Please help me quickly, trying to remove water marks

I

imported_RedlineIRL

New member
I am trying to get some water marks that are covered on the hood of my car right now that I noticed after washing it. The car did have some gravel dust and dirt on it, and the weather has been kind of on and off storm chances for a little while, so I didn't bother washing it. The other night it must have rained some overnight, but dried on the next morning. It has been in the high 90s for a while too, imagine that didn't help. Fast forward a few days today, and that's when I noticed. They are not solid white stain marks, but kind of faint white on the out edges of the water etch spts.



I'm not a professional detailer, just a guy who likes to keep his cars looking the best he can, so I don't have a huge selection of products and tools. I have already tried using Poorboys Polish with Carnuba (I have always had good luck with it in the past, but this isn't working) and Pinnacle Paintwork Cleanser. Neither worked. I tried some old Meguiars Scratch X v1 that I had in a small section, and it did work at taking about 1/2 to 3/4 out. Now I have to remove some of the marring left from it.:mad: I do have a PC 7424, but to be honest I am not really the best at using it, and haven't really used it in a while.



Here is a list of the stuff that I have to work with



PC 7424

LC CCS Pads (orange, white, gray, red, blue)

Danase Swirl abolisher I and II (The only machine polishes I have):sadpace:



I went out and bought some Scratch X 2.0 and some 3M rubbing compund liquid that comes in a black bottle to use if needed. I know everyone says use the least agressive method first, so where should I go from here? Should I use a MF or foam hand applicator for these? Are these more agressive than the Danase swirl abolishers?



Yeah, I know, not the greatest products at all at the moment, but it's all I have access to.





I am so frustrated right now pacing back and forth and trying out howto get this off tonight if I can. What do you guys suggest trying next? If I have to go with the Danase Polishes, which polish and pad combo should I use? The car that I am working on is a Saturn Ion



Anything you all can do to help me is really appreciated
 
First of all, calm down and stop pacing! If you were somewhere where they had ScratchX 2.0, they probably had Ultimate Compound and SwirlX, which are kind of the consumer versions of 105/205, so that would probably be a great combo for you. I really am not familiar with the Danase Swirl Abolishers, but I'll take a wild guess that the I is the finishing polish and the II is the medium cut--why don't you give the II a shot on an orange pad, and see if that takes the spots out? Then use the I with a white pad to finish. If you really want to go to down then use the I again or the PwC on a gray, red or blue pad.
 
*EDIT* lol nm he answered first =]





There was a guy who had a similar problem (I'm no pro so you'd wanna look it up) and what I think he did was get a compound and then cleaned, polished, cleaned, then seal, lsp'd or something of that nature--the cleaning i believe was a product designed to kind of work into the paint to clean or something? ionno..again I'm sure someone has a MUCH better tidbit--but for now that's all i think i know lol.



Maybe someone can fill it in cause I actually have similar problems with my protege

I was thinking umm.. The Hyper compound spray with DA (two spritz on the pad in the beginning, and then a spritz on the pad per panel after) I don't think you need to clean--just buff off with MF i think...if it comes off then the polish from the same line seal/waxx.... (again i don't know how right this is...so definitely worth either waiting for a better answer or using the search up top)
 
Setec Astronomy said:
First of all, calm down and stop pacing! If you were somewhere where they had ScratchX 2.0, they probably had Ultimate Compound and SwirlX, which are kind of the consumer versions of 105/205, so that would probably be a great combo for you. I really am not familiar with the Danase Swirl Abolishers, but I'll take a wild guess that the I is the finishing polish and the II is the medium cut--why don't you give the II a shot on an orange pad, and see if that takes the spots out? Then use the I with a white pad to finish. If you really want to go to down then use the I again or the PwC on a gray, red or blue pad.
Click to expand...

Now that I think of it, I remeber seeing the Ultimate Compund and Swirl X. Which one is the least agressive and which one is more agressive? That way I can start out least agressive first



Thanks
 
Are both fine to apply by hand without creating a bunch of swirls and scratches? I'd rather try the hand approach first to see where that gets me. I'm not the best with the PC and don't want to create all kinds of buffer trails with my lack of experience
 
Ok, I will look at picking some up. Say that doesn't work, I guess I'll give the PC and the Swirl Abolisher I on the white pad a go.



