Are carnuaba waxes an obsoleted car-care product?? (Continuing on the great debate...)

Lonnie- Yes indeed, the whole "wax/sealant" thing gets murky. That FK1000P (which I'll hard-sell again in a moment...) is labeled "High Temperature Wax". And it looks like a wax. It was developed as a "mold release wax". Wax wax wax. But everybody considers it a "paste type sealant" and it sure does look and act like one. Heh heh, it's gotten to where I pretty much just disregard the (supposed) distinction. I'm not saying it's a false dichotomy, but oh man it certainly seems to border one in most cases (e.g., what is Collinite 476S? Who cares, I go by its functional attributes).

I felt *exactly* the same way you do about trying FK1000P. Got a sample tin ages ago and just let it sit there unopened for (literally) years, finally tried it on a set of wheels just to use it up before it went bad. Now look at how I push the stuff! I'll admit that its look might not please everybody, especially on certain colors (especially dark ones). But I quit using (many layers of) KSG, eh...I quit using most of my LSPs, because this stuff is just such a miracle product for me. Will it be for somebody else? I dunno. But if nothing else it saves me *so* much time because I don't have to rewax, or even *wash* as often. And that tin will last for many, many years. OK, I'll climb down off my soapbox. For now ;)

I'm actually tempted to sell off my (considerable) stash of M16 and Pre-VOC 476S! One can of 476S would last me forever on the '93 Audi, and much as I like the way-back effect of using M16 I'm tiring of rewaxing my wife's car every few months.
 
Are carnuaba waxes an obsoleted car-care product?? (Continuing on the great d...

I think Pinnacle Synergy is the best of both worlds it's a wax with some coating ingredients that seems to hold up for me really well.
 
Re: Are carnuaba waxes an obsoleted car-care product?? (Continuing on the great d...

Swanicyouth said:
I think Pinnacle Synergy is the best of both worlds it's a wax with some coating ingredients that seems to hold up for me really well.
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Love it on the Vette

Good stuff !!!!
 
ATTENTION MODERATOR................


Lets have a memorial service for waxes, blow them off the store and close this thread since "WE: have decided waxes are dead :)



Ronny, that was for you, do you remember that day you tried to get me to try a sealant?
 
JSFM35X said:
ATTENTION MODERATOR................


Lets have a memorial service for waxes, blow them off the store and close this thread since "WE: have decided waxes are dead :)



Ronny, that was for you, do you remember that day you tried to get me to try a sealant?
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Thank you Jeff, Thank you !!!
 
Waxes sure have their place at this high volume hack shop. Especially when one of my detailers is heavy handed with the rotary and leaves halos behind. A quick smear and they're gone!

And from a manufacturing standpoint, they are certainly here to stay too. There's no way coatings will ever be popular enough to affect the sale/manufacturing or waxes. It's a household product that is in just about ever garage.
 
I agree that for a regular joe who waxes his car once a year wax is where it's at. For anyone who takes detailing seriously or cares about protection. I think wax it dead for someone like myself who values his fee time. Why decon, clay, polish and wax only to have to repeat in 3-6 weeks when I can extend the protection 2 plus years ? That my point and again my opinion. If you like wax, be my guest and wax on my good friend.

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David Fermani said:
Waxes sure have their place at this high volume hack shop. Especially when one of my detailers is heavy handed with the rotary and leaves halos behind. A quick smear and they're gone!

And from a manufacturing standpoint, they are certainly here to stay too. There's no way coatings will ever be popular enough to affect the sale/manufacturing or waxes. It's a household product that is in just about ever garage.
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JSFM35X said:
I agree that for a regular joe who waxes his car once a year wax is where it's at. For anyone who takes detailing seriously or cares about protection. I think wax it dead for someone like myself who values his fee time. Why decon, clay, polish and wax only to have to repeat in 3-6 weeks when I can extend the protection 2 plus years ? That my point and again my opinion. If you like wax, be my guest and wax on my good friend.

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I prolly don't value my free time, because I'm more than willing to spend it waxing. If you go through all the prep steps initially - you only have to top off the wax with a new coat maybe once a month (at most); but, there is no need to re-polish, decon, and clay at that time - just wash and apply another coat of wax. Takes maybe a half hour or so (depending on wax).

I don't think any coated car approaching 2 years since application will look as good as one just waxed. Of course, the coating really doesn't last 730 days, it's degrading the whole time. So is wax. The difference is - wax is easily and readily renewable - where you have to go through a whole rigmarole with a coating.
 
I don't think they're obsolete, but for me I just don't use em like I used to. In my single/child-less days, I had plenty of time to spend doing things like waxing my vehicles. Now? Not so much, which is why I've moved on to coatings. Now if/when I have a mustang back in my garage someday for a "fun" car, that will probably get the carnauba again.
 
JSFM35X said:
I agree that for a regular joe who waxes his car once a year wax is where it's at. For anyone who takes detailing seriously or cares about protection. I think wax it dead for someone like myself who values his fee time. Why decon, clay, polish and wax only to have to repeat in 3-6 weeks when I can extend the protection 2 plus years ? That my point and again my opinion. If you like wax, be my guest and wax on my good friend.
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Decon, clay, polish every 3-6 weeks? If that's been your process, no wonder you like coating!! I'm with swanicyouth for all his reasons.
 
Some have taken coatings to be treated like paint with a requirement for even more layers of sacrificial products: detail sprays. It never ends.
 
