M105 vs OHC via Makita w/ 4" PFW

[E300Diesel]

Finally got a chance to use the M105 that I've had for some time. For a newbie I've had a difficult road so far, both cars that I play with the most '05 Taurus and '03 Corolla have rather hard paint. Sooo... everything I've tried to date via UDM and Makita hasn't had much of a dent regarding the removal of swirls in the '03 Corolla's finish.



So I tried the following for giggles to see what works best/fastest at removing the swirls.



All tests were using a Makita 9227c via PFW 4" pad

- OHC and M105 @ 2 passes.



The M105 took out most of the swirls in those 2 passes as compared to the OHC. The M105 in my experience today appeared to flash rather quickly. (Keep in my my first experiences involved the Optimum line that works forever). I spritzed the surface, and/or pad with distilled water and went at it again if needed with the M105, 1-2 passes.



I love the working time of the Optimum product, but much rather have the correcting capability of M105.



What other pads are there that are more aggressive than the PFW that I could use to remove the RIDS?



Also, I had to use isopropyl alcohol to remove any access M105 left on the paint as nothing else would make it come off, is this normal?

 

[memnuts]

I tried the exact same set up 9227c, 4"pfw and M105 on my chevy work van. I found that combo to leave some holograms in what I consider rather hard paint. M105 didn't rreally put much of a dent in the scratches and swirls. i have never had M105 not hit hard the first time out. Anyone find the same prob? I am gonna try OHC next. I forgot to bring it to work with me

 

[SuperBee364]

You guys might have the original formula 105. The new stuff isn't quite as finicky to use, but it also doesn't have the bite the original formula did.



Either formula would benefit from "pad priming" that Kevin Brown recommends, and gmblack3a does a great job of describing... Here's my lame attempt at it, since I'm too lazy to try and find a link to it.



Put a pretty darn good sized ring of polish around your pad (btw... 4" PFW's?? Usually those are only used for spot correction. I think you guys would find the bigger PFW's easier to control. Save the small pads for the A pillars and rocker panels.) Use your fingers to work the polish into the pad fibers as evenly as you can. The goal here is to kind of turn your pad into a sanding disk. Once you have the pad primed, put a small ring of 105 on the pad, put the pad to paint, and get to work. Just don't "pre spread" 105 onto your work area like you would a normal polish, or it'll dry out too fast. Also remember that 105 is meant to be used fast and hard. Use down force to do your correcting. Once the correcting is done, use just the weight of the machine for a couple passes. This will refine the finish very well. Remember that the abrasives don't break down, so you can stop whenever you want....although I *highly* recommend at least two passes using just the weight of the machine to get the best finish.



Usually when I have a problem with 105 leaving compounding marks/holograms, it's due to not doing enough light pressure (or no pressure) passes. The abrasives in 105 are very small. Small enough to leave a great finish as long as you don't push too hard.

 

[E300Diesel]

You guys might have the original formula 105. The new stuff isn't quite as finicky to use, but it also doesn't have the bite the original formula did.



Either formula would benefit from "pad priming" that Kevin Brown recommends, and gmblack3a does a great job of describing... Here's my lame attempt at it, since I'm too lazy to try and find a link to it.



Put a pretty darn good sized ring of polish around your pad (btw... 4" PFW's?? Usually those are only used for spot correction. I think you guys would find the bigger PFW's easier to control. Save the small pads for the A pillars and rocker panels.) Use your fingers to work the polish into the pad fibers as evenly as you can. The goal here is to kind of turn your pad into a sanding disk. Once you have the pad primed, put a small ring of 105 on the pad, put the pad to paint, and get to work. Just don't "pre spread" 105 onto your work area like you would a normal polish, or it'll dry out too fast. Also remember that 105 is meant to be used fast and hard. Use down force to do your correcting. Once the correcting is done, use just the weight of the machine for a couple passes. This will refine the finish very well. Remember that the abrasives don't break down, so you can stop whenever you want....although I *highly* recommend at least two passes using just the weight of the machine to get the best finish.



Usually when I have a problem with 105 leaving compounding marks/holograms, it's due to not doing enough light pressure (or no pressure) passes. The abrasives in 105 are very small. Small enough to leave a great finish as long as you don't push too hard.

Thanks Super for your insight... Actually I found the smaller pads much easier to control, especially on vertical surfaces. But I still have a lot to learn and I was not putting down a lot of force as I was worried about the paint surface getting too hot as compared to using a foam pad. I'm amazed how cool wool pads runs, or at least the PFW.



Super big of an area should I be safely working without M105 flashing too quickly?

 

[SuperBee364]

Thanks Super for your insight... Actually I found the smaller pads much easier to control, especially on vertical surfaces. But I still have a lot to learn and I was not putting down a lot of force as I was worried about the paint surface getting too hot as compared to using a foam pad. I'm amazed how cool wool pads runs, or at least the PFW.



Super big of an area should I be safely working without M105 flashing too quickly?

Yeesh, I hate to use the cop out answer of "it depends", but honestly.... it depends.



With most polishes, you can at least take a general shot and say something like 18-24 inch box, but not so with 105. As use it, you'll find that you'll be able to do a bigger and bigger area as the pad reaches it's "sweet spot", at which time you can keep polishing without adding additional product. You can do this until it starts dusting, or your polishing become non-effective. Then just spur (or brush, as appropriate) your pad and start again.



The important thing to remember about 105: Don't look for residue, look for *results*. This is kinda hard to explain... When you use a "normal" polish, you look for a residue to be left behind on the paint. Not so with 105. In fact, if you're using the right amount, there shouldn't be hardly *any* residue left behind as you polish. Instead of looking for residue, look at the paint for results of your polishing. Just because 105 stops leaving residue behind doesn't mean you have to stop polishing. Bah... this isn't making much sense. It's easily seen, hard to explain. A good example of what I'm trying (and not succeeding) to explain is Meg's original 105 training video. The one where he wetsands a hood, then removes the sanding marks with 105. You'll notice that there is almost zero residue left behind when he's done. I'll see if I can find a link to that video...



Edit: One other thing.... TotolandMach brought up a very important point last year after 105 was released: Use a good lubricating QD to remove the 105 residue. Since the abrasives don't break down, it's still very abrasive when you remove the residue. It's very easy to cause new marring just by removing 105 remnants. Especially on soft paint.

 

[E300Diesel]

The important thing to remember about 105: Don't look for residue, look for *results*. This is kinda hard to explain... When you use a "normal" polish, you look for a residue to be left behind on the paint. Not so with 105. In fact, if you're using the right amount, there shouldn't be hardly *any* residue left behind as you polish. Instead of looking for residue, look at the paint for results of your polishing. Just because 105 stops leaving residue behind doesn't mean you have to stop polishing. Bah... this isn't making much sense. It's easily seen, hard to explain. A good example of what I'm trying (and not succeeding) to explain is Meg's original 105 training video. The one where he wetsands a hood, then removes the sanding marks with 105. You'll notice that there is almost zero residue left behind when he's done. I'll see if I can find a link to that video...

I understand what you mean, I picked up on this almost as soon as I started using it yesterday in my OHC vs M105 comparison. When looking at the finish in the sun, I noticed that the area where I used M105 was virtually clear, and I didn't have to wipe when I was looking for the results as you mentioned. I was working M105 until it dissapeared off th surface and/or dusted. If need be I spritzed some distilled water if I wanted to work it a little more...





And in reference to the amount of pressure. Is it safe to assume that the amount of pressure needed when using this combo