Are YOU over polishing your paint?

TOGWT said:




.................In this and every other industry Iâ€â„¢ve been involved with education is its â€Ëœkeyâ€â„¢. It soon becomes obvious to the thinking man that the more you learn; the more you realize what you donâ€â„¢t know. Then at some point, youâ€â„¢ll have learned enough to realize, that you know nothing at all.................



JonM
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So perfectly worded ! :xyxthumbs Just a great thought to have in your head through life.

Kind of reminds me of a Zen thought of 'Masters of Masters'. No matter who you see as a master, remember they also have masters. ;)
 
DavidB said:
This is why I so frequently tell people to use a good pre-wax cleaner "polish" as a regular tool in mataining good paint finish health.
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What about mildly abrasive products like Menzerna FPII and PO85RD? They are not chemical cleaners, yet I want to use them to burnish the paint to a higher gloss. Are these okay for regular use or do you still recommend using a more mild chemical cleaner for regular polishing?





Thanks,

J
 
JustinTRW said:
What about mildly abrasive products like Menzerna FPII and PO85RD? They are not chemical cleaners, yet I want to use them to burnish the paint to a higher gloss. Are these okay for regular use or do you still recommend using a more mild chemical cleaner for regular polishing?





Thanks,

J
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Thoes are similar to 3M PI II SWR Dark so its probably safe for twice a year. I say use P21S GEPP or AIO for regular polishing between the once or twice a year FPII.
 
David, for a while Ive been reading that the Poorboys SSR2.5 is the greates thing since sliced bread.. Guys were using it and marveling at how well it worked. Then my friend got a gorgeous E46 M3, slightly used, which had light swirls All over the car.. I mean, All over.. We used this SSR2.5, and just like we had read, it worked like a champ.. Then, I had occasion to feel the stuff, and it had so much grit that it felt every bit as gritty as my 3M rubbing compounds! So gritty that I found that when I applied a tiny bit by hand, swirls went into the paint so easily that i dont see how Anybody could use this stuff by hand, or by Rotary. Youd really have to work it in, breaking it down, so that it would get finer and finer.. And then youd have to hit it with something finer, just to get rid of its scratches.



Clearly with a rotary, this stuff removes paint. But, on my friends car, we used a Porter CAble. And here, it just remvoed the swirls seemlessly.. No followup with something less abrasive was required.



My question to you concerns the use of these abrasive polishes the thread is about, with Porter Cable vs traditional Rotary.. Isnt it true that because the PC can generate no real heat, that the amout of damage it can do, with products like this SSR 2.5, is very small, compared to what will happen with a rotary, going over the same realestate over and over and over? Im not saying the PC and this polish wont remove Any paint, but I believe that the amount compared to the product used with a Rotary is negligible.
 
Paul,



Actually, it is very possible to remove a lot of paint thickness with a PC. Given an abrasive polish and a cutting pad, you can do a good bit of damage.



I had a friend come by the other day because I opened my mouth and said you can use a PC to remove deep scratches. His response was "no frigging way!" So, the challenge was on.



When he came by I evaluated the paint and the scratches on his hood. They were deep into the clear, but not into the color.



I slapped a spot pad on the DA, got out some cutting polish and gave each scratch 30 seconds of work. They were gone! To remove the hazing left by the cutting polish and spot pad, I had to following with a finer spot pad and a swirl remover polish.



Now, here's the issue. A DA with a regular size pad will not create enough heat (energy) to break down a polish designed for a rotary. The end result is a polish that keeps cutting at the same rate and does not properly break down into a finer polish, as it should.



What ends up happening is that you remove the swirls, but reduce the gloss because the polish scours the finish. I'm not saying this is what's happening with the PBs polish, as I have not tried it; it is simply my experience with most high-speed rotary polishes used with the DA.



Properly polishing with a DA requires a good match up of both pad and polish.
 
