M.Apesland
New member
Like zymol has a red wax for red cars etc. I am going to be detailing my 67 el camino that has red single stage paint.
Colour specific wax
- Thread starter M.Apesland
- Start date
togwt
The Old Grey Whistle Test
Special Waxes (Marque specific)
An organic wax, unlike a polymer, has no chemical interaction with paint; it forms a thin hard ‘shell’ as opposed to a polymer, which forms a molecular bond. Wax when it’s correctly applied is a thin translucent layer, this renewable barrier is probably less than 0.1 µ, a barely visible film, which will have very little affect on the perceivable paint colour, this applies to both clear coat and single stage paint
The base coat or colour coat is applied and a clear coat is added to provide depth and protection. Regardless of its original colour of the wax, any product applied on top of the clear coat needs to be transparent otherwise the paint colour will be muted, if you can see the colour of a wax on the paint surface it’s applied too thickly
Claims that certain waxes are formulated and / or manufactured for specific paint types, paint colours or made specifically for a certain vehicle marquee or that they are matched to particular characteristics of individual paint systems has absolutely no factual chemical basis, I think it is merely marketing hype.
For example both Porsche and Ferrari (amongst others) use Glasurit as their paint supplier, very different vehicle manufacturers. How would a wax especially made for Italian paint (Zymöl Ital) not work on a German Porsche?
The clear coat is the final original equipment manufacturers coating applied to a vehicle to protect the (base) colour coat from environmental damage, while providing both depth and a durable, glossy appearance, originally designed to protect and enhance metallic paints, but is now applied to all colours. Any product applied on top of the clear coat needs to be transparent otherwise both the paint colour and its depth of shine will be muted.
An applied wax protection is less than 0.1 µ; so the suggestion that a coating this thin could change or even enhance a colour doesn’t sound very plausible to me. Although waxes and polymers do have differing light reflectance properties and differing paint colours will reflect light differently according to their Light Reflective Value (LRV)(See Light Reflection article)
If you search (I'm using that 'bad' word again) DoDo Wax site e has some interesting ideas on the concept
An organic wax, unlike a polymer, has no chemical interaction with paint; it forms a thin hard ‘shell’ as opposed to a polymer, which forms a molecular bond. Wax when it’s correctly applied is a thin translucent layer, this renewable barrier is probably less than 0.1 µ, a barely visible film, which will have very little affect on the perceivable paint colour, this applies to both clear coat and single stage paint
The base coat or colour coat is applied and a clear coat is added to provide depth and protection. Regardless of its original colour of the wax, any product applied on top of the clear coat needs to be transparent otherwise the paint colour will be muted, if you can see the colour of a wax on the paint surface it’s applied too thickly
Claims that certain waxes are formulated and / or manufactured for specific paint types, paint colours or made specifically for a certain vehicle marquee or that they are matched to particular characteristics of individual paint systems has absolutely no factual chemical basis, I think it is merely marketing hype.
For example both Porsche and Ferrari (amongst others) use Glasurit as their paint supplier, very different vehicle manufacturers. How would a wax especially made for Italian paint (Zymöl Ital) not work on a German Porsche?
The clear coat is the final original equipment manufacturers coating applied to a vehicle to protect the (base) colour coat from environmental damage, while providing both depth and a durable, glossy appearance, originally designed to protect and enhance metallic paints, but is now applied to all colours. Any product applied on top of the clear coat needs to be transparent otherwise both the paint colour and its depth of shine will be muted.
An applied wax protection is less than 0.1 µ; so the suggestion that a coating this thin could change or even enhance a colour doesn’t sound very plausible to me. Although waxes and polymers do have differing light reflectance properties and differing paint colours will reflect light differently according to their Light Reflective Value (LRV)(See Light Reflection article)
If you search (I'm using that 'bad' word again) DoDo Wax site e has some interesting ideas on the concept
Accumulator
Well-known member
TOGWT said:
-AND-
M.Apesland said:
M.Apesland- Even with single stage, unless the paint has some weird (and unfortunate) issues, I wouldn't use the "red wax". Or rather, I wouldn't expect it to make things look much better just because it has a red pigment in it instead of something else (like, uhm....blue).