Is there any kind of tips you can give relatively new person on using it? I know to use a pad prep first to get it a little damp then apply maybe 3 pea sized amounts of polish, spread before turning it on, and the work at speed 3 or so for 3 or 4 passes, then crak it up to 5 or 6 and make a few more passes. Does this sound right? What is the best way to tell when the polish has completely broken down and to stop polishing?
 
Tips for what, the UC and SwirlX? Those are easy, they are SMAT so they don't break down--you stop when you've acheived the correction level you were after. Otherwise that sounds ok for a quick explanation. What you really need is to take a look at Mike Phillips' machine polishing videos. I'm not sure if you can see them here in the vendor forum or if you need to go to Autogeekonline Auto Detailing Forum , but that should get you all you need to know about machine polishing (almost as good as talking to David Fermani).
 
Setec Astronomy said:
Tips for what, the UC and SwirlX? Those are easy, they are SMAT so they don't break down--you stop when you've acheived the correction level you were after. Otherwise that sounds ok for a quick explanation. What you really need is to take a look at Mike Phillips' machine polishing videos. I'm not sure if you can see them here in the vendor forum or if you need to go to Autogeekonline Auto Detailing Forum , but that should get you all you need to know about machine polishing (almost as good as talking to David Fermani).
Click to expand...

No I was refering to tips with the PC, mainly to prevent hazing and trail marks. I was curious to see if the PC was going to get these out at all, so I went ahead and tried it on a section of the hood. I started with the Danase Swirl Abolisher I and CCS white pad combo and was able to get, what a relief. I primed the pad with a couple light mists of Pinnacle XMT pad spray that I had and then applied 3 pea sized drops of polish on the outer edges, that way I didn't fill the pad up too much. Spead it around with the PC off, then started polishing.



I went ahead and made maybe 8 passes total, each pass alternating between horizontal and vertical directions. 2 passes on speed 2, then 2 passes on 3-4, and the last 2 on speed 5-6. After this, the polish seemed to be very faint in visibility and there was plenty of dusting so I assumed that this was the break down point of the polish. I did an IPA wipedown on the areas to make the marks were taken out and that the product did not do any kid of filling or creating hasing or swirl marks. After wiping, it looks good but my fluroscents in the garge suck when it comes to showing and kind of swirls or hazing. I do have a T3 halogen that I shined on it in the darkness, but it didn't show any kind of hazing. My flurouscent worklight didn't work well either.



Since I am anxoius to see the results and it's obvious dark outside, what kind of lights can I use to find hazing, trails, or any other kind of defects that can be commonly found (not the high dollar stuff like the sungun)? (Yeah, I'm excited and nervous at the same time. Can't you tell?:D) After not using the PC on a car in well over a year, and only having 6.5" pads, I have a feeling that my results aren't going to be haze free or perfect.:nervous:





I think I am going to call it a night, and finish the rest tomorrow. Should my pad be fine to reuse by this time tomorrow, wasn't for sure it the product could competely dry by then, or is it a good idea to clean it out? Can't find any other white pads for some reason





Thanks for all of your help so far everyone, I really appreciate everyones suggestions
 
You really won't get any trail marks with the PC ... you may get hazing if you use too much product

What causes hazy paint when polishing



Since I am anxoius to see the results and it's obvious dark outside, what kind of lights can I use to find hazing, trails, or any other kind of defects that can be commonly found
Click to expand...



You can try some metal halide lamps..This is the work light that Barry Theal uses and it will show you more defects than halogens... But IME if it looks good enough under halogen that's good enough plus this thing cost a fortune....



Designers Edge Twin Head 175 Watt Metal Halide Work light on Cart - L-4205 at The Home Depot''
 
Ok, I thought I'd give everyone an update with where I am at, and the results. Or should I say lack of.



The other night I used the Danase Swirl Abolisher I, my CCS 6.5" white pad, and my PC 7424 to attempt to get these water spots out. I worked about an hour and a half on the hood, with each pass the warter spots seemed to didssappear more and more until it seemed like I totally removed them. I had the car out yesterday for a little while later in the afternoon and it was hot and sunny, and everything still looked good, no water spts on the hood.



Now comes today, and I have the car sitting outside. I come out to see the sight to see all of the same wter spts are still everywhere on the hood and looking like total crap:angry I know that they are not new because nothing has been sprayed on the car, and they are still only on the hood. I am so PO'ed about this right now.





