black bart
New member
GM CEO will step down in JAN. This will make 4 CEO's in 18 months.
I wonder how big his golden parachute will be.
I wonder how big his golden parachute will be.
Gm ceo steps down
- Thread starter black bart
- Start date
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
This is their chance to turn it around. They need to go out and get the best person for the job that they can find.
As much as I hate GM (and Chrysler) for what they've done in the recent past, I'd really like to see them turn it around and get on the same track as Ford and start building the American auto industry back to where it needs to be.
As much as I hate GM (and Chrysler) for what they've done in the recent past, I'd really like to see them turn it around and get on the same track as Ford and start building the American auto industry back to where it needs to be.
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
After reading an article, it looks like this was "part of the plan" and that they already have a successor who currently sits on the board. But they did make a profit for the second consecutive quarter - which is a huge improvement from losing $13 billion in a single quarter only a year ago.
GM posts another profit, moves toward stock sale | cleveland.com
GM posts another profit, moves toward stock sale | cleveland.com
As a unwilling shareholder, I have had zero confidence in him and GM since they chose to come out and claim that their debt was paid in full and ahead of schedule when they knew all along that was not true. I'm ready to see some real repayments from these reported profits. They must continue to grow leaner deleting overlapping/duplicated badges and building a world class product. While they have done some of this, IMO there is plenty more trimming to do.
Bunky
Detailing Gnosis
GM is planning to stock offering to raise money to buy off the US government.
Yes, they are. Let's go ahead and see a payment from that net profit. I have expectations that they have no plans to pay in full all monies provided to them by the American public. Time will tell. Not letting up on Chrysler either, but they haven't (yet) made the mistake of blatantly and intentionally lying to the American public about their commitment and status to repayment.
Major skeptic here. Gotta ask why a CEO leaves just as the impact of his work is beginning to show good results? Most will stick around to bask in a little sunshine and collect the attaboys.
OTOH, many times a CEO will get the H*ll out of Dodge if he sees storm clouds coming, so that he's not damaged goods with a 'fail' on his record when looking for his next gig.
The only reason I can see for the switch is the new guy's consulting contacts may help make GM's IPO a success. Several Congressmen facing re-election need this, because large parts of the country are still very upset at the bailout.
GM has a long way to go before they can stand on their own two feet. I don't see the new guy taking them there.
OTOH, many times a CEO will get the H*ll out of Dodge if he sees storm clouds coming, so that he's not damaged goods with a 'fail' on his record when looking for his next gig.
The only reason I can see for the switch is the new guy's consulting contacts may help make GM's IPO a success. Several Congressmen facing re-election need this, because large parts of the country are still very upset at the bailout.
GM has a long way to go before they can stand on their own two feet. I don't see the new guy taking them there.
black bart
New member
I saw on the local news this morning that GM is selling a stamping plant in Indianapolis,Indiana. They told who was buying but I don't remember the name it was not a auto manufacture.
They keep hanging on to GMC so their Buick dealers will have a truck to sell they need to do away with it.
They keep hanging on to GMC so their Buick dealers will have a truck to sell they need to do away with it.
Just one of the duplication of efforts I had in mind in my post above. :bigups Heck, I'd go so far as to say dump the Escalade at the same time. Just a ridiculous vehicle anyway, IMO of course and I have a friend that drives one. It has been stolen twice since he has owned it and it happens to be on the list of the most stolen vehicles.
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
I think part of his "appointment" was that he would step aside once GM showed signs of profitability. If I recall, he was appointed by President Obama or his designated car czar.
I completely agree. It's really astonishing how both they and Ford were at the same desperate point, and how Ford has really stepped it up and GM is still, well, GM.....
Regarding the IPO, I think there's a lot of government red-tape that has to be approved before it can happen. Imagine that.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
The ignorance is strong with this one.... :crazy:
They did repay in full the initial loan which was given to them per the terms of that loan - they did NOT lie about that. They incited the uninformed, sure, but that would have happened no matter what they said.
Once funds have been raised via an IPO, GM will pay out to the Government all of the money they are required to pay. There are some appropriations that have gone to GM to cover specific developmental programs which were also given to other automakers (almighty Ford included) without the expectation or requirement that they be repaid.
I think the real problem GM has to overcome is the fact that so many people have their heads in the sand when it comes to understanding what is happening -- they'd rather sit back and play uneducated armchair CEO than try to familiarize themselves with the finer points of GM's business situation and funding sources. The auto industry isn't as simple as some would purport it to be.
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
I think you might need to do a little research on that instead of being a GM-homer. They repaid that "initial loan" you speak of with another chunk of beg-money they received from the government. In essence, they moved numbers around on the balance sheet and then lied to the American public about it about "repaying the loan in full."
