Am I wrong on Price

rlspringer said:
I just got a contract to setup shop at a business with about 600 employees every Friday. I mentioned my prices for washing cars starts at $25.00. I mentioned that I do quality and not quantity. I was told to do less quality and more quantity to lower my price (they suggest $20 for all cars since usually I would get between 10 - 15 cars). I do not want to run my business that way. Their last detailer went out of business and I guess because of the quality. Any suggestions on how I should handle this situation. Thanks
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Don't waste your time on jerks like that. I know it's tough to turn down work but if you aren't getting paid what you should be then forget about them. The whole less quality for a lower price will only last until they all start nit picking the jobs to death after they get the price down. Your profit margin on a detail like that is very low and you should never, ever drop the price even if thew car is cherry. If they want full details then you have a little more room to move but never for a $25 job. Tell them politely that's the price and if they don't like it spend your time finding good quality clients who will appreciate your hard work.
 
NozeBleedSpeed said:
Im not a pro detailer,but this is one of those "life" questions. A company with 600 employees wants you to come in on Fridays,the prime day of the week(for them to get their cars done). Out of 600 employees only 10-15 will get their cars washed.That 10 will be the top guys there,making the most money and driving the most expensive cars.They are too cheap to hire a porter full time so they try to get you to come in and wash 10 cars for the price that you charge for one detail on the best day of the week.

If he would have tried that crap with me,this is what the negotiation would have sounded like.



Me: I charge 25 a car.

Him: Well 25 is kinda high.How about 20 a car.

Me:Im sorry,there is no way I can do it for less than 30,thats my bottom price.

Him: 30? I thought you said 25?

Me: I did. I do a really great job.Thats why I absolutely have to get 35 per car.I cant go any lower.

(The more he talked,the higher the price would be.)



Dont let these guys treat you like a whore.Sometimes you have to be a hardass and just find other work.I can just hear this guy at the next managers meeting...Well guys,I got ol' monkey boy to come in on Fridays and wash our Porsches for 20 bucks a hit.You guys owe me lunch.
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Too funny! I had a used car manager pull that crap with me but little did he know I intentionally quoted him hig h on doing his work and let him negotiate me down to what I wanted to charge so he felt like he got the best of me. His assistant told me all about how proud he was of how he "had me by the short and curlies"! Sometimes you have to finesse a customer like that to get what you need out of a job AND make them feel like they are getting the better end of the deal on price.
 
zenhog said:
There's more to this than the simple concept of supply and demand. If your business plan assumed you were going to get 10 washes in a day, and you wanted to make $250 for that day's wash activity, then you set the price at $25. Of course this is a very simplistic example, the cost of supplies, etc are part of the equation, but the price would eventually be set based on some form of expected # wash jobs divided into some desired amount of revenue... but you get the idea.



If someone comes along and guarantees you 15 washes for the day, and says they'll give you $20 a wash, I'd look long and hard at that business plan target of $250/day and consider their offer.





My two cents, anyway.
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The only problem I can see with that is that 15 cars will take 50% longer to wash than 10 cars and for that extra 50% of time, you will only make $50 more.
 
ShineShop said:
Don't waste your time on jerks like that. I know it's tough to turn down work but if you aren't getting paid what you should be then forget about them. The whole less quality for a lower price will only last until they all start nit picking the jobs to death after they get the price down. Your profit margin on a detail like that is very low and you should never, ever drop the price even if thew car is cherry. If they want full details then you have a little more room to move but never for a $25 job. Tell them politely that's the price and if they don't like it spend your time finding good quality clients who will appreciate your hard work.
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:bow



I made the mistake when I was first starting out of accepting a job to clean 3 Lincoln Town Cars for the owners of a local construction firm for $50 every Monday morning. I had only been detailing full time for a few months and this was the first person who wanted weekly washes and I thought that his offer was fair since I'd be cleaning them every week and they would never get real bad.



Boy, was I wrong! They took them out to their construction sites all the time, so they'd have mud in the fenderwells and all over the carpet. I was kicking myself in the a$$ within a few months. Then it got worse. They got a large contract and half the time I'd go there, only 1 or 2 cars would be there and of course, they wanted to pay me $16.67 per car when there was less than all three. No call either to let me know so I could schedule more cars later in the day to fill the now available time. I finally told them after about a year I'd have to charge them $25 per car if all three were there and $30 per car if it was less than 3. They declined and I said they needed to find someone else then because I wasn't coming back.



Never again will I put myself into that position.
 
rlspringer said:
Thanks everyone for the feedback. I am going to stick with my guns and charge $25. If they do not like it, then they can get some other guy that does not care about quality. I will keep my reputation.
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I personally think you are doing the right thing. I think 25.00 is too low as it is. This is not a group insurance plan. It takes just as much time and work to wash each one,no matter how many are waiting in line.So why should your time and effort cost less per car? Call Carl Faberge and ask him what the discount is,for buying multiple Faberge eggs.
 
One other thing I have to consider is that they have no hookup for water or electic. That means I have to use my pressure washer and generator, which means I pay for gas! That is going to offset the price a little with gas being so high.
 
That's very true Scott. It's a guess as to whether you're going to spend that 50% extra time picking your nose because the day includes 10 cars, or using that time to make the extra $50 that you wouldn't make otherwise. Now if I have labor costs that could have been sent home then the $50 might go straight into their pockets.. or close to it. That may not be worth it.



