Need some beginner advice - product choice and polish/compound required?

[Zelfiris]

EDIT: Issue resolved a few months ago thanks to everyone's advice! Thank you!



Hi everyone,



I'm a long time visitor to autopia, eshine, autogeek and read a number of guides for the last few months to get myself started.

My question is, do I need to compound in addition to polish?



My car's clearcoat is similar to this member's clearcoat (http://www.autopia.org/forum/car-detailing/140026-how-abrasive-polish-can-i-use-color-condition.html). My car has been through two winters, about 1.5 years old, never clayed and was sitting the lot from June 2009 until I picked it up in Sept 2010.



Below is my experience with polishing



A member of my car forum (genesis coupe) demonstrated how to polish my trunk 2 months ago and I was very happy with the results. I had the chance to polish the trunk (2.5 hours to do) and what I used was:



Ricardo's Blue Clay bar

Griot's Random Orbital with orange pad

Meg's Ultimate Compound



Under halogen light, Ricardo's blue clay bar left a lot of marring which I was very surprised to see. After several passes with the ultimate compound I was very pleased with the results and god it was time consuming but fun to see I was able to do it myself.



Now today in my arsenal, I have:

Griot's Random Orbital

Orange pad

White pad

Optimum Hyper Compound Spray

Meg. #205 Polish

Ricardo's Yellow Claybar



Should I use Optimum Hyper Compound Spray before Meg. #205 Polish for my car's condition?



I guess the main reason I'm asking is I have not decided on a cost effective halogen light to purchase so I can inspect the paint myself. And the other concern is with claying. Although most people say if it was never clayed it will need to at least once. This was true with the trunk when I used Ricardo's blue clay on the trunk but when I tried the yellow claybar on the front bumper, my clay was completely clean.. very puzzling for me lol



Anyways I apologize for the long post, any hints will help



Thanks,



Kouyo

 

[wascallyrabbit]

1.wash

2. clay (use what you have)

3. polish/compound with the optimum and orange pad

4. polish with 205 and white pad

5. protect with your favorite wax/sealant

 

[Zelfiris]

1.wash

2. clay (use what you have)

3. polish/compound with the optimum and orange pad

4. polish with 205 and white pad

5. protect with your favorite wax/sealant

Thanks for the reply wascallyrabbit,



For swirl marks of this degree, do you think its really necessary to use compound or best to skip to polish?

 

[cptzippy]

Is Hyundai paint soft like Honda and Toyota? The general rule is to try the lest aggressive approach and move up.

 

[wascallyrabbit]

Thanks for the reply wascallyrabbit,



For swirl marks of this degree, do you think its really necessary to use compound or best to skip to polish?

like cptqippy says least aggressive first then move on to more aggressive. do a test spot with the white and 205 to see if that works first. you could also try the white with optimum.

 

[imported_MCA]

like cptqippy says least aggressive first then move on to more aggressive. do a test spot with the white and 205 to see if that works first. you could also try the white with optimum.

I am not familiar with Hyundai paint so as others said, do a test spot with white/205. If the results are inadequate, move up the aggressive meter and do a spot with orange/optimum. Another thing to consider: a common oversight is the number of pads needed to do the job, especially one that requires cutting or compounding. I *know* some people can do a whole car with one orange pad but I highly recommend you have at least 2 orange pads if you will be going the cutting/compounding route. Be sure to also clean them often with a soft/medium-bristled brush

 

[Accumulator]

Kouyo- SInce the Ultimate Compound worked so well before, don't be surprised if the M205 isn't quite aggressive enough for timely correction, and watch out that its oils don't fool you into thinking it's done more than it really has. That UC is almost certainly more aggressive than the Optimum Hyper Coumpound too, but the OHC is gonna be a lot more user-friendly.



And with all these (non-diminishing abrasive) compounds/polishes, take MCA's advice seriously and be sure to keep the pads clean. I'm *always* cleaning the pads, not like I usually wait until I've finished a whole panel.

 

[GeeReg]

watch out that its oils don't fool you into thinking it's done more than it really has.

I didn't realize how dramatic this was until recently. I've been using the consumer version of 205 (Ultimate Polish - which has more oils I believe) and was thinking, "Wow this looks great. Let me wipe it down with IPA before I seal it." and back come the faint scratches and hologramming. For a long time I thought it was my wiping technique when trying to remove the polish, but now I realize this is what it is. I still love the product, you just need to be careful as Accumulator said.

