Vegas1
Member
I`ve always used a panel wipe product since I started using coatings a few years ago. Blackfire Paint Prep and Wolfgang Perfekt Finish Paint Prep are two I`ve tried with excellent results.
Panel Wipe Poll
- Thread starter Fishing
- Start date
Desertnate:
The Collinite wax "sweating" issue when too much is applied in a humid ambient environment sounds more likely and plausible than an incompatibility issue between Meg`s M205 polishing TSOs (Trade-Secret Oils) and Collinite 476S wax. I, too, am a wax-waster and tend to over-wax.
Yes, it did require some "elbow grease" to remove the hazing/fogging on the truck mentioned in the above post. Dried excessive Collinite wax is VERY difficult to remove manually. Never thought of using a QD to aid in that department.
Still waiting on responses/suggestions for what exact make and type of microfiber(s) to use with Prep Wipes.
[Somehow ,Captain Obvious, requests for EXACT make and type of microfiber(s) to use for any detailing task seems to be a particular "fetish" (I `d like to think of it as a "concerned interest") of yours.]
Reference thread: https://www.autopia.org/forums/car-...ask-list-autopian-suggestions.html?highlight=
The Collinite wax "sweating" issue when too much is applied in a humid ambient environment sounds more likely and plausible than an incompatibility issue between Meg`s M205 polishing TSOs (Trade-Secret Oils) and Collinite 476S wax. I, too, am a wax-waster and tend to over-wax.
Yes, it did require some "elbow grease" to remove the hazing/fogging on the truck mentioned in the above post. Dried excessive Collinite wax is VERY difficult to remove manually. Never thought of using a QD to aid in that department.
Still waiting on responses/suggestions for what exact make and type of microfiber(s) to use with Prep Wipes.
[Somehow ,Captain Obvious, requests for EXACT make and type of microfiber(s) to use for any detailing task seems to be a particular "fetish" (I `d like to think of it as a "concerned interest") of yours.]
Reference thread: https://www.autopia.org/forums/car-...ask-list-autopian-suggestions.html?highlight=
William_Wallace
New member
I stopped buying separate panel wipe I’ve been using Megs concentrated glass cleaner and Feynlab rinseless out of sprayer. I soak car down with fenylab rinseless wipe up and spay Megs glass cleaner during wipe up only on coating. If it’s a sealant I only do fenylab rinseless.
the strongest panel wipe I have used from a detailing company is gtech but expensive.
the strongest panel wipe I have used from a detailing company is gtech but expensive.
Accumulator
Well-known member
Just to muddy the waters a little 
(heh heh, kinda just kidding...), these days I generally use a Finishing Polish, or an actual AIO, that leaves [stuff] behind. NO, I don`t strip that off. The products I use are compatible with my LSPs and *do not, in any way* compromise their durability or anything else.
I always strip the panel when doing correction, just to make sure it *really* looks the way I want it to. But by the time it appears perfect enough for the Finishing, that concern isn`t there.
(heh heh, kinda just kidding...), these days I generally use a Finishing Polish, or an actual AIO, that leaves [stuff] behind. NO, I don`t strip that off. The products I use are compatible with my LSPs and *do not, in any way* compromise their durability or anything else.I always strip the panel when doing correction, just to make sure it *really* looks the way I want it to. But by the time it appears perfect enough for the Finishing, that concern isn`t there.
roscopervis
New member
I have used a form of panel wipe if the situation has called for it - Applying a coating, applying a durable sealant or wax etc. However, I don`t use a panel wipe if I`m using an AIO and I`m applying something over that, it would totally defeat the point!
More recently, I won`t use a panel wipe if using a primer polish prior to coating, again because the point of the primer polish is to work with the coating and to avoid the need to panel wipe.
So it isn`t called for in every circumstance. I`m sure that lots of solvent heavy waxes like Collinite will quite easily cope with and remove any light polishing oils by themselves.
IPA - the actual alcohol, not the wrongly used catch all term as the `wipe down` is another thing that needs to be addressed. It isn`t very good by itself as a panel wipe. Firstly, it shouldn`t be used at dilutions above 20% as it causes ructions with the paint/clearcoat. It will swell it, reveal previously hidden scratches as a result of these swells and only works on some oils. If you`re using it at 20% dilution, then you`ll need other products to boost it as it isn`t very effective at all at this level, so what you gonna use?
All panel wipes that are alcohol based have other surfactants and degreasers in to make them effective, they are never just IPA. GTechniq`s is very strong, but probably too strong really, as it causes the paint swelling and strong IPA issues mentioned above. I`ve learnt this over the years, particularly when strong IPA panel wiping my Basalt Black Cayman with stupidly soft paint and was revealing straight line scratches that were definitely not there before the wipe, and it wasn`t hidden by the oils. Leave it a while and they`d go again.
