick Car Wash & Wheel Cleaner

Anthony Orosco said:
Redondo First, Hello:) Second, I would never intentionally mislead anyone on a product I tried out.



If anything I am at fault for not clarifying the "non-acid" based statement.



This is NOT a "hydroflouric acid" based product. Since I do this as a profession I wrongly assumed that when I mentioned "non-acid" others would understand what I meant.



The "acid" used is not on the same corrosive level as a hydroflouric BUT caution should still be used when handling the product.



Lastly, Steve himself informed me that it is a water based product as it can be cut with water. It is a new "acid" (which does have a PH of 4, as noted already- Hydroflouric has a PH of 0) that Steve is working with and he would not go any further than that, which I don't blame him.



I apologize for any information that may of come across as "misleading".



Thank you,

Anthony
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Anthony,



Nice review, and excellent clarification. I for one certainly don't think you attempted to mislead anybody, and I also don't think there is anything wrong with reviewing a product in the development stages. It probably would have been nicer if someone would have questioned your findings a little differently. :rolleyes:
 
John Styrnol said:
All that said, can the Wheel Cleaner be used 3-4 times a month? When the wheels are not that dirty.
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John,



I've also tested the Poorboys wheel cleaner. It is definitely a professional product that you only want to use as necessary. I would recommend washing your wheels with regular car wash soap 3 or 4 times a month, and save the strong wheel cleaners for use only when required.
 
Ok...since I'm the guy who brought up the acid vs. non-acid...I don't know what the pH of hydrofluoric acid is, but it's not 0. The problem with HF is that it does not give you a "normal" acid burn. It penetrates the skin and seeks out calcium (your bones) to neutralize itself. If you spill it on yourself, you may not realize it has happened for some time (like the next day), meanwhile, it is attacking your body. That being said, if it was nerve gas-dangerous, you couldn't buy it, and I'm not sure that wheel cleaners really have HF in them, but related compounds.



If you register with Meguiar's, you can look at the MSDS's for their wheel cleaners; they have one (Gold Class Instant Wheel Cleaner) that has Ammonium Bifluoride in it, that's not HF, but a fluorine compound. Fluorine is one of the most reactive elements.



Anyway, Meguiar's makes 4 different classes of wheel cleaners (I mention Meg's because they make it easy to see this by looking at the MSDS's), the one with the Ammonium Bifluoride, an acetic and oxalic acid one, a citric acid one, and a pH balanced one (that was in order from presumed most aggressive to least aggressive). There are also caustic (alkaline) wheel cleaners like EO A2Z.



My point? Only that most wheel cleaners out there are acid or caustic, very few are neutral, because those don't work very well. The neutral ones are fine, as Bill D mentioned, if your wheels are well maintained, and you don't mind agitation. I would hate to be detailing for money, and have to clean a wheel that has never been cleaned before (and is 5 years old), without some sort of aggressive wheel cleaner.



None of these is going to kill you, otherwise they wouldn't be allowed to sell it to consumers. Following the Autopian rule of least aggressive product first, the fluoride-based wheel cleaners would seem to be the last resort. Anyway, we just need to be informed about these products before we put them on our nice wheels or our nice skin (or lungs).



PS Many household cleaners have some pretty nasty acids in them; phosphoric acid is used in bathroom cleaners...as well as in cola...



PPS Sorry for the ramble...
 
John Styrnol said:
All that said, can the Wheel Cleaner be used 3-4 times a month? When the wheels are not that dirty.
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Hi John,



From what Steve tells me it can be used at least once a week on your wheels although personally I believe that may be overkill, meaning waste of product.



I would guess that every other week for the average driver is good and for the weeks in between just soap and water should suffice, but then again each driver/car is different.



dternst - I am not sure of the price as this was a sample sent to me. Steve is not sure if this will be a product sold to the general public.





White F150 - Thanks for the good words:) Glad you enjoyed the review.



Take care all,

Anthony
 
Anthony Orosco said:
From what Steve tells me it can be used at least once a week on your wheels although personally I believe that may be overkill, meaning waste of product.



I would guess that every other week for the average driver is good and for the weeks in between just soap and water should suffice, but then again each driver/car is different.



[/B]
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Thanks for the earlier clarification and this one too Anthony. I don't drive a whole lot at the moment...under 1000 miles a month...so I do mine every 3 or 4 weeks and they are easy. Someone that drives a lot in heavy traffic will need much more frequent cleaning.
 
Anthony Orosco said:
Redondo First, Hello:) Second, I would never intentionally mislead anyone on a product I tried out.