 

[Zelfiris]

Thanks for all the tips everyone!



I will give it my first try when I find a nice warm day and once I find a good halogen light to purchase.



I'm afraid to wetsand and have not considered it, does anyone have positive experience using it regularly and when to know to use it?

 

[imported_RZJZA80]

wetsanding should be an absolute last resort IMO. On a daily, I don't see the need for it, don't worry about getting it perfect unless it's a show car. Get it the best you can for your own eyes, and that will tell you what needs to be done.

 

[Accumulator]

I'm afraid to wetsand and have not considered it, does anyone have positive experience using it regularly and when to know to use it?

Just skip the wetsanding. It's pretty much one of those things where "if you have to ask, you shouldn't be trying it". Nothing I see in your pix looks even *remotely* that bad anyhow.



Just don't be surprised if you do have to use the compound for the initial work, it can be funny how "regular polishes" don't always do much for "regular swirls".

 

[Zelfiris]

Hi everyone, been a while since I last visited.



I have tried to sample a spot with my hood with a purchase of halogen light.



I used the compound with orange pad and M205 with white pad. It was warm weather in the evening when I did it. Under the halogen light it look like I removed a lot of swirls, but next morning under the sun light I saw all the swirl marks again. Maybe its actually scratches but still lost what I did wrong.



My steps:

1. Washed hood with Meg's gold wash.

2. Clayed hood with yellow ricardo bar with diluted QD from ONR

3. Washed again and dried

4. Prep'ed orange pad by soaking the pad then remove excess water with polisher on low speed

5. shaked up compound bottle for good minute then applied to orange pad

6. spread compound over 2x2 section at low speed, then applied 6 passes really slowly 3 up/down and 3 left/rights

7. spritz orange pad with ONR QD one time before 2nd section

8. 3rd section I added more compound to the pad, another spritz for the 4th section. I divided the hood into 6 sections

9. washed and dried hood to remove compound

10. performed similar method with white pad and M205

11. paint looked amazing at night under halogen light



At some point I think I should have used ISP.. it took basically 3.5 to 4 hours to do the Hood for me



Maybe the products don't work well together.. or the fact I did it outdoor (no garage) but in the evening so no direct sun light. I did noticed a lot of dusting with hyper compound spray though it should not be dusting.



Any ideas? lol

 

[Zelfiris]

now that I think about it, maybe I should have followed with a wash using Dawn after the first wash with Meg's gold class. I think Meg's gold class has wax (grease) in it and prevent the compound from cutting as well as it should be

 

[Thomas Dekany]

Morning - first, there is no wax in Gold Class. Even it there was, any polish would remove that. You may need a more aggressive polish and or pad.

now that I think about it, maybe I should have followed with a wash using Dawn after the first wash with Meg's gold class. I think Meg's gold class has wax (grease) in it and prevent the compound from cutting as well as it should be

 

[Dan]

Thanks for the reply wascallyrabbit,



For swirl marks of this degree, do you think its really necessary to use compound or best to skip to polish?

With the picture that out of focus, and still being able to see the swirls, I'd say there are pretty deep. 1x1' area and test with 105.

 

[Zelfiris]

With the picture that out of focus, and still being able to see the swirls, I'd say there are pretty deep. 1x1' area and test with 105.

Hi Dan,



I currently own Optimum Hypercompound Spray and M205 but not M105. Are you suggesting me to buy 105 for a test run?

 

[Accumulator]

I have tried to sample a spot with my hood with a purchase of halogen light....Any ideas? lol

I used the compound with orange pad and M205 with white pad. It was warm weather in the evening when I did it. Under the halogen light it look like I removed a lot of swirls, but next morning under the sun light I saw all the swirl marks again. Maybe its actually scratches but still lost what I did wrong.

You need to get your inspection lighting sorted out so you can properly evaluate your progress as you go.

My steps:...

4. Prep'ed orange pad by soaking the pad then remove excess water with polisher on low speed

Don't do that. Prime the pad with *product*, not water. Using water with non-diminishing abrasives is a specialized technique that you don't need to do.

