Platinum UPP vs. S100 Durability test

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chevyguy28

New member
We all want to know, so I've decided to find out for myself. This product is much debated, so I'll leave that to your discretion. Basically S100 (P21s) paste wax is below average for durability when it comes to carnauba based waxes. Platinum UPP is, well, we don't know what it is and no one can agree on that. Therefore, I'm judging by how long it will last. I will update this thread once a week with progress for each. Let's get to it:



This is not a "which product looks better" test. In case you were wondering, UPP looks little brighter as of right now. We are all aware of S100's tendency to increase in shine after curing, which takes a few days. Both sides are equally smooth, but my finger glides more quickly on the UPP side. Very slick. I wanted to have S100 and Platinum UPP side by side for purposes of durability. Therefore, I am using all the horizontal surfaces on my '94 Honda Accord (dark green) as a test bed. My MB has Zaino on it, and I was not prepared to strip it.



What I did:

- The car had just been washed, but I gave it another one with MGC shampoo.

- Used Meguiars #9 2.0 to help improve the surface condition. Swirls have pretty much been eliminated on these surfaces, but there are still surface defects as you might expect.

- Dawn washed, surface beaded like crazy

- Split the car longways on the horizontal surfaces, like opening a hot dog bun. The left side is for UPP and the right is for S100.



At this point I was not sure whether or not to use any further surface prep. 4Star products recommends Klasse AIO underneath Platinum UPP. However, I felt it might skew the results (after a certain amount of time, the UPP could be gone and I wouldn't know it). AIO provides very little protection, but I still wanted to take it out of the equation. Likewise, the S100 side was given no further treatment.



- I applied UPP via PC w/ black (grey) pad.

- Then while it began to dry, I applied S100 with a foam pad. I buffed it off as I went.

- Went back about 20 minutes later and buffed off the UPP. I used their gloss enhancer as well. Then I used FI on the S100 side to be as fair as possible. Finally, I lifted the masking tape.



So, both sides look pretty darn good, but let's see what happens. This test probably isn't the most methodized and is still very early. If you have any suggestions at all, it isn't too late to start over. Some rubbing alcohol and dawn can allow me to do this more effectively if you feel.



I will be using MGC Shampoo to wash the car week to week, I feel that is fair. Platinum's shampoo would only lead to reduced durability considering it is acidic. Comments please.
 
Just the fact that you are running a test of a polymer sealant (Platium) against a carnuaba (P21S) states a lot about the questionable durability of the sealant. I wish you had some BF to run along side these others products.

Keep us updated.:xyxthumbs :wavey
 
Justin's test review is very old. The comments in this thread reflect opinions prior to both Platium and Blackfire revising their formulation. You might PM Justin to see if he has any follow-up about Platium. I can not completely review BF2's durability except to say since I detail my cars treated with BF2 at least once every 2-3 weeks that its durability for this time span is excellent.:xyxthumbs
 
Yes, my test was using the original Platinum UPP formula and the current (soon to be changed?) formula for S100 paste wax. Therefore it isn't very relevant today. I still use both products on my Honda. The test was done during warmer months where the sun may have contributed to faster deterioration of both products. What I am finding now is that UPP still looks pretty good as the beading and slickness goes away. My findings about how S100 sheets off dirt after rain is consistent with that of Jngrbrdman. I usually use UPP for the Honda because I have so much of it, but I put S100 on a small porton of the hood to show my friend how easy the wax is to apply and remove. After the rain, that was the portion of the hood that was most clean.
 
UPP should easily outlast S100. I'm waiting for the new formulation of S100, with the anticipation that it will contain polymers to increase its longevity.
 
ADetailer said:
UPP should easily outlast S100. I'm waiting for the new formulation of S100, with the anticipation that it will contain polymers to increase its longevity.
Click to expand...



Actually, you may be suprised with S100's durability. Certainly not like a synthetic, but my customer's cars are beading for a good 3 months with S100 and the shine definitely is durable. Most get their cars waxed every 6-8 weeks, but some wait a full three months-kind of hard to convince them to wax when the paint is beading.
 
Scottwax said:
Actually, you may be suprised with S100's durability. Certainly not like a synthetic, but my customer's cars are beading for a good 3 months with S100 and the shine definitely is durable. Most get their cars waxed every 6-8 weeks, but some wait a full three months-kind of hard to convince them to wax when the paint is beading.
Click to expand...



I know the S100 beads a good 90 days, but the paint does not look as shiney, and does not feel as slick as it once was just after 6 weeks as compared to a good quality polymer.



Do you notice the same?
 