What do I do now? Similar to William Wallace (and Atbalfour) I use Feynlab Pure Rinseless on my microfibre towel to remove the polish. I`m sure this leaves the surface pretty dang naked, plus is amazing to help removal of products from super soft paints. I used to use Griots Brilliant Finish (or any other normal ONR type rinseless wash) but Feynlab Pure Rinseless is something else. From there, you can use any panel wipe you want, though you don`t have to go aggressive. Gyeon Prep or CarPro Eraser aren`t particularly strong in the same way GTechniq`s is so won`t give you the paint issues that does, plus as there is virtually nothing left to remove, it will be more than adequate.
So, that`s what I do.
More recently, I won`t use a panel wipe if using a primer polish prior to coating, again because the point of the primer polish is to work with the coating and to avoid the need to panel wipe.
So it isn`t called for in every circumstance. I`m sure that lots of solvent heavy waxes like Collinite will quite easily cope with and remove any light polishing oils by themselves.
IPA - the actual alcohol, not the wrongly used catch all term as the `wipe down` is another thing that needs to be addressed. It isn`t very good by itself as a panel wipe. Firstly, it shouldn`t be used at dilutions above 20% as it causes ructions with the paint/clearcoat. It will swell it, reveal previously hidden scratches as a result of these swells and only works on some oils. If you`re using it at 20% dilution, then you`ll need other products to boost it as it isn`t very effective at all at this level, so what you gonna use?
All panel wipes that are alcohol based have other surfactants and degreasers in to make them effective, they are never just IPA. GTechniq`s is very strong, but probably too strong really, as it causes the paint swelling and strong IPA issues mentioned above. I`ve learnt this over the years, particularly when strong IPA panel wiping my Basalt Black Cayman with stupidly soft paint and was revealing straight line scratches that were definitely not there before the wipe, and it wasn`t hidden by the oils. Leave it a while and they`d go again.
What do I do now? Similar to William Wallace (and Atbalfour) I use Feynlab Pure Rinseless on my microfibre towel to remove the polish. I`m sure this leaves the surface pretty dang naked, plus is amazing to help removal of products from super soft paints. I used to use Griots Brilliant Finish (or any other normal ONR type rinseless wash) but Feynlab Pure Rinseless is something else. From there, you can use any panel wipe you want, though you don`t have to go aggressive. Gyeon Prep or CarPro Eraser aren`t particularly strong in the same way GTechniq`s is so won`t give you the paint issues that does, plus as there is virtually nothing left to remove, it will be more than adequate.
So, that`s what I do.
roscopervis:
I have never heard that iso-propyl alcohol (IPA) causes "paint swelling". Not exactly sure what that is and if it caused permanent damage AND does that only affect certain manufacturer`s and types paints (clear-coats actually). Hey, I am here to learn.
I`ve used 90% IPA as a panel wipe for many years when I learned about it in this forum.
I think "informed" detailers have migrated to true panel wipe products instead of IPA because of the better solvents and lubricants in them for better cleaning with less change of scratching, but that would be my guess.
Also learned that your Cayman`s Basalt Black paint/clear-coat is "stupidly soft". Never knew that.
SOMEDAY someone here in this forum is going to gather/organize/comprise the information about specific manufacturers vehicle`s colors that are known to be soft and then publish that list. (Hey, it is on my Captain Obvious Autopia Forum Christmas wish-list. Any "Santas" out there??!)
I do know that BMW Jet Black is supposedly soft , as is Rolls-Royce Black.
I have never heard that iso-propyl alcohol (IPA) causes "paint swelling". Not exactly sure what that is and if it caused permanent damage AND does that only affect certain manufacturer`s and types paints (clear-coats actually). Hey, I am here to learn.
I`ve used 90% IPA as a panel wipe for many years when I learned about it in this forum.
I think "informed" detailers have migrated to true panel wipe products instead of IPA because of the better solvents and lubricants in them for better cleaning with less change of scratching, but that would be my guess.
Also learned that your Cayman`s Basalt Black paint/clear-coat is "stupidly soft". Never knew that.
SOMEDAY someone here in this forum is going to gather/organize/comprise the information about specific manufacturers vehicle`s colors that are known to be soft and then publish that list. (Hey, it is on my Captain Obvious Autopia Forum Christmas wish-list. Any "Santas" out there??!)
I do know that BMW Jet Black is supposedly soft , as is Rolls-Royce Black.
roscopervis
New member
Most times you will not hear about it as paint swelling, it will be more like a question from somebody asking “Why is my buffing towel leaving marring after the panel wipe?” It isn’t the buffing towel, it’s the paint swelling and it’s usually only noticeable on darker colours.
