MrCLRider
loves rubbing paint
this has been a very informative thread, thank you all!
I want to be the best of the best
- Thread starter LCharlie's
- Start date
imported_Jakerooni
New member
David Fermani said:
In my opinion.... Yes. I would look at all of those guys as less skilled IF the only thing they know how to do on a professional level is paint correction. They in my book would no longer be considered detailers but rather paint correction specialist. Is it bad? Nope. not at all.. just different. It's like going to a body shop and you have one guy that sprays the paint. It's all he does and he's very good at it.. But he's not a body shop man, he dosen't have the skills to get the dents out or replace the glass... he's just a painter. To me if you're going to call your'self a detailer or a "Master" detailer you better know the entire package inside and out. Not only be able to get that paint super glossy but make that inside look like it just got installed too. You may not have to do everything all the time but you really should know how to do everything all the time because you never know when something comes up. And I know full well some of those guys you listed do very nice interior work as well so your list really isn't accurate in saying they just work on paint.
David Fermani said:
Depends on your market. If you are dealing with high end car guys, swirl removal is very important. The average person, sad to say, will notice scratches but not the swirls and the interior is very important to them because that is where they spend their time. You'd be stunned at all the cars I have done that the owner is pointing out random scratches but is completely unaware how the swirls detract from the appearance of the paint. :wall
flash gordon
New member
David Fermani said:
So are you trying to tell me you do nothing but "Paint Corrections" and you can keep busy 5-6 days a week(Full-Time), 52 weeks a year.....What do you tell the customer when he says "My interior is a wreck also"?
flash gordon
New member
Scottwax said:
I couldn't agree more
imported_Picus
New member
jrib said:
I can tell you that. I don't do interiors. I have almost stopped offering wash & waxes a service except to previous clients. 95% of my work is paint correction details (which includes all the other exterior stuff). I work 7 days a week from ~March 1st through mid December.
If the customer asks me to do their interior I usually point them in the direction of a place that specializes in interior work.
I am not sure where the perception comes from that you must perform some service in order to be successful. I certainly think it would behoove most people to do interiors, especially as they build their reputation; but for some guys it isn't necessary.
Is the market I am in a niche market? For sure. I understand most people don't give a damn about swirls, but enough of them do to keep me busy.
imported_Picus
New member
dan46n2 said:
If that was the case I'd be out of business. I am not saying it's an art, I am saying it's a skill which requires experience. I'd say 50% of my details involve fixing someone elses mistakes (in most cases, holograms). It was the same in San Francisco. If paint correction was so easy I don't think I'd see so many cars with holograms.
Again, when I say paint correction I don't mean 50% reduction in swirls with a PC. I mean as close to 100% defect removal as possible.
Accumulator
Well-known member
dan46n2 said:
Heh heh, you just insulted a whole lot of people who are, by and large, far from being morons.
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
Jakerooni said:
Jake – I think you’re missing my original point. I’m not disqualifying the aspect that top “detailers� (not paint correction specialists) should be a master of all aspects of the trade. I’m disagreeing with the points AppliedColors made about:
AppliedColors said:
That’s obviously NOT accurate. Don’t you agree?
dan46n2 said:
I think you’re on the wrong forum to make these ignorant blanket statements. Sorry you don’t have enough pride/knowledge/skill to know the difference. Doing PRO work requires A LOT more than “following directions�. I’d love to see some of your work. LOL.
imported_Jakerooni
New member
Yea I can agree with you on that one Dave. There are alot of specialist making a pretty penny doing what they do and nothing else. But I would have to think before they "niched" themselves into whatever it is they do specifically they we're more of a broad spectrum detailer and actually did do the whole package. I could be wrong but I hope I'm not.
imported_rydawg1
New member
What a funny thread...
I myself, speacialize in paint correction and nothing else. I stay very busy for the most part pleasing the hardest to please clients and enjoy doing so. All my work is 100% word of mouth and my clients rave about my top shelf work. I let them go over the car with different light sources to inspect my work after done and I also gaurantee my work on certain jobs that no swirls will ever come back.
I have perfected numerous paint correction jobs where other pro detailers could not even fix. I just put all my dedication and passion into my work and in the end it turns into a glowing masterpiece.