It's always tricky to determine which LSP (Last Step Product, i.e., "wax") will look best on a given paint, let alone what a given individual will prefer.
On single stage, *I* generally prefer old-school approaches such as a glaze topped with a wax. The classic example is Meguiar's M07 topped with either their M16 or M26 paste wax. I'd pick a glaze and a wax and do it that way, probably one of the various Megiar's glazes (they call 'em "Pure Polishes" and that includes M03/M05/M07 and some others) topped with Collinite 476S or 915 (unless you just *must* have the signature look of Pinnacle Sӧuveran, which will need redone after every other wash or so).
But that's just me and you might like some completely different look :nixweiss
No matter what though, you oughta consider polishing out any existing marring, assuming the paint is thick enough to withstand that.
M.Apesland
New member
Thanks. Yes I will be polishing it as I am not going to be doing the body for a while. I will get the Meg's glaze and will be ordering the collinite and pinnacle waxes.
togwt
The Old Grey Whistle Test
Wax when it’s correctly applied is a thin translucent layer, this renewable barrier is probably less than 0.1 µ, a barely visible film, which will have very little affect on the perceivable paint colour, this applies to both clear coat and single stage paint
I need to incorporate single stage paint into this article... THANKS
I need to incorporate single stage paint into this article... THANKS
Accumulator
Well-known member
TOGWT- Yeah, I just had to point that out since it really can make a little bit of difference. The way most single stage is (or at least acts :think: ) a lot more porous than b/c can make it really "soak up" products, often unevenly, with sometimes, uhm....interesting results.
And this is leaving aside the whole issue of older-tech ss, where the "feed the paint" thing isn't the BS that it is with more modern paints. You know, the stuff behind why Meguiar's originally called M07 "Sealer and Reseal Glaze".
The "best looking" of those Meguiar's glazes/"pure polishes" is their M07, but it can be a royal PIA to work with (streaking/etc.). The easiest to use (by FAR) is M05 and it's my fave for that reason despite its so-so looks. Their M03 (don't let the "machine polish" name scare you off it, works fine by hand) is kinda in the middle and so is their M81 (dunno if they still make it or not). The Deep Crystal Step#2 Polish is another one of these glazes to consider (if, again, they still make it).
Note how I'm a bit out of touch on the current offerings. That's because I don't use 'em much, even on my older single stage car. But they're still the "conventional widsom answer" for this and you might think the approach is perfect (many do).
On the wax, while I do use/like the Pinnacle Sӧuveran, I only use it on a vehicle that gets waxed *every* time it gets used/washed, and I haven't gotten that car out of mothballs for years. SO....I really think you oughta go with the Collinite instead. IF the car doesn't look OK it won't be because you used Collinite instead of Sӧuveran. I mean, really...do you want to rewax the vehicle *every* time for an appearance diff that's minimal at best? You might even *prefer* the look of the Collinite, wouldn't surprise me a bit.
And this is leaving aside the whole issue of older-tech ss, where the "feed the paint" thing isn't the BS that it is with more modern paints. You know, the stuff behind why Meguiar's originally called M07 "Sealer and Reseal Glaze".
M.Apesland said:
The "best looking" of those Meguiar's glazes/"pure polishes" is their M07, but it can be a royal PIA to work with (streaking/etc.). The easiest to use (by FAR) is M05 and it's my fave for that reason despite its so-so looks. Their M03 (don't let the "machine polish" name scare you off it, works fine by hand) is kinda in the middle and so is their M81 (dunno if they still make it or not). The Deep Crystal Step#2 Polish is another one of these glazes to consider (if, again, they still make it).
Note how I'm a bit out of touch on the current offerings. That's because I don't use 'em much, even on my older single stage car. But they're still the "conventional widsom answer" for this and you might think the approach is perfect (many do).