6. spread compound over 2x2 section at low speed, then applied 6 passes really slowly 3 up/down and 3 left/rights

Don't spread products with non-diminishing abrasives; just start polishing in the area where you first set down the pad. Spreading these products just wastes part of the already-short working time.

7. spritz orange pad with ONR QD one time before 2nd section

Huh? I've never done that and don't think that you should either. CLEAN the pad between sections to get the used polish and cut-off clear out of the foam.

8. 3rd section I added more compound to the pad, another spritz for the 4th section. I divided the hood into 6 sections

Only add product after cleaing the pad out thoroughly. No spritizing of anything. I myself like to work smaller sections that that but that's just me.

9. washed and dried hood to remove compound

Buff off the compound as you go. When you finish compounding it might have a little residue and/or some residual polishing oils but not much.

10. performed similar method with white pad and M205

Again, change the technique to what I described earlier- no spreading, no spritzing, lots of pad cleaning, minimal additional product. Plus, with M205 you need to work harder to remove the residual polishing oils- use at least IPA, preferably something like TOL's PrepWash.

11. paint looked amazing at night under halogen light

It was still coated with polishing oils and I'd bet that your inspection lighting/technique wasn't optimal (I don't mean that as a slam, inspecting such progress can be very challenging).

At some point I think I should have used ISP.. it took basically 3.5 to 4 hours to do the Hood for me

I wouldn't worry about that, I've done this stuff since forever and I can still spend ages doing a single panel. It takes as long as it takes (I spend about as much time inspecting as I do polishing) and things *will* speed up with experience (which includes getting the proper products and using them optimally).



I would use a more aggressive product for the initial work, with a MF cutting pad. Then switch to the OHC/orange combo and use that until things look basically perfect. Then switch to the M205 for the final polishing.

Maybe the products don't work well together.. or the fact I did it outdoor (no garage) but in the evening so no direct sun light. I did noticed a lot of dusting with hyper compound spray though it should not be dusting

Those products will work OK together; I've done that progression with good results. BUT the OHC is pretty gentle for a compound, more like an aggressive polish.



Sorting out the technique can make a HUGE diff, especially with non-diminishing abrasive products. Check out anything on this topic by Kevin Brown, well worth the dreaded SEARCH as he explains it all very clearly.



Gotta get that inspection lighting sorted out. Working outside is tricky for various reasons but you gotta do what you gotta do, huh?

 

[Zelfiris]

Thank you Accumulator, I always love your detailed responses lol



How do you suggest for me to clean the pads in between sections? Would this work on my Griot's random polisher? The Edge Foam Pad Conditioning Brush



I learned the spritzing technique from one of Junkman's videos but he used Adam QD instead. I figured diluting ONR as QD would work as a replacement



Maybe I should switch over to a compound more beginner friendly. I'll look up Kevin Brown's infos. Thanks again

 

[Accumulator]

How do you suggest for me to clean the pads in between sections? Would this work on my Griot's random polisher? The Edge Foam Pad Conditioning Brush

That brush will work fine for "brushing the pad clean", but IME that doesn't always get all the stuff out. Worth having though.



Wiping the pad with a towels (cotton or MF) and some "clean" QD (I use Meguiar's M34 Final Inspection) can work well.



My favorite method is to blow the pad clean with an air compressor, but of course you have to *have* the compressor This works incredibly well with MF pads.

I learned the spritzing technique...

Not to diss anybody's technique, but I just wouldn't do that.

Maybe I should switch over to a compound more beginner friendly. I'll look up Kevin Brown's infos. Thanks again

Well, IMO the OHC is very user-friendly, it just doesn't cut all that aggressively, nothing like M105 and not as well as Uno either. Uno is also very user-friendly and cuts OK with MF disks. M105 is the aggressive one, but it's not the most user-friendly stuff in the world..not *bad* but not as easy as the others. I use M105 when I need it, but switch to Uno or OHC as soon as I can (like after I get the really deep stuff pretty much out).

 

[pwaug]

How do you suggest for me to clean the pads in between sections? Would this work on my Griot's random polisher? The Edge Foam Pad Conditioning Brush

I just use a Denture Brush from the Dollar Store along with a cotton terry towel. The brush works great and doesn't damage the pads.