Newbie Questions about wetsanding... HELP ME !! LOL

J

Jimmymac

New member
For those of you following This thread .. I got a Pre Certified 2001 BMW... and the hood of the car is well.. not flawless.. Guess they didn't precertify it to my standards.. Bastages :D

I am going to get the hood wetsanded by the paintshop attached to Platinum products on Tuesday.. (They are great guys BTW They spent hours takling to me about detailing.) But I have some questions. I always get 2nd third and fourth opinions.. Heee. I'm actually scared ****less that they will eat through my clearcoat.. or that it will fail in a year or two. Too late now though.. they experimented on a corner.. eeek I know I may being silly.. but this is all new to me.

They are going to wetsand the bumpers and hood.. Don't know why the bumpers but that's where they belive it's needed.. I'm a little worried that the orange peel on the hood will be gone and the hood will look different from the sides of the car.. Maybe I'm mental. It's 175$ so I'm allowed. By the way.. is that a normal price ?

After they do the work with the makita I think there will be swirl marks.. fine ones.. the bodyshop/painter/detail guy said its almost impossible with a Makita on a black car to get it truely swirl free.

The guy from Platinum products next door said that after I get it wetsanded to use M#9 ( Porter Cable hard on 6 and work my way down to lightly on 3 1/2) on the hood to get it really swirl free. And to check it with a halogen light. Then follow it up with the Klasse. Or Platinum.. (plug)

1) is that normal ? (That there will be swirl marks after they sand/buff it)
2) should I follow it up with M#9 to get out all the very fine swirl
marks before I Klasse, Blitz it, Platinum it ?
3) How scared should I be that my clearcoat will fail in a year or two ??

One day I will be Master Detailer... or at least resemble one..

LOL

Jimmy
 
I'm having nightmares of clear coat failing...



I JUST bought this car.. The BMW dealer hid all the pits in the paint with something...



I hope I won't be left in swirlmark hell
 
I just did a search this morning about wet sanding/color sanding

alot of good info here....

CVCAELEN put down an excellant site to check out..

would find out how many they've done and see if they have before and after pict......Just don't want to be too aggressive..

I am looking into it because Fin-II Med-Cut Fin Cut just are not working, (with Makita)...

jeff
 
I assume you know that if your hood is wetsanded, the orange peel on it will not match that of the rest of your car? There will be a noticeable difference between the hood and fenders.



Just making sure!
 
Yeah I am woried about that..also I am worried about the clear coat failing..



M#9 is not doing the job.. what's the next harsher product ?
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by Jimmymac [/i]
<strong class='bbc'>They are going to wetsand the bumpers and hood.. Don't know why the bumpers but that's where they belive it's needed.. I'm a little worried that the orange peel on the hood will be gone and the hood will look different from the sides of the car.. Maybe I'm mental. It's 175$ so I'm allowed. By the way.. is that a normal price ? [/b]</blockquote>Oops, I didn't read your post well enough. You already said what I said in an above post :rolleyes:. My apologies.

If you don't see anything wrong with the bumpers then why let them wetsand them?! It just increases the chances of something going wrong with the paint in the future. JMO!
 
If you are using it as a daily car I won't even think about colorsanding it. I just got done with a wetsanding class (6 hours) with a pro and it is not advisable. The life of the paint will be cut in half and the UV protectant that is on the clear will be next to nothing once it is done.



The results after wetsanding looks great but I don't think it is worth it. The price to colorsand for a whole car starts around $600-$1700 dollars. So, I don't know what type of quality the shop is going to give you for $175. A new paint job cost over $3000.



By the way there is no way you are going to use a PC to take out sand marks even if a 3000 grit was used on it. Only a rotory will remove it. I have seen both methods used in front of me as a demo.
 
Are you sure you can't take out sand marks with a pc????? Isn't the how too on scratch repair done with a pc on a porsche???
 
<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

<em class='bbc'>Originally posted by mch [/i]
<strong class='bbc'>By the way there is no way you are going to use a PC to take out sand marks even if a 3000 grit was used on it. Only a rotory will remove it. I have seen both methods used in front of me as a demo. [/b]</blockquote>Hi mch,

Where did you get this instruction in wetsanding? It sounds interesting but is probably out of my price range.

I'm not sure I interpreted the above statement correctly. Are you saying you don't think a PC is capable of removing sanding marks, even with a wool pad and / or a fine cut rubbing compound? I find that pretty hard to believe because of the light scratches I've removed with a PC - I'd certainly think 1500-3000 grit sandpaper scratches aren't that deep.

By the way, have you seen the new 3M Trizact system? Here's a partial link, but it's a system consisting of a foam 3000 grit sanding pad for machine use and a compound for use by foam. I was given both the sanding pad and the " 3Mâ„¢ Perfect-Itâ„¢ III Trizactâ„¢ Machine Glaze 05930" by a 3M representative and am only considering the use of the polish.

He told me this "glaze" is less abrasive than Finesse-It II . . . so wouldn't FI-II remove even heavier marks than 3000?

