Z-6 alternative?

wfedwar said:
I feel your pain. I have a 4Runner with permanent etching on the hood that appeared after only a couple of months while wearing Zaino. I had similar etching on my truck, but caught it before it became permanent. Pollen+light rain+Zaino seemed to cause the problem very quickly. I've talked to swimming pool owners in my area and they tell me it is almost impossible to keep the pH up when pollen is bad. This is probably specific to the plants in your area, but for me it means pollen is acidic. Couple that with a strong-beading sealant that offers little protection and you get problems. That last sentence is my read on the issue. I've tried a lot of sealants and waxes and the most protective I've found are the acrylic sealants (Klasse, Werkstat). This makes sense, as they are weaker beading and the polymer is acidic itself, and therefore not as vulnerable to attack by another acid. There is/was a thread on the OCC board where Dr. G described this very same thing, and as I remember he listed protection from acid rain spots as one dimension where acrylic polymer sealants outperformed other sealants.
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I know that Werkstat is acrylic based. Is Optimum? I didn't think they were? :think:
 
wfedwar said:
Nope. Dr. G was comparing pros of acrylics vs pros of Optimum's polymers.
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Ah, thanks for the clarifications.



Do you have a link to that discussion? I went on Optimum's forum but I couldn't find it.
 
mobenzowner said:
What part of the country are you in?
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I live in south Florida where it rains in the afternoon followed by intense heat and sunshine. Water beads just bake on the car. Like I said, I'm not blaming Zaino, but I did find a product that protects against this type of environment better.
 
Very interesting stuff!



"Another benefit is cross-linking between layers so that if you add a layer of Opti-Seal or Optimum Car Wax on top of Opti-Seal, Poli-Seal, or Optimum Car Wax it wil bond to the previous layer(s). This can not be done with polyethylene-acrylics since there is no cross-linking capability in this technology.



The one advantage polyehtylene-acrylics offer is that since they are acidic by natue, they hold up better to acid rain, however, at the same time since they are acidic, they can cause minor etching of the paint. All and all, for the above reasons, our entire line is free of polyehtylene-acrylics and therefore all of the products in the Optimum line are compatible with each other."



Things that make you go "hmmm". :think:
 
Polyethelene is what Collinite uses-non crosslinking. As for waterspotting I have it bad. I live in an orange area and have hard water so bad that if it dries on the windshield it waterpsots and window cleaner will not remove it. I have to use Duragloss water spot remover to get it off the windows. Products that crosslink keep the minerals on top of the polymer instead of allowing it to fall through the cracks of the non crosslinked wax.
 
We shouldn't jump to the conclusion that cross-linking is the be-all end-all of sealants. It's one way to adhere to the polymer molecules to themselves. Another is through strong H-bonding, which is something you expect from acrylics. Also, just because something is cross-linked, it does not mean that it cannot be attacked by sun, chemicals, etc.
 
wannafbody said:
Polyethelene is what Collinite uses-non crosslinking. As for waterspotting I have it bad. I live in an orange area and have hard water so bad that if it dries on the windshield it waterpsots and window cleaner will not remove it. I have to use Duragloss water spot remover to get it off the windows. Products that crosslink keep the minerals on top of the polymer instead of allowing it to fall through the cracks of the non crosslinked wax.
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I have used Collinite extensively on my family's cars and have not had the same waterspotting issues as I had with Zaino. So was it equal with Zaino and Collinite in your case?
 
wfedwar said:
We shouldn't jump to the conclusion that cross-linking is the be-all end-all of sealants. It's one way to adhere to the polymer molecules to themselves. Another is through strong H-bonding, which is something you expect from acrylics. Also, just because something is cross-linked, it does not mean that it cannot be attacked by sun, chemicals, etc.
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I don't think even Dr. G was suggesting that cross-linking is the be-all end-all of sealants, and he even acknowledged where acrylics might have an advantage.



A lot of this stuff is above my head, but I do find it interesting. It seems as though if you really want to have a layering effect, you want a product that will cross link.
 
Rob Tomlin said:
I don't think even Dr. G was suggesting that cross-linking is the be-all end-all of sealants, and he even acknowledged where acrylics might have an advantage.
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I agree with this--and I wasn't saying that Dr. G was saying it, but rather that seemed to be the opinion of others.



Rob Tomlin said:
It seems as though if you really want to have a layering effect, you want a product that will cross link.
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I agree to an extent. Elsewhere in the thread, Dr. G acknowledges that acrylics can layer, but that each layer would have a diminishing return. This makes sense to me as well, but I'm not sure if the percentages he gives are fact-based or arbitrary examples.





Rob Tomlin said:
A lot of this stuff is above my head, but I do find it interesting.
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I'd dare to say it's over the head of (almost?) everyone on this board. I took several polymer science classes in grad school, but without real experience in the area, I'm still piecing it all together.
 
yakky said:
I have used Collinite extensively on my family's cars and have not had the same waterspotting issues as I had with Zaino. So was it equal with Zaino and Collinite in your case?
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Well, the(silver) stripes were on the hood so they were flat and took a full frontal attack of coal plant fallout-literally dirt clumps fall from the sky and some type of tar like drops fall on the vehicles. I placed a silver decal on the rear center panel of the car a couple years ago and it has only ever been protected by Zaino and it looks as nice as day 1. It still gets some fallout and it gets road grime kicked up on it. Now, I can't say that they both were under the exact same conditions but IMO the Zaino has done a great job at protecting vinyl.
 
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