There’s lots of reading about why almost pure IPA is not recommended. I would hope that people have changed because other products are more effective and safer at the same time. The Feynlab Pure Rinseless method is amazing.
Lots of cars are a surprise, it was to me when I first polished it. Give me hard paint to machine any day, though some paint like some off the Mercedes and Audi’s is crazy hard but still marrs easily. Bizarre.
The truth with every car though is inspection and test spot. Different colours will have a different hardness across the same vehicle range I’ve found, and then when there is a different year too, I don’t think there are as many generalisations as many beginners think.
There’s lots of reading about why almost pure IPA is not recommended. I would hope that people have changed because other products are more effective and safer at the same time. The Feynlab Pure Rinseless method is amazing.
Lots of cars are a surprise, it was to me when I first polished it. Give me hard paint to machine any day, though some paint like some off the Mercedes and Audi’s is crazy hard but still marrs easily. Bizarre.
The truth with every car though is inspection and test spot. Different colours will have a different hardness across the same vehicle range I’ve found, and then when there is a different year too, I don’t think there are as many generalisations as many beginners think.
Bill D
Hooked For Life
I can confirm that Audi and Mercedes paint can be hard yet mar easily. It drives me nuts especially since the two I work on are black. Extreme washing measures are a must
Accumulator
Well-known member
Kinda along those lines: When I had a (now-MIA) fellow Autopian do a full Detail on a SUV, he failed to strip the oils from Menzerna`s 106FF. Looked fine, but after a while a gazillion holograms "came back" even though the 476S over top of `em was still 100%/
Eh, at least the IPA works for you on that...
Huh, never really thought about that...never had any problems but maybe that`s because I get virtually everything off with the "regular buffing" so I`m just stripping carrier agents/oils/etc. and since all my MFs are paint-safe it`s just never bitten me unless a speck of dirt/etc. somehow got on there and escaped my notice.
Desertnate
Active member
This has been my experience too. I`ve used the original Blackfire Coating Prep, Gyeon Prep, and CarPro Eraser. All were slightly different in the way they performed, but all accomplished the same task.
Accumulator
Well-known member
IME *ALL* autopaint mars easily...yeah, even single stage white Imron (for those of you with long memories). "Hard"/"Scratch-resistant"/etc....eh, at best I consider such stuff to be purely relative, and at worst it`s simply nonsense, and IMO both views are valid.
I`ve *heard* of it, but I`ve never *experienced* it. Not once, ever. But hey, that`s just my IPA (which I used undiluted, even the 90% stuff) on my paint, and it`s apparently one of those YMMV! things since people I consider credible say it really can happen. Not that I *really* care since IMO it`s simply lousy as a PaintPrep Product anyhow, at least compared to those that`re *made* just for that.Lonnie said:
wannafbody
wannafbody
Just to muddy the waters a little
I always strip the panel when doing correction, just to make sure it *really* looks the way I want it to. But by the time it appears perfect enough for the Finishing, that concern isn`t there.
ZPC fuzion leaves a really clean finish for someone concerned about what gets left behind. Mothers 3 in 1 ceramic polish is more like an aggressive AIO for a ceramic coating base. No need for a wipedown with either one.
Accumulator
Well-known member
Ah, that`s good info, thanks for posting it. Never know, I really *might* use up some of my products some day and need to find something else and those sound promising!
roscopervis
New member
It`s a very strong panel wipe, so if you want one that isn`t solvent based but will do the best job of removing stuff on the panel, its a good choice. However, it is one of the ones that can cause the swelling issue I mentioned, so if using it, leave it rest for a few hours afterwards so it`s completely dried/evaporated before coating.
Products like CarPro Eraser and Gyeon Prep are much less aggressive and won`t remove nearly as much as GTechniq PW, but also won`t cause the swelling issue either. If you follow the polish wipe off method I and a few others do, using Feynlab Pure Rinseless to soak the polish removal cloth, that will probably remove 99% of what`s on the panel and much more safely. Then, you can use any panel wipe you want.
I`ve used IGL Precoat, Gyeon Paint Prep and Optimum Paint Prep. They all worked very well for me. Precoat and Gyeon appear to be alcohol based. Precoat is pretty strong and can strip some sealants. Not sure what Optimum is. I was really impressed with Optimum surprisingly. It flashes pretty quick and leaves nothing behind. I was playing around with them on our electric stove top. The Optimum can even be used on glass and interiors. I have a gallon I got for $36. I cleaned a mirror with the Optimum last week just to try it and was shocked how well it works on glass.
danlc95
Member
Only when the manufacturer of the LSP recommends it.