I would DEFINATELY make it very public at that company that I'm giving them a discount and only if they maintain a certain volume. That way if the contract runs out, or I have enough business that I need that day to do full-price car washes, then the customers from that place know full well they'll be paying the full price. Or if they miss me on my day and come to my place they'll also know full well what the price will be.



Actually I like NozeBleed's approach the best.



NozeBleed, you said you have other negotiating practices. How about a few more tips? lol..
 
my friend used to do car washes for a living and says he goes to dealerships who pay him roughly $4 per car.. He said him and his partner did like 200 cars in one day. It takes them about 2 minutes do do each car, only using a large deionized water tank and a large chamois.



He says most cars are pretty clean and a wash consists of a rinse and dry. He dried each car in a minute and a half using the chamois.. He said it takes some technique but for the most part all the cars were clean by the end of the day.



He said he does a different dealership every day..



crazy, if you ask me...
 
NozeBleedSpeed said:
I personally think you are doing the right thing. I think 25.00 is too low as it is. This is not a group insurance plan. It takes just as much time and work to wash each one,no matter how many are waiting in line.So why should your time and effort cost less per car? Call Carl Faberge and ask him what the discount is,for buying multiple Faberge eggs.
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That is an old dealer trick: "we're sending you x amount of cars a year so we expect a hefty discount based on the volume". What they fail to realize is that the volume does not make it less work to do each car. This is a service - not a commodity we are selling here. Your costs will vary from job to job based on varying factors as opposed to say a can of coke costing the same (or nearly the same) to produce each can in a production run.
 
Shineshop,



I wouldn't consider it a dealer trick... If I was a dealer and I was giving you X number of car's, I would also ask for discount.



For a mobile detailer, the greater the volume you have a one site, the less down time you have traveling between sites. If I was able to provide you with 1/2 to a full day's work, I would expect some type of discount as opposed to having you the detailer only complete 1 or 2 vehicles.



As a customer, I would expect that the $25 basic charge includes travel time etc. So, if you're doing more than 3 cars, I would expect a reduction in rates - especially if it's with a guarantee for a X number of vehicles / day-week-month.



Negotiating is just that. It doesn't mean they are looking to demean that the work you are doing. As for the 600 personcompany, if I was negotiating - I'd like a trial period with a discount to ensure I was a happy with the quality. If so, then I would be willing to pay the price you were asking.



I definitely wouldn't turn away business at such an early stage. Agree to some sort of concession to gain the business with an understanding that it's only an introductory offer based on assurances that a minimum X number of cars / day would be part of the agreement. Getting your name around a company of that size could help in the long run ...



Mike posted some excellent info. Most people don't understand that there is a difference between detailers. You need to inform them of what offer as a service and highlight the very little things. i.e. new towels between cars, 2 bucket method to minimize swirls.



The other thing I would do is offer an consultation. That way, you can go over the vehicle with the owner and highlight how poor washes and maintenance lead to issues. Inform them of the attention to detail you pay in washing/waxing their vehicle and why they should do business with you and not the competition.



The more people understand, the better chance you have of landing the work. If at the end of it, they still are only focused on price, then walk.



Never compromise quality for quantity or $$$.
 
Originally posted by paco

I definitely wouldn't turn away business at such an early stage. Agree to some sort of concession to gain the business with an understanding that it's only an introductory offer based on assurances that a minimum X number of cars / day would be part of the agreement. Getting your name around a company of that size could help in the long run ...
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It depends. In my case, it wasn't worth it at all, either with the construction company or a used car lot. All I got was a low price for my services and a lot of headaches.



If rlspringer can have an option to raise his prices as needed agreed to by this company, then maybe it will work out.



Originally posted by zenhog

That's very true Scott. It's a guess as to whether you're going to spend that 50% extra time picking your nose because the day includes 10 cars, or using that time to make the extra $50 that you wouldn't make otherwise. Now if I have labor costs that could have been sent home then the $50 might go straight into their pockets.. or close to it. That may not be worth it.
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Good point, but if it takes 8 hours to do the first 10, do you want to work another 4 hours, making it a 12 hour day for $50 more? If you could do the other 5 cars in a couple of hours, then it would probably be worth it at that point.
 
Dump the job. People like that, that are very price sensitive, will dump you in a heart beat for the next kid that comes down the road that charges a dollar less than you.



You want them to do biz with you for the total service you offer. Price is one factor but so is the products you use, if your reliable and so on.



Stick to your prices. If they go to some body else let them. Give them a call back in a month or two to check up on them. I think what they need is some hacker splash -n- dashers to do their cars before they will fully appreciate you.
 
Update:

I stuck with my guns and price. I blew them away on the quality. I did 4 washes ranging from $25-$35 and the results were great. I have a full detail scheduled next Friday. One of the big shots mentioned that my washes were a lot better than the previous guy they had. The security head was shocked at the wash I did on his car. (pics to follow). He is a heavy smoker and after cleaning the interior he could not tell that he smoke in the car. I could not get the smell removed since it was only a wash, but he mentioned that in a couple of weeks he would like me to really clean the interior. Don't know if I can remove the smell in the vents, but the inside will smell clean. Customers asked me about the price, but when they see the results - all mention that it is worth the price. QUALITY RULES!
 
Great to hear.



Wurth has an A/C vent deodorizer or you can go the route I take. I spray some Lysol (Crisp Linen) with the fans set on the high setting and in taking fresh air. Makes the vent smell clean and fresh.



Keep up the good work!
 
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