My First Rotary Detail... Plz take a look!

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eyesack

New member
Just Like It Says...

This is an 03 mercury mariner, i think it had been repainted. I need some feedback as to what happened in a few pics, and how i can improve.

Before:

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I have more befores in my phone but i need to transfer them to my PC...



During: now this is after hitting it with my dewalt 849 at 1000-1200 with a finishing pad and menz IP. This is what gave me a heart attack and a half.

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did i burn through the clear on the whole side of the car? *** is all of that in the picture? the hazyness is after i tried to put Klasse AIO on it.

Here's a closeup:

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what is that obvious jagged line in the picture from? i couldn't for the life of me figure out what that was...



Showing obvious improvement before panel and after panel...

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And the Afters:

This is after a crash course in rotary work by my friend who is a master of the wheel. he had me do this process:

1. go back over the entire car with the orbital

2. take my Meg's 26 yellow wax and apply to panel, let haze a tiny amt, spray the crap outta it with QD and water and run the buffer at 1600 rpm with a finishing/wax pad.

I wanted to hit it with a coat of pinnacle souveran, but ran out of time. 3 days is enough work on a car for the 250 i charged.

Pics:

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im afraid there are holograms on the car looking at this picture ^

and once more, how the car came to me (after wash)

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The guy was extremely pleased and gave me a generous tip, but i'm still not satisfied; i just have a bad feeling in my stomach like i messed up his paint really bad...?



Needless to say, it was a very eventful weekend. I... Hate... BLACK... CARS!!! but they do come up the best. ill post the other befores tomorrow.
 
Note : I am not a rotary user yet, just a ROB user.



The safest way is always : use the least aggrasive products 1st, and only after finding out that it doesn't work for you, move on to a stronger polish/compounds/pads.



If you find that the swirls etc on the car is extremely bad, you should have went for a very strong compound that doesn't dry or dusts quickly with a wool pad ( well, that's what I see people with RBs use for really bad swirls etc ) so you'll have a safety net of a long playing time ( essential for RB noobies ).



If I'm not mistaken, holograms happens either because : not enough products, or you didn't work the product long enough. Long enough doesn't mean that you have to run the RB to very high speeds. What I gathered around is : 600RPM to spread product, then 900RPM, then 1200RPM, then back down to 900RPM. About 2" x 2" per application. Then buff off and inspect. If the compound you are using is dusty, use something like Meguiar's M34, or Meguiar's Last Touch ( sorry can't say about other items ) and a clean MF to pick up the dust safely from the paintwork. Then an IPA wipedown to make sure there are no fillers! If the swirls are reduced, then that means whatever pads, compounds or polish you've used is right on the money, so follow up again, then inspect again.



If after 3-4 passes ( experienced RB users takes less than 10 mins to do all these steps for a front bonnet! ), you can no longer improve the paintwork, only then you move on to a softer compound with a foam pad ( maybe cutting or just normal polishing foam pad, I'm not sure ). Once again, after each pass, clean and inspect, until you cannot improve it further, then a soft polish, same steps again until you are thoroughly satisfied, don't forget IPA wipedown again.



Only then, you apply a pure polish ( if you want to do so ) to get the paint looking wet, shiny etc. Buff off and apply LSP of choice.



Do take my post with a pinch of salt, as I have yet to use an RB myself ( way too afraid to burn paint LOL!!!!! )!
 
Yup you left holograms for sure.



You should have followed up with a finishing polish after IP.

It also appears you did not brake down IP enough/work it enough.



Your freind sounds like a hack, thats what alot of shops do to hide holograms for the time being.
 
Yea, I was about to say, I don't want to degrade your friend or anything, but putting a coat of wax over that is just hiding what was left unfinished. I would suggest sticking with a PC until you have better mastered your skills with a rotary on sample pieces.
 
ok so now that we've deduced that i've put holograms into the paint, what do i do now? can i take them out with a PC next time? do I call the guy back? what can i do to fix this situation? he hasn't called me back with complaints... so do i just use this as one hellova learning experience and move on? i've been having really bad anxiety over this ever since the car left my garage. what have you guys done other than not used the rotary in the first place?
 
I would be honest and just tell him you removed the majority of the paint defects but feel the job could be done better next time. You will make it up to him at a later date if he chooses to use your services. With a follow-up call you will be able to judge how he feels about your work.



If he hasn't noticed and feels the car look great... awesome for you. Now you've really impressed him by saying it could be better, you acknowledge that and are willing to make it that way next time.



