Help! Noob with JB BMW paint

T

Technics

New member
Hey guys, I fear I may be over my head on this one.

I ran across this '09 335i six speed with only 30k on it. Lets just say I'v been looking forever for a car like this, loaded with all options AND manual. Ok great, I had to pull the trigger. The car is pristine, interior is like new, there are about 4 stone chips on the whole car, no paint work, not even a ding on any panel. Florida only car, no winters, weekend only car.

HOWEVER, I got a chance to wash her last night and put it under the lights in my garage for the first time. Water spots etched ALL over the hood, marring, scratching and spiderwebs galore. How can a car with such low mileage look like this!?!? Im dumbfounded. Needless to say some serious correction is needed.

Based on my research this paint is a professionals nightmare! I wouldn't even classify myself as an intermediate. However I take great pride in my cars and do most of the work on them myself. So this is something that I want to tackle.

Sooo, I need some recommendations on how to approach correction on this thing. Products, pads, techniques. I guess a need something that is somewhat fool proof so I don't risk damaging the paint further. Time is no concern and from what I read I will be putting long hours into this project anyway.

Thanks for any help!!
 

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Beautiful BMW, and it sounds like you scored a great deal. I've got a 09 E93 - but with black sapphire metallic paint.

Don't fear your Jet Black paint, it can be corrected with the right combination of product and tools. Before we go any further, what do you current own or have access to? Do you have a dual action polisher? Have you already bought compounds or polishes? What you budget?
 
Angus said:
Beautiful BMW, and it sounds like you scored a great deal. I've got a 09 E93 - but with black sapphire metallic paint.

Don't fear your Jet Black paint, it can be corrected with the right combination of product and tools. Before we go any further, what do you current own or have access to? Do you have a dual action polisher? Have you already bought compounds or polishes? What you budget?
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Oh nice car! I like the verts as well.

I have some old polishes and compounds but I plan on buying everything new and fresh for this job.

So far I have the Griots Garage 6" polisher and a few LC Orange pads.

I have more time than money to spend at this point (lol) so I'm looking to keep the budget on the low end for now if that's possible. Maybe $200 or so? The lower the better.
 
First things first...

It takes a skilled professional, with a ton of experience, to be able to remove some etched water spots WITHOUT compromising the integrity of the clear coat.

The clear coat on your paint is about a sheet of a paper thick, maybe slightly less. If you remove more than 30% of this you could face long-term damage as you have removed approximately 80% of the UV inhibitors. Remove 50% of your clear it won't take long for the damage to show up...

If you are an absolute beginner, I would suggest having somebody do this work for you. Keep in mind that they may (wisely) stop before getting all, or even most, of the marks out. That's why you are paying them - they have the experience to diagnosis the depth of the damage and keep your paint intact.

Should you really want to try this yourself, keep the motto "least aggressive" method in your mind at all times.

Start with a finishing pad and fine grade polish on your GG6, and go from there. If that doesn't work (probably won't) move up to a more aggressive polish and pad, then finally if needed, a compound and microfiber cutting disc.

If the water spots are deep, even aggressive compounding may not remove them. In this case, wet sanding (because of the even planning motion of sandpaper wrapped around a stiff block) will probably give your the best results. However this is a huge job, and can take a professional 30 hours to complete, if not more. If you are doing this, you should budget at least 50 hours.

Also keep in mind that you will screw something up. You may not, but more than likely you will, so make peace with that now.
 
I see, I knew I had my work cut out for me.

Maybe I'm misusing the term etched in. Well, the water spots on the hood are only visible under my garage light. I can't feel any ridges in the paint where they are. Is that water staining or etching?
 
Todd is man. Setting realistic expectations up front is critically important. Knowing when to turn to a professional is also a great piece of advice. Once corrected, maintaining the results will be far easier. And allow you to travel along the detailing learning curve at an easier pace while building up your inventory of supplies.

:autopia:
 
I'm definitely not an absolute beginner. This is something I will be tackling on my own.

Any product recommendations? I've been eyeing stuff from Chemical Guys.
 
There are several instances in correcting paint where I was unable to safely remove deeply etched water spots. If they are deposits on the surface then it is usually no problem. If they are etched, you really need to make sure that you take readings with a paint thickness guage to know when to stop. Even if they can't be completely removed most of the time they can be partially polished so that they don't show up as bad. I always use a paint thickness guage when I have to get aggressive on defects. Its the only way to be safe.
 
My plan would be: get 5.5" LC flat pads in 6 pk - 3 orange and 3 white (get 5" LC backing plate if you don't already have). 1 Pk Meguiars MF cutting discs. Menz FG400, PF2500, and SF4000.

My progression would be:
SF4000 on white pad
PF2500 on white pad
PF2500 on orange pad
FG400 on orange pad
FG400 on MF pad

I'd IronX and clay it first also.

Again, this is just how I would approach if it were my vehicle. CarPro has a water spot remover called Spotless...maybe try that first after claying...then go into the polishing progression. Spotless: Water Spot & Mineral Remover - 5 Liter (1.34 Gallon) - www.CarPro-US.com
 
Technics said:
I'm definitely not an absolute beginner. This is something I will be tackling on my own.

