Black F-150 - What did I do wrong?

B

BigFly10

New member
I attacked my 2007 black F-150 this past weekend for a full spring detail. My steps included:



- Wash with Meguiars gold class

- Mother's clay bar

- Polish with PB SSR1 and PC with white LC pad

- Polish with AIO

- LSP Meguiars #16



After an entire day and aching bones, I stepped back as the sun was setting to admire my work. Boy was I UNPLEASANTLY surprised! :eek:



With the sun shining directly on the side panel I could not BELIEVE the hazing! I almost started crying in my driveway.



I was trying to monitor the results as I was progressing and everything seemed fine (without the sun shining directly on it of course). And despite what you see in the pictures, without direct sunlight, the truck looks okay. But you can see in the attached pictures how BAD it looks in the sunlight (keep in mind that it's a bit dusty in the first 3 pictures....I cleaned off the dust for the 4th & 5th picture).



Anyway, I need to figure out what I did wrong and how to fix this. I can only assume this would have been induced by the SSR1. My technique was as follows:



- Apply a generous amount of SSR1 to pad

- Spread polish over area to be polished (about size of 1/4 truck hood) with PC on speed 1.

- Increase PC to speed 6 and work the polish in moving the PC about an inch or two per second. Apply reasonably heavy (10-15 lbs) of downward pressure on the PC while moving.

- Use overlapping strokes (about half the pad overlapping) and work the entire area 3 times (back and forth, then up and down, then back and worth again).

- Wipe clean and admire newly induced hazing.



Thoughts? Did I move the PC too fast? Too slow? Too much polish? Too little? Work the polish in for too long? Not long enough? Use too much pressure?



Please help! I have used this technique in the past on my silver Nissan Maxima with absolutely no noticeable issues. This black F-150 seems to be a different beast though.



Many thanks in advance.



 
well, for one, aio is not a polish, it is a cleaner wax. It's really good for prep for some sg or a carnuaba, etc.



Anyway, I can't see the pictures too well since I'm on my iPhone but I'd be pretty darn surprised if ss1 and a white pad induced major hazing. This combo is very mild.



I will say though, it sounds like you didnt work the polish long enough. Three passes? How long did that take u? A minute or two? Since "generous" is a subjective term, you may have used to much polish as well. All u need is a bead around the pad.



Are u sure it's hazing? Its not left over polish, aio, or lsp that you didnt fully remove? If it is hazing, use less polish and work it in longer. This time, have a halogen ready, or the sun so you can inspect your work as u go, you could have saved yourself a lot of time by testing it on one panel first to figure out the plan of attack that u needed.
 
BF- although difficult to tell from the pics it appears that something is left on the paint. I can imagine that if the polish wasn't broken down and fully removed then you threw some AIO into the mix- this is what the end result would be. Such a tough call. I would over-concentrate wash a panel, Prep-Sol it and run through the steps again.



My.02c
 
I recently just did a detail for a family friend on a black Montego that was only 3 years old. It was a pain in the ***, I've never worked on clear that was so hard before. If I remember correctly, there was a thread somewhere that had a chart of soft to hard clears, and I think Ford was right up there with BMW.



I had to use an orange pad + OC to try and even begin to cut through the heavy swirling with a PC. I only had time for one pass before moving on to FPII, so I couldn't get the even deeper stuff out. That could be the problem, I don't think SSR1 is an aggressive enough polish for Ford clear.
 
Noting that I know *nothing* about SSR1....yeah, it sounds like too much product, not worked long enough. And IMO 1/4 of a F-150 hood is one *mighty big* area to work by PC, not that others wouldn't do an area that large, but I wouldn't.



"Generous" sounds like *way* too much product to me :think: To go over the F-150 one time shouldn't take much product at all (and if SSR1 is as mild as I think it is, going over a black truck one time with it won't do much of any correction either), so if the bottle's not still nearly full you used too much.



Looking at the pics, if I were correcting that by PC using ~6" white LC pads, it'd take me a long, long time to do each panel (and I'd even be using stronger polish too). Many passes, each with relatively little product. I can't begin to guess how many times I'd go over each area, but it'd be quite a few. And each time would take quite a while.



Generally, you work a small area until the polish is almost, but not quite, dry.



With the AIO, I'd buff off its residue before it dries.



Oh, and I'd try to catch such stuff *before* doing all the steps...nip it in the bud as soon as something doesn't work right.
 
As Accumulator said, it looks like you just need to do a few more applications of the SSR1. You have *started* to correct the paint in those pictures, now you just need to finish. Also as Accumulator said, you might want to think about using a stronger polish to correct that paint.



If I was doing that truck with a PC...



1. 4" LC orange pad

2. Menzerna Super Intensive polish. At least four (and probably five) applications

3. 4" LC white

4. Menzerna PO106FF Nano Polish. At least two applications (and probably three).

5. AIO if desired

6. LSP



Even when you are correcting paint with a rotary, it's unusual to be able to get the paint looking it's best after one pass with a polish and one pass with an AIO; you need more than that. And when you're using a PC, you need to plan on at least double the amount of polish applications as what would be required with a rotary.



