Layering Carnauba - - does it work?

Speaking of shocks, I'm in the process of getting some for my Camaro!!! hahah



They are aluminum drag racing 16 way adjustable coil overs for the front and and just shocks for the rear.



I notice Klasse AIO gets my paint a little cleaner with two layers, one just doesnt cut it for me.
 
breakneckvtec said:
When it comes to detailing, me = newb...



When it comes to performance, honda/acura, me = genious...



Jngr- I need to correct you here, if you kept the tires proportionate to the rim, ie plus sized them, your no higher or lower. Coilovers are great for adjustability, but rarely do you change the settings, it can be tough work. Most people who go for coilovers like the higher spring rates they offer, or in the case of Ground controls, customizeable rates. I have Skunk2's coilovers on my Si, really high rates, 500F and 400R. Great for handling, not such a stock feeling ride. If comfort is important to you my suggestion is Eibach Prokits. The other problem with high spring rates is eventually you need a high performance shock as your stock ones will wear out. They just cant keep up. I needed to go with koni yellow adjustables on my car, my stockers blew after 6 months. I went with the coilovers because I autoX my car. If thats not your cup of tea and you want to keep a nice ride, keep your stock shocks, and just want added looks the Eibach prokit springs will drop you 3/4" exactly, perfect for what you want I think.:xyxthumbs
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eh, wayward thread...oh well :D

yeah, I love my Teins on my grocery-getter Accord...right now they're not super stiff because I don't want a sore back. Jngrbrdman, get some true coilovers (vs. the sleeves)...it's worth it.
 
Ok, guys... no more tuning posts to hijack this thread further. :p Start another one in Customizing or something. :dance
 
Interesting you should say that, I was just thinking to myself what layering different carnubas would do. I think it would most likely end up being pointless, whatever carnuba is on top is what kind of look you will get, I think.
 
DETAILKING said:
Shine increase is possible with the addition of more oils. Durability, however, remains about the same as a fresh rewax.
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If so, then it would probably make more sense just to use a carnauba-content QD, like Pinnacle Crystal Mist...Correct?
 
LowTech said:
If so, then it would probably make more sense just to use a carnauba-content QD, like Pinnacle Crystal Mist...Correct?
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Yes but I doubt the qd spray alone would give you that deep wet long lasting (long compared to the lifespan of a spray) shine a wax can offer.
 
joed1228 said:
Yes but I doubt the qd spray alone would give you that deep wet long lasting (long compared to the lifespan of a spray) shine a wax can offer.
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I agree. My thinking is that carnauba *can* be layered to some degree, provided the first coat cures for about a day. If the coat hasn't cured, then I agree that we're just pushing the same product around...



But if layering carnauba paste wax is fiction, then a carnauba-based QD may be a time-saver for approximately the same benefit. Still, my own observation on black additional coats (1-2) make it better...
 
........another hypethetical......if you wax with a carnuba, let it cure,add another layer and use a carnuba QD after the first layer untill the second and anytime thereafter...aren't you layering carnuba on carnuba with every wipe down of the QD? Even though it's a minute amount....you are still adding carnuba to carnuba.:D



PEACE
 
Layering carnuba will cause a wax buildup this in turn will make the finish cloudy you can layer polymers Put your wax on like S100 every 6 to 8 weeks use a cleaner like SEPC every 5 to 6 months After every wash use a Qd spray like E.O.wipe and shine and everthing will be fine
 
Are you really layering? As far as carnauba goes, it evaporates , and washes off and melts off. So by the time you put the next coat on, you had already lost a fair portion of it. So it is more of a constant replentishing rather than a layering.



The QD is the same. Its a partial top up. The QD top up probably would only last a wek to a fortnight on a daily driver. So you aren't really getting this big build, rather you are maintaining it.:cool:
 
Originally posted by Mirror

Are you really layering? As far as carnauba goes, it evaporates , and washes off and melts off. So by the time you put the next coat on, you had already lost a fair portion of it. So it is more of a constant replentishing rather than a layering.
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I'm on the same page with you on this. This wax layering debate is about as controversial as the oil change interval controversy. Without using an electron microscope there's no hard evidence proving wax can be layered. All we have to go by is the subjective eye, which can be fooled by the brain. If you really believe you can layer wax, when you do it, your results look better than before. I don't even think the idea of layering wax would even have come up if it wasn't for products like Zaino, Klasse and such which truly can be layered.



For me, I'll just keep waxing my car every 2 or 3 weeks and believe I'm just replenishing my wax. :D
 
Mirror said:
Are you really layering? As far as carnauba goes, it evaporates , and washes off and melts off. So by the time you put the next coat on, you had already lost a fair portion of it. So it is more of a constant replentishing rather than a layering.