I think a lot of GM's problem is not that people have their head in the sand, but that a lot of people are riled up because of the antics they've pulled over the last 18-24 months.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
GM was issued two separate pools of money; one had stipulations on what it was to be used for and came with a strict and specific timeline for repayment. The other was not technically a "loan," rather it was a line of credit -- still meant to be paid back but not as restricted as the initial loan.
If GM felt they were in a stable enough position to utilize their line of credit to repay the loan (as opposed to reserving those funds for other operational expenses) that's their choice -- and obviously since they're now turning a profit, they were right to make that choice.
That's not "lying to the American public," nor does it excuse them from having to repay the Government just as they're required to pay back any other creditor they have (meaning the creditors of General Motors Company as it emerged from bankruptcy protection). It's simply a business transaction. Nothing more, nothing less.
If they do not repay the line of credit in a reasonable matter of time, I totally agree that they should be gone after in the courts, but we have yet to get to that point, and it's really not fair or appropriate to speculate or anticipate that the new GM will screw over their creditors. If they're not given the chance to succeed and do the right thing, they won't -- and the American taxpayer will be screwed.
By "a lot of people" I'm assuming you mean people who don't understand how to run a business, especially one as large and complex as a car company....
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
The American taxpayer was screwed the minute our government gave GM a handout that a majority of the taxpayers were against. At least most everyone outside of Detroit and Mexico, anyway.
I don't know what you think is so hard or different about running a car company versus any other large business in the United States. Seeing as how GM and Chrysler seem to get "save us please" money where other folks don't, I see that as having an unfair advantage against every other business out there. There's a lot of industries out there that face the same challenges GM does, yet they sink or swim on their own and they have done so for years. You have to be profitable to stay in business - unless you're GM or Chrysler apparently.
You can call their "repayment" whatever you like - the fact of the matter is that they tried to play it off like they repaid it "with interest" 5 years ahead of schedule out of their own earnings. ANyone with an adding machine and Excel can move around numbers on the balance sheet to present it however they like. And then, to top it all off, they announce recently they're taking $500 million of our taxpayer dollars to invest in Mexican plant facilities. Same ole GM crap wrapped in a different package. At least it wasn't on four wheels this time.
All difference of business opinion aside, I hope GM can continue their last couple of quarters profit into the future and turn things around. As much as I dislike them and Chrysler for the recent past (as well as thirty years of crap vehicles), it would be nice to have them strong and hiring a lot of American workers. As long as they don't go back to doing what they did that got them in such bad shape to begin with. However, they have to earn the respect and trust of the consumer back - the consumer doesn't "owe it" to GM or Chrysler to give them another chance.
I don't know what you think is so hard or different about running a car company versus any other large business in the United States. Seeing as how GM and Chrysler seem to get "save us please" money where other folks don't, I see that as having an unfair advantage against every other business out there. There's a lot of industries out there that face the same challenges GM does, yet they sink or swim on their own and they have done so for years. You have to be profitable to stay in business - unless you're GM or Chrysler apparently.
You can call their "repayment" whatever you like - the fact of the matter is that they tried to play it off like they repaid it "with interest" 5 years ahead of schedule out of their own earnings. ANyone with an adding machine and Excel can move around numbers on the balance sheet to present it however they like. And then, to top it all off, they announce recently they're taking $500 million of our taxpayer dollars to invest in Mexican plant facilities. Same ole GM crap wrapped in a different package. At least it wasn't on four wheels this time.
All difference of business opinion aside, I hope GM can continue their last couple of quarters profit into the future and turn things around. As much as I dislike them and Chrysler for the recent past (as well as thirty years of crap vehicles), it would be nice to have them strong and hiring a lot of American workers. As long as they don't go back to doing what they did that got them in such bad shape to begin with. However, they have to earn the respect and trust of the consumer back - the consumer doesn't "owe it" to GM or Chrysler to give them another chance.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
Detroit, and every other American city that would have been catastrophically damaged economically had GM or Chrysler simply been allowed to fail. What replacement industry do we have that is developed to the point that it could immediately react and absorb the workers who would have been displaced when suppliers, assembly plants, corporate offices, dealerships, distributors, and a myriad of other businesses reliant on the industry closed down?
Can't think of any? Me either.
Again, what other industry in this country is or even could be large enough to offset the loss of GM or Chrysler? For that matter, what other industry is as large as the auto industry and faces the same problems on the same magnitude that GM and Chrysler do?
Can't think of any again? Thought so.
Their marketing decision may have been slightly misguided, but it was far from a "lie," because they did repay the loan along with the interest that had accrued by the time they made the payment.
While seeing them invest in a Mexican facility wouldn't be my first choice, I do understand that the reason they're doing it is because the product they plan to produce there shares a platform with the other vehicles already built there -- meaning it is the most efficient decision to utilize the tooling already in place there and simply increase production capacity.