Waxes don't last that why I reapply so often. I was using p21s 100%. Waxes hold dirt and debris. Re waxing on top of contamination look like hell to me. Ever see a girl who put nail polish over nail polish. Yuch. It a mess and I don't do mess. When I was waxing and I did for years I would always wash mad clay then quick polish to remove any micro marring and wax. This was before there were iron removal products.

Not with coatings I extend out all the labor intense stuff because the coatings last so long.

To each their own.

Blade9 said:
Decon, clay, polish every 3-6 weeks? If that's been your process, no wonder you like coating!! I'm with swanicyouth for all his reasons.
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I cannot not disagree with anything you said as a statement in general. It just is not what I am after.

Accumulator said:
Reasons why coatings and/or seal might not be the best approach:

-No concealing (not every finish can be corrected well enough for the coating, or a sealant, to look OK)
-Difficulties regarding spot-correction (including the need to relayer with multiple-coat-type sealants such as KSG)
-Subjective factors (appearance, beading vs. sheeting, scent, slickness, etc.)
-Time/effort/cost/requisite application skill

Note that I'm no coating-hater, I use one on certain wheels. I'm no sealant-hater, I use one (FK1000P) on most of my vehicles. But I can't do any more correction on the '85 Jag (not *bad* for single stage of its age) or the '93 Audi (simply awful condition due to original owner and its dark blue that shows every flaw) so those need concealing, and most sealants don't look right *in my eyes* on those cars anyhow.

Hey, give me a sealant that conceals and gives depth/jetting on dark colors and I'll use it on that Audi. Give me one that conceals and looks right on older single stage and I'll use it on the Jag. Give me an Accumulator-proof coating that's as easy to use as my current stuff, conceals marring, looks "right for the vehicle" in my eyes, and allows for easy spot-correction and I'd probably use it on everything ifit offered advantages over FK1000P. But I don't see any of my current LSPs as being deficient in any way for their applicatons, so why would I change? What am I missing by not using a coating instead of FK1000P? What am I missing by using a wax instead of a sealant on the vehicles that get that? Hey, those are serious Qs, give me some reasons! I might not change, but I'd enjoy discussing it.
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My 24x7 daily driver sits outside and has had 30k mile added to it since the EXO v2 was applied. The car still looks amazing and clens easily. It just lost some beading. Before the winter I was going to winterized it but decided the just Permanon it until after the winter as I decide what to use on it. Sadly the Permanon was short lived either because the product is not designed to bond to. A coating or it is just gone in a few months.

The car cleans easily just tough to dry when the beads don't blow off.

My issue it I go through the whole rigamarole for re waxing as I do re coating because if I don't I can see the difference. Which I did not see the difference just like I wish I did not hear the difference in audio equipment.

If you like waxes, use them. If you have never tried a coating. Find someone near you and at least look. Once you have tried both use what you want. I make the exact same amount of money no matter which you choose. So to me, your happiness it my ultimate concern. Mike Philips sells and uses it all, and I love his slogan whatever you use, use often.

Enjoy your day.

Swanicyouth said:
I prolly don't value my free time, because I'm more than willing to spend it waxing. If you go through all the prep steps initially - you only have to top off the wax with a new coat maybe once a month (at most); but, there is no need to re-polish, decon, and clay at that time - just wash and apply another coat of wax. Takes maybe a half hour or so (depending on wax).

I don't think any coated car approaching 2 years since application will look as good as one just waxed. Of course, the coating really doesn't last 730 days, it's degrading the whole time. So is wax. The difference is - wax is easily and readily renewable - where you have to go through a whole rigmarole with a coating.
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I agree, and I let the coating stand on their own. If I am topping it I feel I purchased the wrong coating. To me the coating should achieve excellent hydrophobic abilities, for an extended time and add or just display the polished paintwork below.

The topping of coatings is a profit maker for the industry and there nothing wrong with that, I just don't buy into it.

Bunky said:
Some have taken coatings to be treated like paint with a requirement for even more layers of sacrificial products: detail sprays. It never ends.
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JSFM35X said:
I agree that for a regular joe who waxes his car once a year wax is where it's at. For anyone who takes detailing seriously or cares about protection. I think wax it dead for someone like myself who values his fee time. Why decon, clay, polish and wax only to have to repeat in 3-6 weeks when I can extend the protection 2 plus years ? That my point and again my opinion. If you like wax, be my guest and wax on my good friend.

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It's not that I like or prefer wax (or sealants for that matter), I actually prefer coating all my personal cars. I just think that it could take decades for coatings to take over the protection market.

In retrospect, speaking of the word "coatings", I think it's becoming more and more of a buzz word that several companies are using to trick people into thinking inaccurately about what their product actually is. Optimum basically kick started the coating popularity in the US and claimed permanent protection (now 5 years). After that, other contenders came out with their "coating" but were quite different in many ways from what OPT had created. And the main difference is longevity. they claimed theirs would last 2 years and tend to push boosters to help this happen. Now, I can't help see other companies bringing in their "coating" and claiming it should last 6 months to a year. What will be next? A product called a coating that will come in a can and look like a paste wax? (sarcasm)
 
The market will change when automakers apply coatings at the factory. Of course, the detailing industry will respond. Coatings have a bad name now because all the dealer applied paint protection products. The good news is people will always wash their cars improperly so there is still is always the detailing business.
 
JSFM35X said:
I cannot not disagree with anything you said as a statement in general. It just is not what I am after.
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And that subjective element makes all the difference IMO! Since none of this stuff is life-and-death critical, it's all about whatever makes ya happy.

I am curious about just what, specifically, you meant by "not what I am after"...hard for me to pinpoint it since I brought up so many things! As I said, I find this an interesting discussion, especially since different people value different things.
 
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