If he has noticed, well at least now you know he has. You can offer to fix it for him next time for a discount price. Either of these situations will likely be of benefit to you.



I feel people respond best to honesty.
 
eyesack said:
ok so now that we've deduced that i've put holograms into the paint, what do i do now? can i take them out with a PC next time? do I call the guy back? what can i do to fix this situation? he hasn't called me back with complaints... so do i just use this as one hellova learning experience and move on? i've been having really bad anxiety over this ever since the car left my garage. what have you guys done other than not used the rotary in the first place?
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I agree with JJ...honesty is the best policy. But I would take it one step further. I would definitely call your client to gauge how he/she feels about your work. It's at this point that you have a tough decision to make...play dumb if they are satisfied, or fix your work. This is touchy as you could be opening yourself up to some questioning. The reality is that if you plan on doing this for other clients, reputation is very important. Fix this problem before you get some negative publicity.



As some others have already stated, the process your friend proposed has done nothing but mask the holograms. After a wash or two, they will come out, and I will strongly assume that the only call you will get from this client would probably be one of disappointment. My opinion: See if you can get the car back, and fix the problem. Instead of a rotary, use a DA with a finishing polish. If you have some time, use a blue pad with some Menz 106ff. Follow up with a good wax of your choice, and you can put this one behind you.



As some others have also mentioned, it might be best for you to pick up a hood from a local junkyard. Find something that needs refurbishing, but is not so trashed that you are just "spinning your wheels". Find something dark (black, blue, red) and practice on this. Rotary is an acquired talent, and can only be perfected with hours of use.
 
Yes, this is a tough decision. I have already followed up with him (did this 2 days after the car was delivered). He was still extremely pleased with my work. At the point in time that my friend came and saved my butt it was for the sole purpose of hiding the holograms.

I'm not sure if it was clear, but before i did the whole wax/qd with the rotary to hide the holograms, i spent the night going back over the car with the DA. Maybe I'll tell him that should the swirls come back, i will fix them for free. does that sound like the best plan?

I have a pretty solid client base, all return customers, and this is the first time this has happened to me.
 
i guess as a detailer, you have a unique passion, and that is to get the car looking as good as possible. obviously for people who make a living out of detailing other people's cars will have to stop at some time, depending on the price paid, you are in a tough pickle - on the one hand u have a satisfied customer, and on the other hand, u are questioning your work quality..........i quote this from a movie "sometimes the best cure is a clear conscience" -not saying you are wrong or anything but if u feel u have done the best u can for the price paid, then just leave it, but if u feel u could have done alot better and short changed the customer for the quality of work, then by all means, work with them to rectify the situation. the fact that you have posted here and asking for advice tells me u are not happy and really want to rectify the situation. As a detailer, i think u are risking it too much to put your reputation on the line with this one job - if the customer shows his friends, and they are very picky by incident and can see the flaws, then it will be possible that bad word will spread about your work - it only takes one dissatified customer to crush your image. if it were me, i would definitely offer to redo the car for free if thats what it takes to get the car to the standard u are happy with :)
 
well, i only do detailing as a hobby... a very lucrative hobby. and as for now, being in school and working full time and such, I don't really have time or energy anymore. I think right now, I'll stick to the client base that I have, and just doing my family's/my car until i feel more confident with the rotary. Sure, i can keep PC'ing cars, but i KNOW the power of the rotary, and i would rather just keep this as a hobby.
 


eyesack said:
this is after hitting it with my dewalt 849 at 1000-1200 with a finishing pad and menz IP.





Wtf is all of that in the picture? the hazyness is after i tried to put Klasse AIO on it.
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prolly should have gone back over it with a finishing polish before applying the LSP
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eyesack said:
The guy was extremely pleased and gave me a generous tip, but i'm still not satisfied; i just have a bad feeling in my stomach like i messed up his paint really bad...?
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If the guy tipped you really well, you might consider (if it needs it) going back over it with a finishing polish, and then seal it again.









 
If this was your first time with a rotary, I HIGHLY HIGHLY suggest you go practice on a junk car or a scrap piece of metal until you get it down.



I definitely think it was a bad idea to test your rotary skill on a customers car.:nervous:



Also a process i've learned to get less holograms is pyramid the polisher. Start at 600-900RPM to spread, work the polish in at 1500-1800RPM, and then once it starts going clear, back it down to 900RPM to finish out. I believe this helped me be able to finish SIP LSP ready.



Just keep working on your technique and learn the way the polish breaks down with different pads and you will get it man!



good luck!
 
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