Now this really has me wondering, is the Danase Sqirl Abolisher I nothing more than a filler polish? I had the thoughts that it was actually removing the spts since it seemed the more passes I made they went away. It did leave a slick finish behind, so this really has me questioning it.



I ordered some M205 and M105 the other day for future use, good thing. I decided to try some M105 in a small section with a hand foam applicator. It didn't seem to have much abarsiveness to it, compared to the Scratch X I tried at first and that did nothing, but after rubbing across the water spts a few times they seemed to disappear. The finish did not seem to be slick at all after, so I am hoping that they did not just get covered up (Does anyone know if M105 has any fillers to it?)I am really wondering if tomorrow when the hot sun gets on the car, these are just going to come back after using the M105 on them.





I am so confused, frustrated, and mad about this. The car was waxed x2 not even a full month ago with Collonite 845, so it seems this shouldn't have happened. I have never had an etch problem before with it. I guess the next thing to do is try the M205 and M105. What kind of LC CCS pad combo should I use for both the M205 and M105? Will orange be fine for 205 and white for 105?



I don't have and standing mineral deposits on the car, but will the hot weater make these etched in more even worse witht he car outside. To give you guys an idea on what I am working with, they sort of look like the Type II water spots pictured here.



Please help me guys, looking at these are so depressing and driving me nuts
 
You said you have the Danase Swirl Abolisher I and II, but you used the I. Is that the more aggressive of the two? You've got your pads backwards with the 105 & 205; 105 is the more agressive, so it would generally be teamed with the more aggressive pad, which is the orange, and the 205 with the white.



It's hard for me to find info on the Dansase Swirl Abolishers since they aren't made anymore, but what I could find would indicate that I is the least agressive, and using that with a white pad is surely not the way to take out water spot etchings. How about trying with the Swirl Abolisher II and an orange pad and then going back and finishing with the I on the white pad?



EDIT: Sheesh, I already suggested last week that you try this, but I guess you didn't.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
You said you have the Danase Swirl Abolisher I and II, but you used the I. Is that the more aggressive of the two? You've got your pads backwards with the 105 & 205; 105 is the more agressive, so it would generally be teamed with the more aggressive pad, which is the orange, and the 205 with the white.



It's hard for me to find info on the Dansase Swirl Abolishers since they aren't made anymore, but what I could find would indicate that I is the least agressive, and using that with a white pad is surely not the way to take out water spot etchings. How about trying with the Swirl Abolisher II and an orange pad and then going back and finishing with the I on the white pad?



EDIT: Sheesh, I already suggested last week that you try this, but I guess you didn't.
Click to expand...

The Swirl Abolisher I is the least agressive, while II is more abrasive. I don't know how they compare to other polishes out there, since it is the only machine polish I have ever used. I looked too, and it seems that Danase is no longer around, heh surprising. You're right on the M205 and M105, I got them mixed up.



I figured that I'd try the least agressive method first, since I didn't think that they were going to be that tough to get out since I couldn't feel anywhere where they etched below the surface with my fingernail. I thought I had it too, but apparently they were hidden by the polish. It seems weird to me how a machine polish can hide etchings, then reappear. I guess the next thing to try is M105 on orange and M205 on white. I am seriously starting to think that the 4"x4" area I tested out with hand foam applicator and M205 is just hiding these too since it did not seem agressive at all. It makes no sense since it seems that these polsihes state that they are pantible, so it seems that they should not contain any fillers. Anyone have any idea why this could be happening? I'll try to get some pictures soon, to give you all a better idea on what I am working with. Is the PC even capable of removing most water etchings, more so with the combo I am using? I seriously hope that I can get these out. Any other suggestions, product combos at getting these out, or suggestion will be greatly appreciated
 
I haven't used 105 or 205 myself, but there has been quite a bit of discussion about the carrier oils in 205, so it wouldn't surprise me if they are masking your spots to some extent. IME those kind of etchings (from bird crap, etc.) which you can't feel, seem to absorb oils or solvents from different products and can disappear for a while. As to whether the PC is capable, from what I understand, it definitely will be with 105 (Meg's had to extend their abrasiveness scale to cover it). As always with the PC, smaller pads will get you more cut. Lot of threads on getting results with 105, you might want to search on that.
 
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