Hot and cold hose bib

Aurora40 said:
Oh, I thought they just had the shut-off valve really far back so that it's inside the wall...
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Well, we'll see when you get it, but again, I sorta think it's just my boosted pressure. Anyhow, outside the house it shouldn't be an issue...



Just FWIW, unless yours is somehow very different from what I expect, there isn't really a shutoff back behind it. Looking at the pics on this thread, the thing that'll relieve the pressure (and thus keep the pipes from bursting) is the brass cylindrical thing with the series of holes around its outward face. Backflow is built into that too, IIRC. Heh heh, more info than you ever wanted to hear about a water spigot, huh ;)
 
I thought that holed thing was just the backflow preventer so water can't get sucked in the hose and into your water supply? I don't think that would stop freezing. It's like if you freeze an open bottle. If the shape of the opening/neck doesn't allow it to push as it freezes, or if it freezes too fast, you'll still break the bottle. Since a bib would probably freeze from the end in, I doubt it would push through those holes/valve as that part will already be solid, thus your pipe would still burst. :nixweiss



Also, you buy the thing based on your wall thickness, which I think is because the thicker the wall, the further in the shut-off has to be. They have them from like 4" to 12+" lengths.
 
i am not sure but i think that thing with the holes is whatss makes sure the faucet is drained back into the wall where the shut offs are even if a hose is still attached. if a hose was attatched and it still had a nozzle on the other end of the hose and the nozzle was shut off and the hose was full there would be no place for the water to drain so it releives the presser through the holes to drain the faucet if it isnt able to through the hose connection did that make sense ?
 
On a freeze proof hose bib the water is shut off at the end of the long tube that is attached to the shut off nozzle. This allows the water to remain in the house where it wont freeze. Whereas a regular hose bib actually shuts off directly under the handle. If you can get a bib with the hot and cold handle built on like the one "detailbarn" is showing above there should be no reason for a mixing valve. You act as a mixing valve controling the temp of the water with the dial controls.
 
An easy way to get the temp of the water that you want is to turn the hot water valve on all the way till it stops. Then, just adjust the cold water valve to the temp. that you want.
 
If your hot water tank is easy to get to (not in your attic) you could hook up a water hose to the drain valve located on the bottom of the tank. You could use another water hose coupled to a crossover to mix hot and cold water together to get warm water. This would keep you from having to knock a hole in the side of your house and have unsightly plumbing. This would be good your water heater good since it's supposed to be drained every now and then anyway.
 
Lets clear up some facts here:



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Accumulator

It's the same thing that relieves pressure if the line freezes. The cylindrical thing that screws into it (and it has weird threads so you can't just replace it easily) will "pop off" at a certain pressure regardless of what causes it. I dunno, my problem might be due to my boosted pressure, but I just wanted to give a heads-up. I can't really use the one in the subbasement (at least with a hose on it) until I get a different one in there.
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It's actually called a vacuum breaker, and yes you will not find one at True Value. All to often the manufactures are putting machine threads on these--keeps you coming back to them. And as the Accumulator has found out it works. Accumulator I don't think your problem is pressure, the vacuum breaker has gone bad. I know I have the exact same one on my house, and it does the same thing. Wifes has been complaining about it for the last several years. My own house is always the last one to get fixed:rolleyes:



The purpose of the vacuum breaker is to prevent anything from being sucked back into the potable lines. Say things like car wash soap, fertilizer, sewage, you name, you don't want that back in your drinking lines. Vacuum breakers are a good thing, and just something that has to be maintained and replaced once and awhile. They are about a 3-5 dollar item I am guess (the other brand of bibb that I use--those V.B. are that much).







Aurora40



Originally posted by Accumulator

It's the same thing that relieves pressure if the line freezes.
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Oh, I thought they just had the shut-off valve really far back so that it's inside the wall. As long as it angles down a bit there wont' be any water in the outside part to freeze.



But still, obviously yours is spraying. Here's hoping the mixing valve won't do that...
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Accumulator is kind of right on this. The vacuum breaker does relieve pressure, but it's not a freeze prevention item. You can put a noozle on the end of your hose put pressure on it and then turn off the faucet, and the hose will maintain pressure if the vacuum breaker is working right. If there is a sudden drop in pressure on either side of the vacuum breaker it will release the pressure and you will see it spit all over.



The water is actually shut off way back in the faucet. There is a rod that travels down the shaft to shut the water off. You want the bibb to extend past the wall to the inside where it is warm. If the shut-off ends up in the wall and if freezes and breaks you may not know if for quite a while.



Accumulator if your having problems with the vacuum breaker PM I can help you with it. Seems alot better to do that then take out a good hose bibb. If anyone else needs help or wants to buy a bibb, let me know I may be able to save you money.
 
OI812 - Thanks for clearing that up, as you could tell my understanding of these things is imperfect at best :o Should've paid closer attention when my plumbing guy was here working on it.



I'm gonna replace the one in our subbasement anyhow as I prefer the ones I have in the (new) garage (for one thing, they don't drain as much water after you shut them off). But I still don't know if the one I have now is working correctly or not. Most likely "not". It was checked out by my plumbing contractor, who changed out the vacume breaker without solving the problem. Still sprays water when you shut the nozzle on the hose. Done it since the day they installed the thing.



Glad to hear this isn't some nature-of-the-beast thing and that Aurora40 shouldn't have any problems.
 
I suspect that you are somehow getting a pressure diffential between the line pressure and the hose. Hard for me to depict without seeing it, you know if you want to send me a plane ticket--:D may I could help. You know it is the season of giving;) . Anyway Woodford does make good bibbs, and they make some not so good bibbs. If you have the one I am thinking of you have a good one. Just because you replace the bibb, you may still have the same problem. Just be aware of that. Hope that helps.
 
Nope, they didn't get it in yet and aren't open today. So I guess I'll be installing it after Christmas. :(



It was in the 50's yesterday and 60's the day before, but it poured yesterday so any washing efforts would have been for nothing. This weekend will be 20's, so I guess I'm not missing out yet. Thanks for the offer to help. I could mail you an Old Dominion, an excellent local brew. It might arrive frozen, though... ;) :)
 
Originally posted by Aurora40

Accumulator, is your pressure booster an on-demand thing, or constant? If it's on-demand, then maybe any anti-drainback valve will blow off water.
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It's on-demand (I think, I really am hopelessly ignorant about this :o ), with the pump coming on whenver the pressure drops below a certain point.



OI812 said:
I suspect that you are somehow getting a pressure diffential between the line pressure and the hose. Hard for me to depict without seeing it.. Just because you replace the bibb, you may still have the same problem. Just be aware of that. Hope that helps.
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Yeah, it's sorta a head-scratcher. My other bibbs (the different style ones I have in the "new garage" where I detail) don't do it and I don't have any problems with the sillcocks (sp?) mounted through the walls so :nixweiss I'm hopeful that just replacing it with the kind in the garage will solve my problem. If it *doesn't* fix it, well, at least my plumbing contractor doesn't charge me for work that doesn't solve problems and I can live without using a hose in the subbasement if I have to.
 
Tried swapping it with another (identical) one, no change. I thought about having a "cheater" (straight pipe) machined with the correct threads but decided to go with the bibb that I like better anyhow. I don't do much in the subbasement, especially this time of year; it's primarily storage and lawn equipment. So it's not a really pressing matter. My plumber has the new bibb, so the next time he's out this way we'll see if that solves my problem.
 
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