Ceramiclear - the real deal!

R

RAG

New member
Detailed a cermaic particle mercedes CL500 yesterday - car was a year old and goes through the local machine wash on a weekly basis (I can confirm that this particular wash is murder on paint jobs based on what I've seen first-hand). However, this particular car had zero washing swirls; there were a couple deeper scratches by the drivers door handle (likely caused by her jewelry) and a few very very light marks around the remaining parts of the car, but that's it. Admittingly, it was only silver paint...but still, I'd say the paint was in 95% condition before polishing and 98% after - regular paint would be somewhere in the 60% ballpark after going through that scratch tub 50 or 60 times! And even though there was a lot of rust contamination (as there always is here), aggressive claying did not produce any scuffing.



And I polished with an orange LCVC pad with 106FF at 1500 RPMs with LOTS of pressure and got no trace of halograms...shoot, the dealership hacks could probably even polish this paint and not get halograms.



My next vehicle WILL have ceramic particle paint - that's a promise! Absolutely amazing.
 
And the factory equiped clear bra rock guards were absolutely hammered - usually the clear bra material only has slightly more scratching that the stand-alone paint, but in this case there was no comparison.



Kinda scary from a professional detailer's perspective - 75% of my income comes from polish jobs...if 10 years down the line most new cars come equiped with this paint, polishing would rarely be needed. But overall, it's a good thing :)
 
ceramiclear or at least the cars i have done has been prone to massive chipping. Which is probably why there was a clear bra on it.



The one i did had alot of minor swirls. Nothing like a non ciramiclear car, but enough that i had a dickens of a time getting the majority out. It all worked out good.
 
I, too think that Ceramiclear is an excellent thing. Now I can no longer fear owning a black car! Seriously though, with ceramiclear paint, maintained by an Autopian, deep polishing may never be needed!(okay well maybe once or twice). That means an almost infinite CC life, just paint cleaners and protectants. However, from a business perspective, it *may* hurt the detailer, as I know I get a lot of money from defect removal. I know that some sort of ultra-hard CC is on an 06' Buick Lacrosse(light metallic blue, forgot the name) that I see regularly, as the thing stood up to dealer prep and a swirl-o-matic wash, (not to mention some improper washing methods by yours truely, pre-autopian), and the only area that has a *little* marring is on the trunk, possibly from the owner placing objects on it.
 
I saw a brand new S-Class (black) with serious swirling from a tunnel wash. CCCC (holy acronym!) will be more resistant against scratches, but there'll be enough neglected cars.
 
RAG said:
shoot, the dealership hacks could probably even polish this paint and not get halograms.



My next vehicle WILL have ceramic particle paint - that's a promise! Absolutely amazing.
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Did you not see my 'incredibly hard mb clear' thread a few weeks ago? '06 s65 amg went to the dealer for one 'wash' and came back swirled beyond belief. Looks like they ran it thru the drive thru wash and then realized they swirled it (the owner's account is tagged hand wash only in the computer) and tried to buff it. When the car got to me it had only been there ONCE (I washed it every time before that) and it was swirled, rotary trailed, etc... dealers..arghhh Either way tho that ceramic clear is not that tough/resistant to swirls..It sure was resistant to polishes..lol. I think yours may just look so good because it was silver...hard to see anything.
 
Trust me, a dealer can trash a ceramiclear paint job. One of my regulars had a black S500 with ceramiclear paint and when he had a fender repainted, they obviously buffed it out with a dirty wool pad. Several areas were burned pretty deep, plus whatever grit was on the pad left tracers all over the car.



Under normal washing though, the paint seems very resistant to halo swirls. :)
 
Lightman said:
Did you not see my 'incredibly hard mb clear' thread a few weeks ago? '06 s65 amg went to the dealer for one 'wash' and came back swirled beyond belief. Looks like they ran it thru the drive thru wash and then realized they swirled it (the owner's account is tagged hand wash only in the computer) and tried to buff it. When the car got to me it had only been there ONCE (I washed it every time before that) and it was swirled, rotary trailed, etc... dealers..arghhh Either way tho that ceramic clear is not that tough/resistant to swirls..It sure was resistant to polishes..lol. I think yours may just look so good because it was silver...hard to see anything.
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Yeah, I'm sure you and Scott are right...improper washing will scratch anything. And silver does hide alot.



Also, I think there is a huge varience in the cerami-clear paint jobs. AND, you can see the couple of model and year car, one will have cerami clear and the other will not...not much consistency in this regard either.
 
Does anyone know what year they started with the cerami-clear? I have a burgandy new body shop painted areas- to match the rest of the car compound, coming up this week.
 
salty said:
Does anyone know what year they started with the cerami-clear? I have a burgandy new body shop painted areas- to match the rest of the car compound, coming up this week.
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2005 is what I remember.
 
Here's an 2004 SL55 I did:



04SL55005.jpg




The C denotes Ceramiclear
 
Thanks guys I think it is an '02.



Of course when I went to the body shop (I know most of the guys) to have a look at it, they knew nothing about Ceramiclear.
 
Problem is even if they know about it, they probably aren't well versed on using it. Even the Mercedes certified shops in S. Florida (there's a ton of MB's here) don't spray ceramic. I only know 2 places that do and 1 of them is the Ferrari Body Shop because F-cars have ceramic paint as well. Then, the next hurdle is to find a paint supplier that stocks it. If shops don't buy it, they don't stock it.
 
One of my, and their problem is going to be that they are blending the rear quarter into the roof, so there is going to be a transition area and dry overspray area. So if it is done well, it should be OK, but I've seen quite a few where it can be obvious.
 
What your describing is "burning of the clear" where they create a break line at either an inconsipicuous or thin area. This is not a proper procedure and even if it's done well, it will fail eventually. (The proper way is to wrap the clearcoat to the edge of the entire panel, which in this case would be the entire roof and the opposite side quarter). Make sure to ask them where the breakline is so you can be careful when buffing.
 
I know the break line is going to be on the pillar to the roof. Defiantly not going to be perfect. Usually most customer's won't notice. But this one might, very anal, another reason why they are having me correct the paint and not the body guys.
 
It's "clear coat blending" and common practice. Several ways to do it. But yes,

they all eventually fail... And most insurers wont pay this unless demanded.



http://www.pc.dupont.com/dpc/en/US/...roduct/dr/ChromaSystem/H-19279_ClearBlend.pdf



If you notice chipping, it's usually to the factory primer or e-coat. So, is it so much

the clear itself? or the bond between the base coat and e-coat? The later...



But for a refinish job, there are several things that can be done to greatly

minimize chipping. Shooting an epoxy sealer and catalyzing the base will

help (a lot). But epoxy is a slow product and illegal so most shops don't

use it...
 
David Fermani said:
Problem is even if they know about it, they probably aren't well versed on using it. Even the Mercedes certified shops in S. Florida (there's a ton of MB's here) don't spray ceramic. I only know 2 places that do and 1 of them is the Ferrari Body Shop because F-cars have ceramic paint as well. Then, the next hurdle is to find a paint supplier that stocks it. If shops don't buy it, they don't stock it.
Click to expand...



The closest Mercedes dealership to me doesn't even do paint and body, they send their customers cars to Craig's, which is a chain body shop. Based on what I've seen of their work, they aren't even qualified to work on Yugos, let alone CeramiClear Mercedes.
 
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