David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
I'd be torn choosing between taking Brittany out on the town or that clean and shiny Porsche Turbo. :crazy2:
:yay
:yay
Does fresh paint need to breathe?
- Thread starter njcarting1
- Start date
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
Sal Zaino on Refinishing waiting periods: (from the Covette Forum)
There's alot of misinformation about waiting three months for the paint to
cure.
I am a custom painter by trade. I am very familar with Dupont, PPG and
all the other paint manufacturers.
The most I personally would wait on fresh "aftermarket body shop" paint
before polishing with Zaino Show Car Polish is 1 week. That's more than sufficient
curing time.
Zaino contains no wax, harmful silicones or abrasives.....
The new paints are catalyzed. A chemical reaction cures the paint. The
older lacquers and enamels needed time for the solvents to release. This
is not the case anymore. Believe me if that paint need 3 months to dry
than it will never dry.... Just the facts.
Also.... Claying a fresh repaint is not necessary....
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
I'd disagree with that statement about freshly repainted vehicles not needing to be clayed, if only for the one instance I had a friend who got his vehicle repainted and had terrible overspray on different sections of the vehicle (wheels, glass, and yes - freshly painted panels). I am guessing the covering was removed over the front panels at some point before the rear panels were sprayed or there was an opening in the coverings. How it happened I don't know, but it did happen and it did need to be clayed. It was a reputable shop and the paint job was pretty nice - with that exception. At least it wasn't hologrammed up.
Someone else's opinion about how long it takes to cure a paint job is fine, but unless they are the ones who do the work and subsequently insure it, it's pretty much worthless. Ole Sal or Mike Phillips isn't gonna pay to have my vehicle repainted if I take it into a body shop a week after it's painted and something is wrong with it and I tell them I put some Zaino or NXT on it. I'd imagine the body shop folks would pretty much tell me I screwed it up. That's enough incentive for me to follow their instructions regardless of what any detailing-forum legend's opinion on paint cure time is. Worst case scenario? Sure. But it could happen.
Someone else's opinion about how long it takes to cure a paint job is fine, but unless they are the ones who do the work and subsequently insure it, it's pretty much worthless. Ole Sal or Mike Phillips isn't gonna pay to have my vehicle repainted if I take it into a body shop a week after it's painted and something is wrong with it and I tell them I put some Zaino or NXT on it. I'd imagine the body shop folks would pretty much tell me I screwed it up. That's enough incentive for me to follow their instructions regardless of what any detailing-forum legend's opinion on paint cure time is. Worst case scenario? Sure. But it could happen.
njcarting1
Dewey,Cheatem & Howe ESQ.
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
I can see the car getting overspray from being in and around the shop, but I've never seen a car and can't possibly fathom how a freshly painted panel could be induced to overspray while in the booth as a result of the actual process of spraying paint. While a panel is "wet", it can't be subject to overspray. Overspray occurs on a dry panel. Assuming that this shop used a downdraft type system, it sucks 100% of the non-applied paint away from the vehicle. It doesn't take that long to apply a coat of paint to an entire car. Much longer to flash in between coats and way after paint has been sucked out of the booth. Paint doesn't stay airborne that long even in a non-ventilated setting(garage). The covering isn't removed from the vehicle until several hours after the paint has been initially dried/baked. There's no reason to remove any of it during the paint application process. Anything is possible with enough incompetance(not referring to this shop), but not when one follows basic elementary painting procedures.
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
Not meant to imply I knew what happened - only that I saw the final result. For all I knew, they could have pulled it back into the booth after it was done one (or more) times.
My point was that someone like Sal Zaino posting his opinion on a forum for everyone to read is like adding the 67th book to the Bible when in reality Sal isn't in on all the pertinent info for every case. Someone may follow his advice against the paint shop's (which may be different) and then there could be a problem. Then who is left out in the cold? The customer, because they didn't listen to the paint shop.
People will probably argue this until the end of time, and I really don't understand what's so difficult in following the directions of the folks who did the work and are going to warranty it. Just seems illogical to me, but maybe I'm just a hardhead.
My point was that someone like Sal Zaino posting his opinion on a forum for everyone to read is like adding the 67th book to the Bible when in reality Sal isn't in on all the pertinent info for every case. Someone may follow his advice against the paint shop's (which may be different) and then there could be a problem. Then who is left out in the cold? The customer, because they didn't listen to the paint shop.
People will probably argue this until the end of time, and I really don't understand what's so difficult in following the directions of the folks who did the work and are going to warranty it. Just seems illogical to me, but maybe I'm just a hardhead.
Poorboy
Founder Poorboy's World
:rofl:rofl:wall:wall:rofl:rofl:wall:wall:lol2::lol2:
black bart
New member
Who the hell said Sal Zaino is the final word on anything he still recommends using cotton towels and washing with dawn
Steve pointed out that some new paint is different and may not need to have time to cure.
