Should I trust the dealership detailer or take it to someone else?

Jreepers

New member
Finally got my new car. Unfortunately, there are some marks and imperfections on it: a couple of scratches, a small chip, and what looks to be a "permanent" smooth smudge/scrape in/under? the clearcoat.



The dealer said these are there because I told them to skip the detail, which would involve a polish. Maybe, maybe not. Dealer said that their detailer can fix everything at no charge. Given the general reputation of dealers, even though it would save me $150+ vs. going to a non-dealer-affiliated detailer, I hesitate to take him up on the offer for fear of them screwing things up even further.



Any advice? Do I take them up on the offer and worst case scenario they do a bad job I just take it to someone else to fix it? Or should I avoid them like the plague even though they apparently have a full time detailer who details all of their vehicles?
 
Jreepers, I think you already know the answer to this question.



What kind of car did you get?
 
Yeah, probably. ;)



It's a 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee. Here are some pictures showing what I'm talking about (ignore everything but the scratches and scuffs -- the other weird looking, oddly colored stuff is reflections, and obviously there are water spots too):



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How serious is the damage from an ease-of-removal-by-most-detailers standpoint?



By the way, if you're wondering why I accepted the vehicle with those issues: there are a lot of reasons: Mainly, they're much less noticeable in real world outside lighting conditions, and most only noticeable when you're looking for them up close. These pictures were taken inside under a powerful light. Also, at the time I wasn't sure I felt comfortable with the dealer doing the work (especially since one of the workers in the shop area was pretty rude in a passive way) -- I was afraid they might make it worse, or just do a half-assed job and use products that hide the issue rather than fix it. And, I've waited long enough for this vehicle; I could've asked for another one or looked elsewhere but who knows how long I'd have to wait, as this model year was just released. I don't think I would be able to get as good a deal elsewhere either. Finally, it's going to get scratched and marked up anyway. These are the sort of things that bother you when you first see them or they first happen, but then you learn to forget it -- which is the healthiest way to be, in my opinion.



But all that being said, since this is a new vehicle, I would like to get all of that stuff corrected. ;)
 
Dealership detailer usually means wool pad on a rotary, heavy filling glaze and looks pretty good until the glaze washes off. Then you see the buffer trails and swirls they installed and it looks worse than before. Once in a while you will find a decent dealership detail dept, but it's not the norm since their job is get the car in and out as quick as possible which means hide the defects with a glaze, high speed rotary because it does the job quick to apply the glaze. Usually they don't even realize they are swirling it up because the glaze hides what they did as they're doing it.



My advice is bring it to a good detailer, have them do a one-step and spot compound those areas with the deeper defects. My rule of thumb, without measuring thickness of the paint is, if you can't catch a fingernail in it, it will come out. If you can catch a fingernail in it, it's too deep to come out, or it may come out but will thin the clear so much it's better to leave it.
 
Richard Grasa said:
Usually they don't even realize they are swirling it up because the glaze hides what they did as they're doing it.



+1. This is my thought process, too. There are way too many horror stories posted here about those times when the dealer was given a chance "to make things right". Save yourself the aggravation, Jreeper.
 
Yeah I echo the opinion of others here, avoid the dealership at all costs. This vehicle is a big investment, pay the money and take it to someone who knows what they are doing. There is a 95% chance you WILL regret it if you take it to the dealership.
 
I agree with everyone else here with one exception: the issue that you cannot identify. They are saying it can be taken care of by a detail, but if you take it to someone else and it cannot be removed they will claim it was the detailer's fault. I would find a good detailer to do an inspection and measure the paint, particularly that spot. Have them give you a quote for the whole job and take their advice on that spot. As a detailer, if you brought it to me and I had any uncertainties about that spot I might recommend you have the dealership fix ONLY that spot and insist on monitoring the work. This would at least prevent the dealership from claiming the damage was made worse by the detailer and refusing to fix it.
 
I'm a detailer at a dealership and i'll be the first to admit, I wouldnt take my own car there. There are some good detailers that work at dealerships but thats not usually the issue, its the products used. Every detailer knows that no 2 car finishes are the same and need its own combination of products and pads to bring it to perfection. At dealerships, nobody does test spots and sees what product and pads combo works. They just slap on a cutting pad and some low end meguiars product and go at it. They dont use DA polishers, which IMO are needed for a perfect finish, especially with the products i like using.



Then you have the dumb detailer who you'd think was trying their hardest to burn off the paint.
 
Frankly, this is one of those situations where "if you have to ask, you already know the answer." Finding a reputable professional and paying their rate for a proper detail is unquestionably the way to go.
 
^^^^+1.



When I was looking into a detailing spot at a dealership I was told their "best guy" could do a full detail (wash buff wax) in an hour... Anybody who's ever taken the time to even properly wash a car knows this is right in the range of impossible.



Their job is to make it look good on the lot, not worry about actual correction or long term effects.
 
