Blackfire Midnight Sun Batch Difference

Thanks for your reply david,



I too think that swissol is very similar to zymol.



They look and smell the same. Only difference is, zymol says DO NOT let dry when applying, whereas swissol says to let it dry for 5 to 10 minutes before buffing off.



I had a phone call after applying an area with swissol, and din't get to remove it for 1 hour, and it came off fine. I wouldn't like to do that with zymol.



So I prefer swissol because I like to take my time. I feel rushed with a product that says do not let dry.



Also I have noticed that swissol gives an instant result. It is silky smooth and awesome immediately, whereas zymol doesn't feel as good until the next day.



I intend on waxing my beast every Sunday. I love the awesome feel after it has been waxed. But after just one wash, I notice about a 30% decrease in feel. It still looks awesome, but it doesn't have that silky feel.



:cool:
 
ok I posted over in detailing forum about this and now I am lost bigtime. I attacked my Ranger today, wash, clay, polish (2) and wax (1). Claying is what bothred me. Today was my first time ever using a clay bar on any vehicle, so mine was the guniea pig (1998 Ford Ranger Flareside) I like Prowax Products but I'm not so sure If I like them anymore or maybe it's just me????????????



Getting to the point, I used there Clay Away4 on the finish, I used there C-19 Cherry Suds as the lub for the clay. As I begin to rub along the paint, I'm not feeling anything. Just nothing, like the clay bar isn't picking up anything. I was told by a fellow member here that your not supposed to feel anything, but the clay bar is working. Then I was told by other fellow members that they didn't have any trouble using a car wash as the lub because I thought while claying my Ranger, that the car wash was making the surface to slippery and not grabbing anything out of the paint. Finally, I was told by another friend of mine that your not supposed to use a Car Wash when claying, because clay bars work better when there used with a QD as the lubricant. Someone just please give me a simple straight answer, this is very confusing and frustrating. Thank you,,,,,,,,,,91
 
91,



Here's the straight scoop:



1. Most companies who sell clay "claim" they don't contain abrasives. That's just not factual. All clay bar products use a 3 micron or better abrasive particle suspended in a plastic clay or elastic clay (poly) base.



2. What makes clay work is that you evenly distribute the abrasive over a large area with even pressure. Without a lubricant, clay would stick to the paint surface. When you add a lubricant, the clay is suspended over the paint surface by hydraulic force (the liquid). Any contaminates sticking up above the thin film of lubricant are filed (sheered) off by the clay. Some people claim the clay pulls contamination off, and this is likely with some material, but for the most part it is filed off.



3. The lubricant you use is very important. I personally do not like to use quick detailing sprays as a lubricant. I don't believe most QD sprays provide enough slip. Some evaporate too fast. I highly recommend a lubricant designed for clay. A car wash solution works okay, but it creates too much foam for my liking.



4. You will not always "feel" the clay working. Having any tactile sense from the clay will depend on the clay formula, your lubricant and the level of contamination on the paint. The most important thing is to check your work often. Never make more than 4 or 5 passes over an area without drying, feeling and inspecting your clay. Knead your clay often to provide a new surface. Pre-lubricate your clay by sprayng your clay bar and the paint surface.



db
 
Relax 91, I've always used car wash whilst claying, and your right. You don't tend to feel much whilst using it. What you should be feeling is how smooth the paint work is after a couple of runs.



Then feel ahead and you'll feel the tiny bits of grit. Then after claying those tiny bits are gone.:cool:
 
the paint on the Ranger felt only slightly better, It was moderately rough but not like all totaly neglected and felt like sandpaper, no. The finish was still somewhat grity after use. I dunno, maybe the clay bar wasn't aggressive enough, or the clay bar hates me, lol, Serious though, Maybe I need something more aggressive???????? Tks,,,,,,,,91
 
thats wierd cuz when i clayed my bros hood, that thing felt like glass. it just skimmed over the surface with no bumps what so ever. maybe ur not doing it hard enough or not giving enough passes? or maybe u need a new clay bar.
 