Is this an art? All my clients tell me that watching me it's an art. So coming from them, yes it is. The dedication, skill, eye, tools, passion, etc., all make it an art to me.
Also, I have not even touched an interior in almost 2 years.
We all have our niche in what we do and love to do to earn money. The real question is... Do you have passion and put it into all of your work?
I myself, speacialize in paint correction and nothing else. I stay very busy for the most part pleasing the hardest to please clients and enjoy doing so. All my work is 100% word of mouth and my clients rave about my top shelf work. I let them go over the car with different light sources to inspect my work after done and I also gaurantee my work on certain jobs that no swirls will ever come back.
I have perfected numerous paint correction jobs where other pro detailers could not even fix. I just put all my dedication and passion into my work and in the end it turns into a glowing masterpiece.
Is this an art? All my clients tell me that watching me it's an art. So coming from them, yes it is. The dedication, skill, eye, tools, passion, etc., all make it an art to me.
Also, I have not even touched an interior in almost 2 years.
We all have our niche in what we do and love to do to earn money. The real question is... Do you have passion and put it into all of your work?
Kevin Brown
New member
My take on the "art"... as discussed on another forum...
Then, another follow up to clarify the opinion:
Kevin Brown said:
Then, another follow up to clarify the opinion:
Kevin Brown said:Oh man, drama from the artist directly... :sosad
With all due respect, let me put this in layman's terms, my friend...
Two "art class" graduates attend their first car show.
They see two cars side by side. The first is a Porsche 959 (best car ever made) with a placard giving a guy named Kevin Brown credit for polishing the paint on this pitbull of a car.
"This Kevin guy is deep. Notice how perfectly all those squiggly little lines match up and intersect... It's like he's trying to tell us that, although the car is beautiful, it is only a car. But using only his polishing machine and rudimentary support tools, he is able to relay his passion for mankind, and he is using the car's paint as a canvas which represents the earth, and the squiggly lines represent man, and when mankind works together and criss-crosses paths while working towards one common goal, the earth is a better place."
Next, they see a Bentley with a placard giving Todd credit for polishing the paint on this jewel of a car.
"Sure, I get that, too. But this new age art using electricity and all... it's not for me. Too noisy, anyway, and imagine the carbon footprint. No, REAL art is done by hand. I saw a guy back in 1974, NO!, 1971... yes, and he had created a bee-U-tiful pattern similar to that on the Porsche, YET- it was all done using only the man's hands, a swatch of soft material, some green can of pasty substance, and nothing else. I watched that guy sweating and swearing and throwing things- he had to drink something like 12 beers just to rehydrate and energize his body. That, my friend, was art. I'll bet this car was done by hand, too. It's obvious to me that this Todd chap creates his art by hand. Todd's artwork, as shown on this piece before us represents purity, simplicity, and creativity in a world that is otherwise complicated by technology. The fact that he used a Bentley further supports my thoughts on the matter."
"You are a fool."
No, you're just too shallow to understand the creative heart."
An old codger overhearing this, cannot contain himself. He chimes in.
"Fellas, I don't know a lot about art, but I know paint. And I know cars. And I am here to tell you, it's either right or wrong, black or white. Paint is either perfect, or it ain't perfect. Naw, no gray area when it comes to doin' a job righhhhht. The paint on this car was done by a craftsman. It takes a whole lotta practice to get paint to look like this here. Now that Por-shee... A real fool did that one. Paint polishing is not art- it's a craft. It's either PERFECT or MESSED UP".
The two art graduates looked confused as the angry old man scuffled away over the horizon.
Kinda like y'all after readin' this silly and foolish made-up story.
The End.
I do believe that someone CAN be an artist and craftsman, though...
art 1 |ärt|
noun
1 the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power.
4 a skill at doing a specified thing, typically one acquired through practice : the art of conversation.
artist |ˈärtist|
noun
• a person skilled at a particular task or occupation : a surgeon who is an artist with the scalpel.
craft |kraft|
noun
• a skilled activity or profession : the historian's craft.
• skill in carrying out one's work : a player with plenty of craft.
craftsman |ˈkraf(t)smən|
noun ( pl. -men)
a person who is skilled in a particular craft.