Any product recommendations? I've been eyeing stuff from Chemical Guys.
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Depending on the severity of the water spot, you might have luck removing them with CarPro's Spotless:

CarPro Spotless Water Spot Remover 500 ml.

For $9.99 its a great product to have on hand. And follows the least aggressive approach to start with.

If that doesn't produce the results your expecting stepping up to Menzerna FG-400 on your orange CCS pads followed by SF-4000 paired white CCS LC pads has produced excellent results for other forum members w/ Jet Black paint.

Menzerna Fast Gloss Compound (FG-400)
Menzerna PO106FA Super Finish A high gloss finishing solution

Topped with a thin layer of WGDGPS on a blue CCS pad you'll be all set.
 
Thanks for recommendations guys, I will take that approach and try the CarPro Spot remover as well.

That FG-400 looks to be amazing stuff!
 
Love the car, love Jet Black Paint, have had many and have Detailed probably over a hundred now..

It IS a soft paint, so your work will have to be done with this in mind.

You can get it clean pretty fast with a Rotary (which I know you dont have), and starting with more of a polish instead of a not so aggressive compound...

Just know that anything you do with something harder than that soft paint will possibly add to the defects, depending on your lighting inside (because you cannot ever do this or any black paint outside), and your patience, and skillset...

If I was going to do it, I would first carefully measure all the paintwork to see how much is on there, and if there is any paintwork after the fact, be able to detect it for future reference..

I would then use Lake Country Cyan Hydro-Shred pads in the smaller size than 6", 5.5 or whatever it is, and try to keep the surface cool while working on it.. (because I use a Rotary)..

This pad will cut well and finish down even better if you will use it correctly, on most paintwork, most of the time..

The next pad - their Tangerine Hydro-Shred will also work but will not cut initially as good, and will finish down even better...

You would want to keep the paint surfaces as cool as possible in summer heat, and be very aware of what is going on, have great lighting inside so you can really see very clearly and quickly what is happening..

Congratulations on getting a most beautiful Bimmer in the most elegant colors ever invented - Jet Black !!!

I think there are a couple of Jet Black M5's on my website.. One of them was a good friend of mine, and when he drove that big, beautiful, looks like a black hole coming at you, home, he said that everyone he got behind pulled over to the right to let him pass.. Probably thought he was the FBI or something... :)

Good luck with this !
Dan F
 
Stokdgs said:
Love the car, love Jet Black Paint, have had many and have Detailed probably over a hundred now..

It IS a soft paint, so your work will have to be done with this in mind.

You can get it clean pretty fast with a Rotary (which I know you dont have), and starting with more of a polish instead of a not so aggressive compound...

Just know that anything you do with something harder than that soft paint will possibly add to the defects, depending on your lighting inside (because you cannot ever do this or any black paint outside), and your patience, and skillset...

If I was going to do it, I would first carefully measure all the paintwork to see how much is on there, and if there is any paintwork after the fact, be able to detect it for future reference..

I would then use Lake Country Cyan Hydro-Shred pads in the smaller size than 6", 5.5 or whatever it is, and try to keep the surface cool while working on it.. (because I use a Rotary)..

This pad will cut well and finish down even better if you will use it correctly, on most paintwork, most of the time..

The next pad - their Tangerine Hydro-Shred will also work but will not cut initially as good, and will finish down even better...

You would want to keep the paint surfaces as cool as possible in summer heat, and be very aware of what is going on, have great lighting inside so you can really see very clearly and quickly what is happening..

Congratulations on getting a most beautiful Bimmer in the most elegant colors ever invented - Jet Black !!!

I think there are a couple of Jet Black M5's on my website.. One of them was a good friend of mine, and when he drove that big, beautiful, looks like a black hole coming at you, home, he said that everyone he got behind pulled over to the right to let him pass.. Probably thought he was the FBI or something... :)

Good luck with this !
Dan F
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Thanks for the kind words and advice sir! I took a look at the M5's on your sight. That's the level of shine I can only hope to achieve!

On a positive note I was applying some NXT to the hood for some temporary protection. I know NXT has some cleaning properties (?). Well, I was able to work out some of the water stains in the paint with just elbow grease. So maybe they are not as etched as I thought! That's a relief.
 
If you are working some of the water spots out with NXT then they probably are definitely not etched. NXT has very light abrasives. I would step up and try some Ultimate polish or M205 on a white pad next. It sounds like you may not need a lot of cut if NXT is actually removing some of the spots.
 
bswombaugh said:
If you are working some of the water spots out with NXT then they probably are definitely not etched. NXT has very light abrasives. I would step up and try some Ultimate polish or M205 on a white pad next. It sounds like you may not need a lot of cut if NXT is actually removing some of the spots.
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Yes, I was able to work out an entire section (after some massive triceps pump, lol) and it removed them completely.

So this is great news, I overstated how bad the etching was, but again I'm not a pro either.

I'll use something a little more aggressive next.
 
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