I also told about my local Chevrolet dealer that still uses the ole solvent type paint and it must have time to cure so JP is 100 percent correct go with what the guy that painted it he knows what he sprayed on it.
Following advice from someone who claims to be expert on internet is a good recipe for disaster.
If you have any doubt just wait you have nothing to louse the paint is not going to deteriorate in 60 days
David I find it interesting that in another thread you say sealant will not extend the life of paint but in this one you insist that paint should be sealed immediately.
People say I waxed right after painting and never had a problem, Well I waited 60 days after I painted and never had a problem so I guess the no problem argument gets us nowhere.
Steve pointed out that some new paint is different and may not need to have time to cure.
I also told about my local Chevrolet dealer that still uses the ole solvent type paint and it must have time to cure so JP is 100 percent correct go with what the guy that painted it he knows what he sprayed on it.
Following advice from someone who claims to be expert on internet is a good recipe for disaster.
If you have any doubt just wait you have nothing to louse the paint is not going to deteriorate in 60 days
David I find it interesting that in another thread you say sealant will not extend the life of paint but in this one you insist that paint should be sealed immediately.
People say I waxed right after painting and never had a problem, Well I waited 60 days after I painted and never had a problem so I guess the no problem argument gets us nowhere.
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
Just for the sake of friendly discussion....
Even though I don’t think Sal is the say all-be all of the paint world, I wouldn’t discredit his paint chemistry background and knowledge all that much actually. His family owned a body shop and he was a painter for 30 years and he’s been testing his products on new paint since 1975. Even though he’s not a paint scientist per se, his opinion must be based on some degree of real world experimenting.
Regardless, it’s not the body shop that backs the paint warranty anyways; it’s the paint manufacturer. A shop isn’t “self insured” unless they abandoned the paint line in question (which is quite prevalant). What I don’t get is all the different opinions in regards to cure time. I’m in multiple body shops every day and they all don’t have a general consensus; even when using the same paint line. It’s actually pretty ridiculous none the less. Even if you did LSP early and it prevented the film from curing and/or caused failure, there’s really no way anyone could prove it. Especially when there’s really no guidelines for indentification. You’d have to have wax residue slathered all over your car to throw off a red flag for a denial.
Back to the OT and w/o beating the dead horse too much, here’s an old post from Sal on “Paint Breathing”:
Gotcha. Makes more sense. It could have totally happened that way.
Even though I don’t think Sal is the say all-be all of the paint world, I wouldn’t discredit his paint chemistry background and knowledge all that much actually. His family owned a body shop and he was a painter for 30 years and he’s been testing his products on new paint since 1975. Even though he’s not a paint scientist per se, his opinion must be based on some degree of real world experimenting.
Regardless, it’s not the body shop that backs the paint warranty anyways; it’s the paint manufacturer. A shop isn’t “self insured” unless they abandoned the paint line in question (which is quite prevalant). What I don’t get is all the different opinions in regards to cure time. I’m in multiple body shops every day and they all don’t have a general consensus; even when using the same paint line. It’s actually pretty ridiculous none the less. Even if you did LSP early and it prevented the film from curing and/or caused failure, there’s really no way anyone could prove it. Especially when there’s really no guidelines for indentification. You’d have to have wax residue slathered all over your car to throw off a red flag for a denial.
Back to the OT and w/o beating the dead horse too much, here’s an old post from Sal on “Paint Breathing”:
No offense but late model paint technology doesn't breathe, that's an
old myth.. once it cures that's it..... The older lacquers and enamels
needed time for the solvents to evaporate and release, that is where the
term "paint breathes" comes from. Wax would seal the paint and prevent
the solvents from releasing. This led to a whole bunch of paint related
problems. That's
why paint manufacturers still tell you not to apply WAX for thirty days.
Because WAX does not let the paint breathe.. and actually suffocates
it..Funny ain't it....
All urethane paints and late technology paints use a catalyst for
hardening and curing. The paint is fully cured in about 36 to 72 hours.
njcarting1
Dewey,Cheatem & Howe ESQ.
:rofl:rofl:rofl:lmfao:lmfao:lmfao:rofl:horse::horse::horse::swirly:
everyone wants the last word...:lmfao:lmfao:rofl
everyone wants the last word...:lmfao:lmfao:rofl
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
Not me, but I’m pretty sure Sal recommends using Dawn only as a *surface prep* for his product. As of which I agree with and practice (prior to applying any LSP) w/o any problems to date thus far.
Got a link so I can see in what context I said that? But, new/refinished paint should be sealed immediately to protect it from certain environmental issues it *may* be exposed to. Will wax/sealant extend the life of paint….I seriously doubt it. If it can form a protective barrier to stop some environmental problems from destroying the finish then it could aid in its longevity. You don’t need to seal paint to make it last for decades. I know of several vintage cars with 40-50+ year old finishes that haven’t been sealed and are still doing fine.