• an artist.
imported_Picus
New member
Jakerooni said:
That is probably true, it is/was for me. I had to build a reputation. I still do the "whole package" in terms of exterior, just not interiors. I never did offer an interior only service. Well, I did, I just never actually did it.
AppliedColors
New member
Paint perfecting is certainly an art. It takes a lot of patience and experience to achieve a perfect finish.
As a business, though, it's a long road. To make a full time living, you'll need the following conditions:
1. Large city or city with a significant wealth population (Santa Fe and Veil come to mind).
2. A significant number of affluent car enthusiasts.
3. Preferably, lots of sunny weather (So. Cal, Florida, Texas, Vegas are excellent markets).
4. Years of word-of-mouth recommendations among affluent car enthusiasts.
5. Personal relationships with influential business owners (ie, High end collision shops, Euro repair shops, and exotic car dealers).
6. A solid online reputation and referal network.
For someone just starting, it takes many many years to develop a full calendar 52 weeks a year doing just paint correction. I'd guess less than 5% of full time detailers nationwide fit this description.
Unfortunately, a lot of hobbiests make the jump to full time without this awareness. They find that they can't make a living doing paint corrections (not enough work) and are dissatisfied with doing the dirty work (dog hair, vomit, odor, mold, moss, water spots) of a typical full time detailer.
I think this side of the story should be told here as well as the glamourous side.
As a business, though, it's a long road. To make a full time living, you'll need the following conditions:
1. Large city or city with a significant wealth population (Santa Fe and Veil come to mind).
2. A significant number of affluent car enthusiasts.
3. Preferably, lots of sunny weather (So. Cal, Florida, Texas, Vegas are excellent markets).
4. Years of word-of-mouth recommendations among affluent car enthusiasts.
5. Personal relationships with influential business owners (ie, High end collision shops, Euro repair shops, and exotic car dealers).
6. A solid online reputation and referal network.
For someone just starting, it takes many many years to develop a full calendar 52 weeks a year doing just paint correction. I'd guess less than 5% of full time detailers nationwide fit this description.
Unfortunately, a lot of hobbiests make the jump to full time without this awareness. They find that they can't make a living doing paint corrections (not enough work) and are dissatisfied with doing the dirty work (dog hair, vomit, odor, mold, moss, water spots) of a typical full time detailer.
I think this side of the story should be told here as well as the glamourous side.
imported_Jakerooni
New member
I'd say less than 1% would actually fit that bill.
Barry Theal
New member
dan46n2 said:
wow im gonna take this comment as a complete insult to me and many others. im not the highest educated nor do i claim to be. i struggle with spelling as i am dislexic. now for me collage wasn't an option so i choose to go to the military and became an infantry soldier. not some officer. but i can garreuntee i worked my *** off for your freedom to insult me like that. for the last 11 years i have been working so hard to perfect the "ART" of detailing. am i the best? no there are far to many skilled professionals out there in this business to say anyone is the best. now in 11 years i have learned to take an everyday car litterly and turn it into a respectfull driver. i do this by putting my heart and soul into everything. your right this career path dosen't take a rocket scientist to do, but what it does take is years of practice and hard work to master. i think im at the point where i can honestly say ill put my skills up against anyones and do my best. now why do i say this? simply put i can. i can say this because i have devoted everyday of my life to this business. not only learning but helping. its people like you wwho just truely don't understand. you don;t know what its like to sit and work and work and work to remove the finest scratch that no one will see but you. sure anyone can half *** a car, but can someone truly perfect a car? this is where passion meets perfection. anyway, im gonna go before i say something i regret! :usa
Barry Theal
New member
rydawg said:
oh yea. that comment kills me in a good way lmao:bow
imported_rydawg1
New member
Jakerooni said:
Your about right on that or atleast close to it.
With the thousands of detailers out there, I am sure there are only 1% or less of that that only do paint correction strictly.
I never chose this profession, it kind of just came to me. It's a real long story.:LOLOL
imported_rydawg1
New member
bufferbarry said:
Haha.
99% of my clients all have super clean interiors and clean their own cars. It's the perfecting the paint that they can not do themselves.
If I do get an interior, I normally pay Rick to do them as he is amazing at interiors.
I just hate getting inside of a car and I stick to what I am best at...perfecting paint..