Thanks for any info . . . I have very limited experience in this topic and would love to learn more! :)

Justin
 
As I thought.. Ok screw the wetsand... it's a daily driver and the sun is INTENSE in Florida.



So here is where I am at.. I have swirl marks that M#9 will not take out.. I used it with my PC 3 times..



It lightened them a little but now I have tons of really fine fine fine scratches from the #9. I wonder if Klasse AIO wil takes those tiny ones out.



So I need to get the dealer Makita swirl marks out and then get the #9 out...





What is the process with my PC ?



Also with the M#9.. How do I know when I have buffed it in enough ? When the #9 startes getting hard.. I mean flaking off in tiny bits ?



Hope that is understandable...
 
Put it this way...



When you wet sand a car your clear coat will fail ALOT sooner.



It costs 3000 for a really really nice paint job, if you don't like the paint now why spend 175.00 to wet sand it, wait for it to fail then spend 3000 on a new paint job. Just wait until your car is hit or something happens that you NEED a paint job to paint the entire thing over.



You are wet sanding specific areas of the car so they will look better than they do, sure, they will but the problem is, they are going to look better than the rest of the car which will probaly lead you to having the ENTIRE car wet sanded which means total clear coat failure sooner.



As someone else said, a black cars clearcoat is going to take a beating if used every day and stored outside.



I don't think it's a good idea to wet sand. Live with the paint and re-paint the car for the perfect look when you need to. No need spending 3000 until you need to.
 
.<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote' >

By the way there is no way you are going to use a PC to take out sand marks even if a 3000 grit was used on it. Only a rotory will remove it. I have seen both methods used in front of me as a demo.</blockquote>
The PC WILL remove sanding marks with the right combination of pads and products. Use 3M Perfect-It Fine Cut Rubbing compound and a wool leveling pad. Then follow with Finesse-It and polishing pad, and finally a few passs with SMR and a polishing pad. I have used this very combo to remove 2000 grit sanding marks from a finish.
 
I was using the Fine Cut product followed by the 3M SMR and you guys would be quite surprised what I removed. Think of 100,000 swirl marks you can feel with your fingernail.
 
One thing I think was misinterpreted was that the detailer was going to remove the 2000 grit wet sand marks using 3M Perfect It III and his Makita. At that point I informed Jimmy that if the clear still showed swirls from the high speed and he could greatly reduce their appearance and remove some of them with #9 and his Porter Cable.



Yes, any removal of clearcoat weakens its structure but you have to weigh the pros and the cons. Jimmy is right, the hood is screwed up pretty bad. Sure, you can cover it with some carnauba. It's like dressing up a guy with make-up and a dress . You still don't want to take him to the prom.



My personal oppinion is that the dealer should be forced to buy the car back. The finish is that bad.



At the very least if any of you have a chance to talk to Jimmy he is a really great person. We were honored to have him as our first real life visitor from Autopia and I hope that he gets the results that he deserves.



That is one cool car by the way.
 
I saw some of the pics. I don't know but the hood didn't look THAT bad. Nothing a good polish and a whole lot of work can't fix. I think wet sanding is a little overkill BUT what do I know ..... let the flaming begin :rolleyes:
 
It does look alot different in person than in the pics. Just like when we were out front looking at the hood and the sun was behind the clouds it looked AWESOME but when the sun came out and we saw the real deal it was a different story.



If anyone else bought the car they may have never noticed these imperfections as the majority of people really dont but for people like us who do notice, yes it was pretty bad.



2000 grit wetsanding isnt that aggressive considering that you can start at a 1000 (some start deeper, I havent) and work your way up.

It's all about how deep the imperfections are. Why dig a 200 foot hole when you can strike oil at 50? See what I mean? Sure, if it can be fixed without then by all means that would be the way to go.



Sometimes it can't and that is when wetsanding may be needed.





By the way, the 3M Trizact system that puterbum mentioned is awesome. I have to say, when it comes to paint correction I feel that 3M is at the forefront from sanding to buffing with their line of compounds, pads, and sanding materials.
 
Hee Hee...



I started something here huh ?



I didn't say the detailer was going to remove the 2000 grit wet sand marks using 3M Perfect It III and his Makita...



I said just what you said. I can't seem to get out those marks with #9 though. I called Meguier's and they said to use Scratch-X by hand then #9 then #7.



What do you guys think.. Should I try Scratch-X, #9 and Klasse AIO ??



or wetsand ? Hee Hee



I'm confused !!!!:nixweiss
 
Yeah! Now look what you've gone and done. LOL



I guess ya didnt say that but I just wanted to clarify to folks that yes, you buff with a high speed to remove the wetsand marks. I guess they thought you were gonna try with the Porter Cable.

I am interested in trying different product and pad combinations and experiment more with the PC. Heck, if it can take out 2000 grit marks then we could skip the high speed and avoid swirls. It's worth a shot.





Whatever you decide to do, stop by and show it off. I know that Rick wants you to sample a few things. Call first and lunch is on me.
 
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