Thank you David.. Do yourself a favor and get some of this PB SSR 2.5. It is the most incredible stuff, and when used with a PC and a Polishing pad, and even a cutting pad, it leaves NO hazing, no marks of any kind; just an ice smooth surface that looks like resurfaced ice, in the most critical of lighting.. Really amazing stuff. IN the future, when using ssr2.5, Ill make sure and use only a 6 or 8" polishing pad, on a speed no higher than 4.5. BTW, Ive used all the favorites over the years, including the perennial favorite Finesse It, and believe me, Nothing works as well as SSR2.5, while needing no followup product to remove its marks. It leaves None :)
 
DavidB said:
Actually, it is very possible to remove a lot of paint thickness with a PC. Given an abrasive polish and a cutting pad, you can do a good bit of damage.



I slapped a spot pad on the DA, got out some cutting polish and gave each scratch 30 seconds of work. They were gone! To remove the hazing left by the cutting polish and spot pad, I had to following with a finer spot pad and a swirl remover polish.



A DA with a regular size pad will not create enough heat (energy) to break down a polish designed for a rotary. The end result is a polish that keeps cutting at the same rate and does not properly break down into a finer polish, as it should.



What ends up happening is that you remove the swirls, but reduce the gloss because the polish scours the finish...it is simply my experience with most high-speed rotary polishes used with the DA.



Properly polishing with a DA requires a good match up of both pad and polish.
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Great post, David.



So a spot (4-inch) pad will generate enough heat (energy) to break down a polish designed for the rotary?



Did you use a rotary-only polish for the "challenge" with your friend or did I take your statement below out of context?



A DA with a regular size pad will not create enough heat (energy) to break down a polish designed for a rotary. The end result is a polish that keeps cutting at the same rate and does not properly break down into a finer polish, as it should.
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Realy good thread! It's adressing alot of questions/concerns.



New question/request:



Is there a list, or would someone please compile a list of polishes that will fully break down when used with a PC. An abrasive rating for these would be cool too.



Side note:



Lately with IP and PC, I find that I'm getting better results with high speed 5-6, and some some added movement and pressure of the PC. Example, moving with some extra pressure, and a motion as if I were wet sanding with the entire PC. Also, a circular motion as if hand polishing. Seems to provide quicker and better results. I'm guessing the extra movement, and consequent heat might be breaking down the IP better. I removed and greatly reduced some pretty bad scratches from a friends van. The paint actualy got fairly warm on a couple of the bad scratches, and I definatly removed some clear. He was OK with this because he was turning in a lease and was being charged 900 bucks. After polishing, popping some dents, and removing some interior stains, and a wax... no extra charge. I realy need to get into a rotary.... still a little scared
 
>> realy need to get into a rotary.... still a little scared<<



Since you have the proper respect youll probably do ok with one. Make sure you use one with variable speeds, so you can start off really really slowly, and check your work. That way, youll avoid swirling up the whole thing.. Also, look on the net; there are articles about ways to position the pad and hold the buffer so that its less likely to scratch. But for me, the toughest part is realizing going in that you WANT to produce scratches... AT FIRST... Then as it breaks down to a finer rouge, those scratches lift off, or, you go to a finer medium until they do. Takes more faith than i usually have.. Hence, I use PC most of the time ;) Now that weve found PB SSR2.5, I hardly see reason to use rotaries anymore. With the PC , it does such an amazing job at removing all surface damage, that should be the most you need.. usually.
 
I think i'll try some 2.5 when I make my next order. How is it compared to the regulad SSR 2? It's good to know this stuff works with the PC.
 
I'm glad this thread was started. I own my first Black car and being a obsessive complusive person this wasn't a smart choice.



This weekend I was out in the garage yet again under the halogen lights working each panel to what I would consider perfection (showroom finish) then it hit me.



This car is on the road daily and therfore exposed to the elements and other hazards. Is it really possible to remove and keep off every little mar?



I love cars and doing mechanic's and body work but unlike detailing those two have a point when the job is done and will stay that way.



I've had people drive past me while I'm either in the garage or out in front of it doing some exterior detailing, get to their house, back up and come up to me and say how sweet my whip looks and how much time I put into keeping it that way,



Yet I'm there sweatin some swirl mark or light scratch 95% of people can't even see or notice.



I'm in no way advocating just letting things go, proper maintenance of a vehicle's in/exterior is a must for anyone really into cars.



But I think it's important to know when to say when.
 
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