On the wax, while I do use/like the Pinnacle Sӧuveran, I only use it on a vehicle that gets waxed *every* time it gets used/washed, and I haven't gotten that car out of mothballs for years. SO....I really think you oughta go with the Collinite instead. IF the car doesn't look OK it won't be because you used Collinite instead of Sӧuveran. I mean, really...do you want to rewax the vehicle *every* time for an appearance diff that's minimal at best? You might even *prefer* the look of the Collinite, wouldn't surprise me a bit.
LeadingEdgeDetail
New member
In my opinion, Meguiars #16 would be the perfect candidate for a single-stage red Classic car... it has been around since dirt was invented...
I've had good results with Meguires #9 on single stage paint. Also, like Autoglym Super Resin Polish for one stage.
Also, "color-coded" polish has been around for years, marketed as "color magic" or, previously "color match". I've used these products to (temporarily) hide light scratches, or fill tiny chips. Until recently, it came in all kinds of colors, but I only see black on the shelves now.
Also, "color-coded" polish has been around for years, marketed as "color magic" or, previously "color match". I've used these products to (temporarily) hide light scratches, or fill tiny chips. Until recently, it came in all kinds of colors, but I only see black on the shelves now.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
Accumulator said:
Another of those "conventional wisdom" answers that hasn't been mentioned yet: 3M Imperial Hand Glaze. Not necessarily as nice as some of the Meg's offerings, but a solid choice nonetheless.
togwt
The Old Grey Whistle Test
Lost in translation?
Perhaps I'm just confused, it gets easier as you get older
Are we discusssing colour changing wax or a wax suitable for single stage paint?
Perhaps I'm just confused, it gets easier as you get older
Are we discusssing colour changing wax or a wax suitable for single stage paint?
Accumulator
Well-known member
TOGWT- Heh heh heh...I could be wrong, but here's my take on it- I figured we were discussing the use of a like-pigmented wax to (supposedly) enhance the color of a single stage paintjob.
I can actually imagine this working, at least to some minimal extent, but overall I'd skip it and go with a "conventional" glaze/wax combo.
Not that somebody using, say....Zymol's HDC topped with their Red wax might not get wonderful results. I just think that overall, it'd be a case of wasted money and unrealized expectations leading to disappointment.
Oh yeah....how could that slip my mind what with it sitting on the shelf right next to the Megauiar's stuff?!? Guess I'm just stuck in my ways, only use the 3M stuff on fresh repaints (when I'm in the mood for something other than M05).
Gee, I can't even remember the last time I used the IHG/wax combo, but it was *hugely* popular here about a dozen years ago.
I can actually imagine this working, at least to some minimal extent, but overall I'd skip it and go with a "conventional" glaze/wax combo.
Not that somebody using, say....Zymol's HDC topped with their Red wax might not get wonderful results. I just think that overall, it'd be a case of wasted money and unrealized expectations leading to disappointment.
C. Charles Hahn said:
Oh yeah....how could that slip my mind what with it sitting on the shelf right next to the Megauiar's stuff?!? Guess I'm just stuck in my ways, only use the 3M stuff on fresh repaints (when I'm in the mood for something other than M05).
Gee, I can't even remember the last time I used the IHG/wax combo, but it was *hugely* popular here about a dozen years ago.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
Accumulator said:
Indeed it was; if I remember right people were using either Sӧuveran or One Grand Blitz Wax at the time to top IHG.
Accumulator
Well-known member
C. Charles Hahn said:
Right, both of those, along with P21s.
M.Apesland
New member
Thanks For all the input guys, I ended up going with menzerna finishing glaze 115c for the glaze as enshine didn't have the megs stuff available. I also got CG 50/50 wax blackfire WD collonite 476 and 845, and victoria concourse red in shipment with my pc and Pads.
David Fermani
Forza Auto Salon
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
David Fermani said:
Sounds a lot like the old 3M Swirl Mark Remover for Dark Finishes...
Amazon.com: PERFECT-IT SWIRL RMVR-DARK COLOR: Automotive
Accumulator
Well-known member
C. Charles Hahn said:
Yeah, that's what I was thinking.