As for the snide remark about "At least it wasn't on four wheels," I realize that some of GM's products have been questionable in quality, but the vast majority especially since 2000 have been great vehicles.
As more and more of the truth comes out about them, I can't really say the same for Toyota.....
I would say it's not the consumer owing it to GM or Chrysler as much as owing it to themselves and every other taxpayer that funds the Government to consider and purchase GM and Chrysler vehicles. If they don't do so, there's no way the Government (and ultimately taxpayers) will get their money back.
Also just keep in mind that GM/Chrysler paying their loans back won't result in individuals being cut checks as a "refund" for the funds given to the companies. I have seen a lot of people out there lately thinking they deserve to personally receive money out of these funds, which really baffles me. It's not like any of us had a "GM Bailout" line item on our tax returns.
black bart
New member
This morning on the local news they say the GM stamping plant may not be sold after all.
JD Norman the company that was going to buy it wants wage concessions.
The UAW workers vote tomorrow but some of them were on tv and they were really vocal about how they can not take a reduction in pay or benefits.
If this deal falls through GM will close the plant in the fall of 2011 but the UAW seems to be hell bent on riding this gravy train till it derails.
JD Norman the company that was going to buy it wants wage concessions.
The UAW workers vote tomorrow but some of them were on tv and they were really vocal about how they can not take a reduction in pay or benefits.
If this deal falls through GM will close the plant in the fall of 2011 but the UAW seems to be hell bent on riding this gravy train till it derails.
JaredPointer
COME AT ME BRO
Glad to see that you share the government and GM's view that they are irreplaceable and that there wouldn't ever be another company that could step in and take their place if they happened to go away. It's short-term
thinking like that that keep (and continues to keep) GM able to do the things they do. GM can be replaced, and most likely would be if they left the marketplace. You really think the majority of American people were in favor of giving money to GM and Chrysler?
Industries with the Largest Employment - Industry - America's Career InfoNet
Auto manufacturing doesn't even make the top 50 on this list (as of 2008) of people employed in industry in the United States. So there's at least 50 I can think of.
What cars are you talking about? I've been in plenty of GM/Chevrolet cars from 2000 & up, and the vast majority of them were not on par with Nissan, Honda and/or Toyota. Some of them were, most of them were not. But then again, this is awfully subjective and there's no real way to quantify it unless we go and do some research regarding customer satisfaction numbers and I just imagine that GM wouldn't be ahead of Ford, Honda, Nissan or Toyota.
Misguided marketing. That's a good spin on it. But it was purposely intended to mislead anyone who doesn't know what they did.
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Ah - the ole GM fallback. When you can't do anything right, start knocking on the competition.
I don't agree with everything Toyota does or continues to do. However, I've had several Toyota vehicles that have done me right as compared to some of the domestic crap my family has had that was a constant headache.
I'll go back to my "buying a Silverado" example I've used before and then I'll bow out. I pretty much had cash in hand when I needed to buy a full size truck, and could not get the Chevy/GMC dealer to even call me back. And this was when they were hurting to sell anything and losing billions of dollars in any given quarter. That pretty much sealed the deal for me. I considered them, they blew it, and unless they really bent over backwards to work for me in the future, I'll never consider GM anything. And you can use the defense that was a dealer and not GM - but the local dealer is the face of GM, and GM does have to license them, so they're part of the GM family. So I'll say it's not only the manufacturing side of things they stink at and need to fix, but their customer interface network as well.
C. Charles Hahn
CCH Auto Appearance, LLC
I think the majority of American people who live in areas that are heavily reliant on the auto industry understood the importance of keeping their already compromised economies afloat. Considering the populations are much more dense in areas where that isn't the case, it doesn't surprise me to hear people with the view that these companies aren't important enough to save. If you want to talk about short-sighted thinking, not giving a damn about the people not in your immediate geographic vicinity is it.
Looking over that list, what I see are a number of industries that get a lot of their business from auto manufacturing. Without those jobs, how many people do you think would still be able to afford to use those products and services?
I suppose you'd be fine with paying out the money that was given to GM and Chrysler to individuals in the form of unemployment benefits instead, right? In which case there would never be even the slightest prospect of recovering the cash....
Typical response of an import enthusiast with no concept of business patriotism.
Yeah, because that's not what the competition does too.... :gotcha:
"We're spending a million dollars a day to promote safety for our customers! Oh and by the way, here's another recall about a few million 5+ year old vehicles that have safety problems we knew about, hid, and did nothing to fix until years later."
I totally agree that some of GM's dealers leave a bit to be desired, but it isn't like there aren't just as many bad apples in other car companies' dealer networks. None of the automakers can realistically keep an eye on every single dealership every single day to ensure there aren't any problems.
Bunky
Detailing Gnosis
This is one key reason the industry in the mess they are in. I am sure the union has some good argument why they do not want to concede but a job should be better than no job even if they feel like they are getting hosed.