I'm a tech at one of the best dealerships in the area. Our service department is great our detail department however is not. They hire mainly kids who don't know and don't care about proper detailing. They use and reuse old dirty micrfibers. They drop them on the ground, pick them up and go back to washing/waxing the car. My bays are right next to detail so I see what they do. It's not the kids fault they don't know any better.



Dealerships are about quantity not quality. If I get a chance to by a new 5.0 this summer for my wife I'm not letting anyone touch it. After it gets unloaded from the trailer I will be the only one in it.
 
I e-mailed one local detailer, told him the situation, and he said I should take it to the dealership and have them make it right since it's a new car. He politely said he won't get in the middle due to liability concerns.
 
Look for other detailers then...



The dealership is literally just going to put a glaze on it with a rotary. It will look amazing when they're done, not so amazing when the glaze washes off.
 
LilJayV10 said:
I'm a tech at one of the best Ford dealerships in the area. Our service department is great our detail department however is not. They hire mainly kids who don't know and don't care about proper detailing. They use and reuse old dirty micrfibers. They drop them on the ground, pick them up and go back to washing/waxing the car. My bays are right next to detail so I see what they do. It's not the kids fault they don't know any better.



Dealerships are about quantity not quality. If I get a chance to by a new 5.0 this summer for my wife I'm not letting anyone touch it. After it gets unloaded from the trailer I will be the only one in it.



You know what absolutely sickened me? I had already been detailing on the side for close to 5 years. I've done it all when it comes to detailing. When i first got hired at this dealership, I had these people TEACH me how to detail THEIR way. I had to sit there biting my lip and cringing at all the stupid techniques they used. I had to sit there and watch these guys tell me the correct way to "finish" a detail using a cutting pad and swirl x( which is a very low end meguiars product if you dont know).
 
Man you guys are brutal. Im a "dealership" detailer and I could fix all that and not make anything worse so i wouldn't assume everyone in dealerships is a hack...
 
.

Don't know how long you have been a Ford tech or if the Ford Star education broadcast are still done. Back in aprox 2004, I worked with the Manager of the Body/Paint Technical Center to do a live Ford Star broadcast on basic procedures for the "cosmetic" pre-delivery of new Ford vehicles. It was live and then rebroadcast twice a week for a month.

Now if you are familar with that training system, you know that you had to go into a room at your dealership and "sign on", then watch the training session, etc.

John Hughes, who was the manager of Body/Paint told me that at the end of the month, only 50 or so dealers had their new car/used car get ready people watch the training.

When the dealers service managers, etc were asked why such a low volume of attendee's, the normal response was "they know what they are doing and it's not that important, like training regarding an engine or transmission, etc".

In 1990, I worked with the engineers at Mazda to create a guide book for dealers for the subject. Not many ever followed it.

My assistant at AI, Tim Brune, now in charge of the AI Tech Center, just worked with them again to produce a simple (not an enthuisist, I have hours to do it my way sort of thing) new process manual.

You can see and read it at valugard.net under the engineer's sections, they calll it "Vehicle Storage Management. I had limited input on the manual, at the request of the Mazda Service and Training Director, old friends for 25 years, however understand why it had to be done in such a simple manner.

There are some good, simple instructions and explaination in the manual and some may notice the warnings regarding the use of such solvents as lacquer thinner, etc on vehicles.

Two years before I retired, Hyundia had me do a series of two hour seminars for their entire field engineer's service people for US and Canada. Produced a nice 30 page manual, one that was simple in explainations,etc. These field people took it into dealers and discussed it, had copies made, etc. to leave with the service managers.

Having worked with many of their field people for over 13 years, knew most, had their personal phone numbers, emails, etc.

When I would ask them how this was being accepted by the dealers, their service managers, etc, the answers were pretty much the same as Ford's dealerships years before.

It is not that the manufacturers don't care, and they do try to address the issues.

The problem is the way the car companies are structured, and what one person in one of them, explained as the "big bucket".

Which is that if there is a customer complaint, the dealer will normally, sort of, attempt to resolve it and if the concern was created by the dealers employee's, they could "throw the claim in the bucket of claims" and get paid on a part of their agreement referred to "fit and finish", which then moved the costs back to the assembly plant, not coming out of the dealers revenues.

Dealers are paid a flat fee for new car get ready. If they can move any "concerns" to their warranty side, they can then collect the "internal warranty cost reimbursement", which is a lot more than the flat rate fee for new car get ready.

Just some "inside input" on this issue.



So, yeah, sometimes it is better for a new owner, who has the abilities and equipment, to do their own "new car prep", depends on each dealership and if they are one's that actually do what is best for the customer, not just their bottom line.
 
Got a call today from a prospective client who had some minor defects in his paint, dealership said they would take care of it and ended up leaving buffer trails all over his new Grand Cherokee. They tell him to bring it back when a detailer they contract with would be there. He brings it in, the "detailer" said it would be done in an hour. He told the detailer that there is no way he can get the swirls out in an hour. The detailer tells him he isn't going to remove them, just hide them and that swirls are a fact of live with a black vehicle. :wall
 
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