Those pictures show that you definitely have a good start on the correction. It just needs to be finished.
 
It really looks like to me that it wasn't broken down all the way to me! even seems like some buffer trails or hologramming.



As other have said...go with a stronger polish, I have some M95 and its a beast :) with an orange pad!
 
SuperBee364 said:
As Accumulator said, it looks like you just need to do a few more applications of the SSR1. You have *started* to correct the paint in those pictures, now you just need to finish. Also as Accumulator said, you might want to think about using a stronger polish to correct that paint.



If I was doing that truck with a PC...



1. 4" LC orange pad

2. Menzerna Super Intensive polish. At least four (and probably five) applications

3. 4" LC white

4. Menzerna PO106FF Nano Polish. At least two applications (and probably three).

5. AIO if desired

6. LSP



Even when you are correcting paint with a rotary, it's unusual to be able to get the paint looking it's best after one pass with a polish and one pass with an AIO; you need more than that. And when you're using a PC, you need to plan on at least double the amount of polish applications as what would be required with a rotary.



Those pictures show that you definitely have a good start on the correction. It just needs to be finished.
Click to expand...



I'm not sure I agree unless there are signifiant defects. I just did my spring detail with OP on a yellow pad and only worked enough to..well.. deep clean the surface, not grind down to a new level.

<He did say it was a spring detail and didn't mention defects - right?>



It does sound like maybe there was too much product used and maybe a mild polish now will make things right again.
 
abbeysdad said:
I'm not sure I agree unless there are signifiant defects. I just did my spring detail with OP on a yellow pad and only worked enough to..well.. deep clean the surface, not grind down to a new level.

<He did say it was a spring detail and didn't mention defects - right?>



It does sound like maybe there was too much product used and maybe a mild polish now will make things right again.
Click to expand...



I'm just going by the pictures he posted. I would use the above process to correct the paint as shown in the pics. I'd use the same process with a rotary, too, except that I'd use purple foamed wool for the SIP, and then either the blue 3M waffle foam or white finishing wool with the 106FF



And since he posted pictures showing defects that he wasn't happy with, I'm assuming he wants the paint completely corrected. If you don't want paint corrected, why use an abrasive polish at all?
 
Thanks for the input everyone.



I have to apologize somewhat for the pictures. I was in a hurry trying to get them while the sun was still up so I didn't have the opportunity to take the time to get a really good shot. Some of what you can see is definitely dust, but let me assure you that even after cleaning the surface thoroughly, the hazing is still clearly evident.



There were some swirl marks starting to show up in the black paint which is why I decided to do an SSR1 polish. Nothing major....just some minor marks I wanted to clean up. Most of those were corrected, but now the hazing I induced is much worse.



I did use a little more polish than just a bead around the pad. Maybe that's part of the problem. It probably took me about 2-3 minutes per section.



What I can find about the F-150 clear coat says is that it is very soft. Based on that conclusion with the feedback that I am getting, it seems to me that my problem was likely too much product not broken down long enough.



I am going try again on one panel with my halogen ready to inspect the results. I do realize that I should have checked my work prior to going so far, but everything "appeared" okay (the swirl marks I was working on were being corrected) until the sunlight hit.
 
Accumulator said:
Noting that I know *nothing* about SSR1....yeah, it sounds like too much product, not worked long enough. And IMO 1/4 of a F-150 hood is one *mighty big* area to work by PC, not that others wouldn't do an area that large, but I wouldn't.



"Generous" sounds like *way* too much product to me :think: To go over the F-150 one time shouldn't take much product at all (and if SSR1 is as mild as I think it is, going over a black truck one time with it won't do much of any correction either), so if the bottle's not still nearly full you used too much.



Looking at the pics, if I were correcting that by PC using ~6" white LC pads, it'd take me a long, long time to do each panel (and I'd even be using stronger polish too). Many passes, each with relatively little product. I can't begin to guess how many times I'd go over each area, but it'd be quite a few. And each time would take quite a while.



Generally, you work a small area until the polish is almost, but not quite, dry.



With the AIO, I'd buff off its residue before it dries.



Oh, and I'd try to catch such stuff *before* doing all the steps...nip it in the bud as soon as something doesn't work right.
Click to expand...



Thanks Accumulator, this is the kind of information I need. I don't have a frame of reference for how product is the "right" amount or how much time it should take for a panel, so specific information as per above is very helpful.



I can tell you that I used most of the 16 oz bottle of SSR1 for one pass over the entire truck, so it DEFINITELY sounds like I used too much.
 
BigFly10 said:
Thanks Accumulator, this is the kind of information I need. I don't have a frame of reference for how product is the "right" amount or how much time it should take for a panel, so specific information as per above is very helpful.



I can tell you that I used most of the 16 oz bottle of SSR1 for one pass over the entire truck, so it DEFINITELY sounds like I used too much.
Click to expand...



Oh wow, yeah, you used WAY too much product. And you didn't work it in long enough...especially with the much product.



I'm not sure if SS1 is a diminishing abrasive or not (never used it) but if it is, it needs to be worked fully or little swirls or hazing can become apparent.