I just don't understand how people can compare a carnauba wax against a polymer in a durability test. The polymer is going to last longer because that is what it was designed to do. It should be an appearance test that you are looking for. I mean, big suprise when the polymer lasts longer. That's like running a durability test between sidewalk chalk and the paint they use for

the lines on the freeway. Which do you think will last longer?

:nixweiss
 
During the summer months, I did not find that UPP lasted incredibly longer. A week or so extra, before I would reapply. As far as I'm concerned, UPP#1 and S100 have practically the same durability.



This is of course irrelevant now that the new version has been released.
 
ADetailer said:
I know the S100 beads a good 90 days, but the paint does not look as shiney, and does not feel as slick as it once was just after 6 weeks as compared to a good quality polymer.



Do you notice the same?
Click to expand...



Obviously S100 is not as slick at 90 days as it was when first applied, but the shine does not diminish very much in that time period and the paint is still real reflective. QEW tends to be very gentle on wax, so that may be a reason why I am getting good durability out of S100.
 
ADetailer said:
I know the S100 beads a good 90 days, but the paint does not look as shiney, and does not feel as slick as it once was just after 6 weeks as compared to a good quality polymer.

Do you notice the same?
Click to expand...



Actually, there are sealants that are popular here that do not feel anywhere near (nor bead water) the same after 6-8 weeks. That doesn't mean the coat is gone however, as many polymer sealants are "supposed" :rolleyes: to lose slickness and sheet water after a month or two. I'm not too crazy about products that do this, but others here don't seem to mind.



On that note, I'd put my money on P21S if compared head-to-head with either the original versions of BF or Platinum.
 
Jngrbrdman,



I understand where you're coming from, but don't you think it would be better to applaud Justin for his efforts instead of criticizing them, even if you don't agree with any of the premises behind it?



Back when he started this test, it was at a time when a lot of ppl were having problems with Platinum's durability. Instead of insinuating how ridiculous you think this test is by comparing it to a test between paint and chalk, perhaps you can offer your own experience with Platinum's durability? Chances are, Plat will outlast P21S. But then again, maybe it won't. How exactly can you be so sure that Platinum will outlive P21S? :nixweiss



I think what Justin's doing is something we need more of here on Autopia. I enjoy reading about ppl's experiences and their testing of various products, but I CAN'T STAND opinions which are nothing more than veiled regurgitations of what's been posted before or just a rewording of how the product is marketed. It bothers me to no end when I read a someone commenting on how long a product lasts when they haven't even tried it or tested how long it lasts!
 
Its not that I'm trying to bag on his test. Its just that I can't wrap my mind around the testing of a sealant vs a carnauba. I can see your point about how Platinum was under the gun for durability issues back then. I can see that clearer now actually. The comparison of a carnauba against Platinum back then is probably more appropriate now that more results are in about its durability. Generally polymer sealants are going to outlast a carnauba 3 to 1. If this test was Souveran vs Klasse then the chalk analogy would be quite appropriat, yes? :D



My bad, Justin. The test was a good one. I'm still going to be boggled for awhile about it, but I can see why the test was run now. :xyxthumbs
 
I hope not to stir up anything anymore than has been already, but in my mind I've come to reduce the perceived durability gulf between "synthetic" and "carnauba" waxes based only on which family they "belong" to. The reason for this has been fermenting for a while, but especially after reading Steve's waxtest.



It's been often generalized to say that "synthetic waxes last longer" and "carnauba waxes don't last as long". But the problem with lumping waxes into blanket statements like that is that it's not always true. There are several "carnauba" waxes that either last longer than some synthetic waxes, or blur the distinction between them because they claim to contain "polymers". For example, Meguiar's #26 and Pinnacle waxes both mention "polymers". #26 lasts a long time, Pinnacle less so. The old BF and PUPP were purely synthetic, but durability was poor. It's all so confusing that the actual composition of the waxes sometimes takes a back seat to the simple question, "How long does it last?" :nixweiss



I suppose I'm just thinking out loud about why I think it's okay to compare seemingly dissimilar products like these....
 
Platinum isn't a wax though. Not even a synthetic one. Its a polymer sealant. There is definatly a difference. Blackfire, Platinum, Klasse and Zaino are all sealants that can't even begin to compare to carnaubas molecularly. That is the only reason I think that a sealant/wax comparison is kind of a different comparison. I can understand it with the way Platinum used to last, but I wouldn't go further than that with the comparison. They are definatly seperate and completly different chemicals.



Polymers expand and contract with your car. That is the problem with waxes. They may expand but they won't contract again. That is what contributes to their durability problems. Because of the way the polymers bond together it gives the sealants an edge when dealing with heat and cold on the car. Some companies may put some polymers in their waxes to help them last a little longer, but that's about it. The fact that you can't layer a polymer on top of a wax says something about why the waxes enhanced with polmyers don't last much longer than without.
 
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