The QD is the same. Its a partial top up. The QD top up probably would only last a wek to a fortnight on a daily driver. So you aren't really getting this big build, rather you are maintaining it.:cool:
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Very good point:bow I suppose alot does depend on temp,time of year, conditions,how & where the vehicle is kept, ect, but I'm with you on this one.

DAMN THIS FORUM THING IS FUN! :bounce



PROCEED..........



:wavey
 
You know how it is with us old farts - really hard to give up on an idea! I wore the uniform from ‘52 thru ‘72 and spit shined a lot of shoes and boots. For those who haven’t done it, here’s how it goes: You take a damp cotton ball, put on a very small amount of Kiwi polish, rub until the polish is gone from the cotton ball - never buffing or brushing. Repeat many, many, many times - and gradually that dull and rough GI leather looks more and more like patent leather! It’s been over thirty years since I’ve spit shined any boots, but IIRC it took probably at least 100 repeats of the cycle, maybe more. Scratch repair worked the same way. Once the boots looked like mirrors it only took 3-5 applications every couple of days to maintain the finish - maybe ten minutes work.



A few days ago I started playing with this idea on three test areas on my Jet Black paint using P21S, Souverän, and Zymöl Carbon. Using a 5â€� square of microfiber dampened with distilled water as the applicator, putting a tiny amount of wax on the cloth, and lightly rubbing until all traces of the wax were gone. Repeated maybe twenty times. All three test areas have some underlying minor micro-marring. Preliminary results are that P21S works best, followed by Souverän, then Zymöl - seems to be related to the amount of oils/solvents in the wax. It probably takes twice as many applications of Zymöl as P21S to get the same results. We haven’t had any sun since I started this, so I can’t make a good evaluation of depth (halogen or fluorescent just isn’t the same), but the micro-marring is starting to disappear!



Mirror said:
Are you really layering? As far as carnauba goes, it evaporates , and washes off and melts off. So by the time you put the next coat on, you had already lost a fair portion of it. So it is more of a constant replenishing rather than a layering.
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Doing the “spit shine� method you’re separating the applications by less than a minute - not much evaporates in that time!



I don’t know if I’m up to doing a hundred plus coats of P21S on the entire car, but the idea is fun to play with!



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Nick T. said:


Doing the “spit shine� method you’re separating the applications by less than a minute - not much evaporates in that time!



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True but, I also subscribe to the theory that if you do them a minute apart, very quickly you are just moving the wax around.



Of course a second and a third coat, I believe helpful, incase of a small miss spot or a spot that wasn't quite coated enough, but after full coverage, I think its best to wait a week, then replentish.



Just after one week and one wash, I believe you have lost about 30% of your carnauba. I live in sunny Queensland. No snow here. Probably the equivalent of your California only a far more spread out and far fewer people. :cool:
 
Would using a paste, over a liquid of the same wax count as layering different waxes?

I think I read somewhere on here that liquid waxes will not layer properly.(they remove much of the last layer- or is that only cleaner waxes?)

I used Megs Gold Class liquid last (using it up before I get some S100), but could use Mothers California carnauba paste over it.

Thoughts?

Oh- and does anyone know if Megs Gold Class liquid is a cleaner wax, or can it be layered?

TIA!
 
After six weeks of playing with layering carnaubas on my Jet Black roadster - P21S, Souverän, and S100 pastes - I’ve reached some conclusions:



Yes, layering does improve the reflectivity and depth, but it’s like layering Zaino in that the most dramatic improvement is in the first few layers. After 3-5 layers the improvement with each layer is so small that it takes another 3-4 layers to see as much improvement as could be seen between the second and third layer.



Applying the “standard� amount of carnauba, letting it start to haze, then removing does not seem to give very much improvement when layering! What has given excellent results for me is to work on a small area, say two square feet, and put a small amount of wax on a small piece of MF towel. Apply evenly over the work area, then continue to wipe (up/down & left/right) lightly until the wax almost disappears. Repeat on the next small area, then wipe off the first area. Repeat on succeeding areas. A very light misting with distilled water when applying seems to help to give a harder finish. The process can be repeated immediately, but better results are obtained by waiting several hours, or overnight, before adding another layer. This method gives a hard, oil free, very slick surface. Rubbing with a clean, dry finger does not produce any smudging, smearing, or marring! Almost a Zaino-like finish, but with the depth of carnauba!



As with using Zaino, if you're going to put this much effort into the final steps, it really pays to have a near perfect underlying paint surface! Put your major effort into paint preparation - clay, polish out the surface defects, then polish again with a cleaner/polish. You’ll be amazed with the end results!



I’ve also been playing with using 3M IHG between layers of these carnaubas - but have gotten mixed results. Sometimes it works and the micro-marring is hidden, sometimes it doesn’t. It seems to be a matter of technique in applying both the IHG and the next layer of carnauba, but I don’t have it pinned down yet. BTW, I’m checking my results using a pair of 500W halogens so not many flaws escape detection.



As always, YMMV!
 
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