The GOOD news is that it'll be an easy fix. The BAD news is that all your previous work is for naught. :)
 
Tusin said:
I'm not sure if SS1 is a diminishing abrasive or not (never used it) but if it is, it needs to be worked fully or little swirls or hazing can become apparent.
Click to expand...



I don't think there is any hazing or marring from the SSR1, it hardly has any cut anyway--I think any swirls in the pictures are simply pre-existing and unremoved, from not working the polish enough or the polish not having enough cut. As for the rest of the stuff, I simply see unremoved AIO and #16.
 
SuperBee364 said:
I'm just going by the pictures he posted. I would use the above process to correct the paint as shown in the pics. I'd use the same process with a rotary, too, except that I'd use purple foamed wool for the SIP, and then either the blue 3M waffle foam or white finishing wool with the 106FF

And since he posted pictures showing defects that he wasn't happy with, I'm assuming he wants the paint completely corrected. If you don't want paint corrected, why use an abrasive polish at all?
Click to expand...
If you do some research I think you'd find that there is a grunge layer (anyone that's ever removed a front bra can confirm) of contamination, minor oxidants and just plain grime that just doesn't come off with a wash and detail clay (even if you use the dreaded dawn wash).

Polishing gets rid of this grunge layer, leaving a squeaky clean surface - not all polishing is done to remove swirls and scratches.
 
Setec Astronomy said:
I don't think there is any hazing or marring from the SSR1, it hardly has any cut anyway--I think any swirls in the pictures are simply pre-existing and unremoved, from not working the polish enough or the polish not having enough cut. As for the rest of the stuff, I simply see unremoved AIO and #16.
Click to expand...



I agree with you, but on a soft-enough clear even SS1 can leave some marring. I would, from the get go, assume that it is unremoved product though...I think the CC would have to be pretty butter-soft to get marred up by SS1 and a white-pad.
 
I have a 2004 f 150. Sonic blue (dark) and using a pc always leaves a haze that *I* can see. Maybe I am crazy here, but a white pad will not IMHO finish down compleatly haze free on dark ford paint. I even get haze if I use a lc white w/ AIO.



I would repolish w/ a white pad first. I you still have the haze try a blac/blue pad. I get best results using less polish than I think I should.



After never being 100% satisfied with the finish I got I purchased a rotary. On *my* paint it works much better.



I have gotten better rusults on other vehicles with a PC before, though. I think they were harder paint. I use the PC to apply non abrasive suff. I did try 3m UF with aLC blue by PC on an area I didn't want to do with the rotary, I'll see how that looks next time its in the sun.
 
To echo what Bill said- a few weeks back I did an '07 F-150 (in the C&B section) and relied primarily on 106FF/LC White via rotary and the truck was very pleasant to deal with....absolutely no surprises and it finished down perfectly. I think with a little more working time, you'd get great results.
 
WASH THE TRUCK! I had the same thing happen to me a few weeks ago with my '04 Miata, silver, trying to get it ready for spring. First time using AIO, on a PC with a white pad, and when I was done with the hood I saw all kinds of what looked like swirling. The car has always been well cared for and the paint is essentially flawless, so I was really disappointed...and a bit surprised given that that combination should be really mild. I mixed up a bucket of Gold Class with a couple drops of Dawn and rewashed the hood on a hunch...problem solved, the swirling was gone. What I'd seen had been swirling not in my paint but in the massive amounts of product left on my car. I took another stab at it with less product and more time, and got the results I had expected in the first place.
 
I dunno folks...every time I see a newbie (no offense intended, BigFly10) being advised to switch from a PC to a rotary I shudder and think that a) that's not likely to make things overall *easier* for him, b) he's not likely to go buy (and learn) a whole new polishing system anyhow, and c) there just aren't all that many cases where you can't get an acceptable finish without using a rotary. When somebody just wants to get their vehicle looking OK, I genuinely believe they can almost always do it without using a rotary. Just my $0.02...hope it didn't sound too :argue





BigFly10- Glad you found my response helpful, though IMO it wasn't as specific as I woulda liked as I just don't know about SSR1 or Ford clear.



But yeah, that was way too much product (I only use a few ounces at most to do a Suburban) and way too little time (it'd scare your pants off if I told you how long this can take via PC ;) but it's a *LOT* longer than the 3 minutes).



Try using just enough product to lubricate the pad and work it until it's almost gone. Generally, you don't want to go until it's dry (dry polish can leave marring) but you *do* want to work it a good long time.



While I try to stay away from this kind of advice in cases like this, I can't help but think that if you were using 1Z brand polishes you could get things dialed in *very* quickly with far less frustration. If I were there advising you, we'd do the truck with 1Z Paint Polish. If that didn't leave a good enough finish (i.e., if we got hazing) I'd go over it again with 1Z Metallic Polish with Wax. Or *maybe* just do the truck once with the Metallic :think: Then, no AIO, just wax. I'd utterly confident that things would turn out super with a minumum of frustration. Just something to consider if you decide to try a different approach.
 
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