I rubbed like a mofo on that paint, made like 12 passes at 1 time!!! barely any change. I think my found my problem though, I was using a car wash for the lub, yea I know some ppl do this w/o a problem but I guess my clay bar doesn't like to be used with Car Wash. The clay bar is new, this is the first time I have used one. Next time, I will use a QD spray made for claying.



I have Pro's Clay Away 4 bar. It says to use it with the S-74 spray for the lube. I used with the C-19 Cherry Suds. Oh well, either better luck next time, or I suck at this, lol,,,,,,,91
 
Prowler:

i agree with the dawn issue, with a new car though, id skip the dawn step, new(hasnt been waxed)

i use dawn twice a year, this is because i clay twice a year.

spring is finally here, thank god, so ill be;

1. wash with dawn (reg soap i use Meg Gold Glass)

2. clay with 3M cleaner clay, i use meg Final inspection #34 for lube

3. polish, not sure which one yet, either 3MIHG, Meg#9??

4. wax, i use S100
 
i get my S100 at the harley dealers, does anyone know if i can also get the P21S Paintwork Cleansing Lotion as well???
 
I hate to bring up a stale post, but when I clay the scratching sounds and feel never seem to stop. I can feel a difference afterwords much smoother, but I spent 2 hours claying last night and I don't feel as though I made a dent. My paint must be in bad condition.



I noticed that and very small rock chips in the paint (very small) seems to fool me into claying again and again, I would say that either they have pushed the paint up slightly, or I'm not floating the clay well enough. I am using a load of lube, so I would think its the first.
 
Darkfluid, have you read David's article and the other threads on claying? If you're still hearing/feeling abrasion in the clay, then you're not finished. Go slow and easy. The results will be worth it! :up
 
darkfluid, what brand of clay are you using? I had the same problem with one of the ClayMagic formulas. It scratched the heck out of my 911.
 
I haven't read any his previous claying articles, but I have read several posts around autopia and others. Some say (including the instructions with the clay) to keep goin till you hear the gritty noise stop, fold the clay only when its dirty looking. I read another that said if you hear grit stop and fold the claybar. I hear grit like crazy, but the bar doesn't show any nastiness on it any more (brown gunk and what not with the first few strokes.)



I am also folding the bar often. And picking out large grit.



I am using mother's clay bar.
 
Ok, this may sound foolish. I'm new to detailing and have been reading through the different posts. But I havn't seen anythin mentioned on what brand of water based lubricant you guys have been using.



Can you guys enlighten me?:o
 
David, In your claying article on 3-27-03, you wrote:



Finally, wipe the clay residue off with a soft terry cloth towel, and buff to a nice luster.



I'm not sure I understand you here. First - I rinse the area off that was just clayed. Second - what exactly are you buffing? There should be nothing left after rinsing except clean paint.



Tell me if I got it wrong. Until now, my practice has been to rinse each area with fresh water (claying with car wash mixture as lubricant), and then after the whole car has been clayed, wash the car again, to completely clean the car of remaining clay particulate.
 
mac,



If you're washing as you go, you will be okay. Most clat bars leave some amount of residue (some more than others) that must be buffed away. If you're washing the car again after claying, you won't find any residue. Most people clay a panel at a time and dry off as they go.



db
 
I'm sorry if this is too simple, but how does claying interact with clearcoats?



I keep hearing people talk about clay lifting contaminants out of paint, but the clearcoat is between the two. How do things like clay and polishes act on the paint and stuff in the paint without either a) being blocked by the clearcoat or b) dissolving the clearcoat in order to get to the paint?
 
I keep hearing people talk about clay lifting contaminants out of paint, but the clearcoat is between the two. How do things like clay and polishes act on the paint and stuff in the paint without either a) being blocked by the clearcoat or b) dissolving the clearcoat in order to get to the paint?
Click to expand...

Keeping things simple, clearcoat is paint - its just clear so that it acts as a protective layer for the decorative coloured paint below it.
 
So what's the difference between BF's batches... #23 is their original released hybrid, but i just realized there's actually batch #24 & #25, any difference between them? Kinda interested in getting batch #23....
 
I've got batch 23. I like it a lot. As with all products, Blackfire evolved. I'm not totally sure what the difference is but the new stuff is designed to pair better with the current BF sealant. The combo is killer.
 
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