If anything I am at fault for not clarifying the "non-acid" based statement.



This is NOT a "hydroflouric acid" based product. Since I do this as a profession I wrongly assumed that when I mentioned "non-acid" others would understand what I meant.



The "acid" used is not on the same corrosive level as a hydroflouric BUT caution should still be used when handling the product.



Lastly, Steve himself informed me that it is a water based product as it can be cut with water. It is a new "acid" (which does have a PH of 4, as noted already- Hydroflouric has a PH of 0) that Steve is working with and he would not go any further than that, which I don't blame him.



I apologize for any information that may of come across as "misleading".



Thank you,

Anthony
Click to expand...



Thanks for clarifying your position Anthony.



I'm not sure I buy into the "new acid" thing claimed by Steve, but I do appreciate you setting the record straight in the way you have and I do believe PB Steve when he says that his product contains no Hydroflouric, Sulfuric or Boric acids. Maybe now we can give a few tips to the many non-professionals who will read this thread and wonder how they can use this product safely, both in terms of not damaging their rims and in safeguarding their own health.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
Ok...since I'm the guy who brought up the acid vs. non-acid...I don't know what the pH of hydrofluoric acid is, but it's not 0. The problem with HF is that it does not give you a "normal" acid burn. It penetrates the skin and seeks out calcium (your bones) to neutralize itself. If you spill it on yourself, you may not realize it has happened for some time (like the next day), meanwhile, it is attacking your body. That being said, if it was nerve gas-dangerous, you couldn't buy it, and I'm not sure that wheel cleaners really have HF in them, but related compounds.



If you register with Meguiar's, you can look at the MSDS's for their wheel cleaners; they have one (Gold Class Instant Wheel Cleaner) that has Ammonium Bifluoride in it, that's not HF, but a fluorine compound. Fluorine is one of the most reactive elements.



Anyway, Meguiar's makes 4 different classes of wheel cleaners (I mention Meg's because they make it easy to see this by looking at the MSDS's), the one with the Ammonium Bifluoride, an acetic and oxalic acid one, a citric acid one, and a pH balanced one (that was in order from presumed most aggressive to least aggressive). There are also caustic (alkaline) wheel cleaners like EO A2Z.



My point? Only that most wheel cleaners out there are acid or caustic, very few are neutral, because those don't work very well. The neutral ones are fine, as Bill D mentioned, if your wheels are well maintained, and you don't mind agitation. I would hate to be detailing for money, and have to clean a wheel that has never been cleaned before (and is 5 years old), without some sort of aggressive wheel cleaner.



None of these is going to kill you, otherwise they wouldn't be allowed to sell it to consumers. Following the Autopian rule of least aggressive product first, the fluoride-based wheel cleaners would seem to be the last resort. Anyway, we just need to be informed about these products before we put them on our nice wheels or our nice skin (or lungs).



PS Many household cleaners have some pretty nasty acids in them; phosphoric acid is used in bathroom cleaners...as well as in cola...



PPS Sorry for the ramble...
Click to expand...



Nice post Mike, very informative as usual!
 
RedondoV6 said:
Thanks for clarifying your position Anthony.



I'm not sure I buy into the "new acid" thing claimed by Steve, but I do appreciate you setting the record straight in the way you have and I do believe PB Steve when he says that his product contains no Hydroflouric, Sulfuric or Boric acids. Maybe now we can give a few tips to the many non-professionals who will read this thread and wonder how they can use this product safely, both in terms of not damaging their rims and in safeguarding their own health.
Click to expand...



Maybe the "new" acid is citric acid (from citrus fruit), which I guess is pretty safe as acids go. Meguiar's says their Gold Class All Wheel Cleaner "contains no strong acids" (emphasis mine), because it contains citric acid (I think that wording is kind of misleading and makes you think that it has NO acid). All of these products can be used safely, with the proper care and protective gear. I personally prefer to not have the really harsh products around; one less thing to worry about.



Anthony, thanks for providing that chemical safety link.
 
I've been using #36 with good results. It's about out so was looking for something new, well I do have some A2Z as well, but still was looking for something else.
 
John Styrnol said:
I've been using #36 with good results. It's about out so was looking for something new, well I do have some A2Z as well, but still was looking for something else.
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I've always used the P21S, which I guess is in the same class as the #36 (detergent only). Part of the reason I was so well versed in the chemical makeup of the wheel cleaners is that I was reasearching it to find something a little stronger to get some stubborn brake dust off of my mother's honeycomb wheels. I think I'll go with that Gold Class All-Wheel or the A2Z. I'll stick to the P21S on my wheels because they are painted body color.
 
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