NEED HELP! Thanks

Bobcat

Bobcat

New member
A friend came over with his new (to him) BMW 325. It's a couple years old, interior perfect and tires good. Problem is there are major scratches in the paint, white paint. It looks like someone scrubbed places on the hood with a bug spronge full of grits. I wiped part of the hood down with WG pre-polish cleaner and a MF towel then I hit it (three times) with XMT #3 and a yellow pad (LC) with the PC -start on 3.5 then 6 till the polish was gone. It looked better but the some scratches were still there. I tried the wool pad and WG swirl remover, 3.5 then 6 on the PC til it dusted. Better still but not totally removed. OK, I'm ready to go medival on this - plan to get Megs #84 or #85 and hit it agin, I'm looking for suggestions, buying a rotary is not an option at this point, thanks anyway, so do ya'll think a PC and the Megs will do? Also, the guy says not to worry, if I can't get it out he'll have it repainted ( money talks I guess) Thanks a bunch for your quick replies, I have to get something and be ready by next Sat to do this Beemer.
 
I agree, I beleive the general rule of thumb is if it catches in your finger nail, it needs paint work to correct it. I have the XMT line, and while its decent I don't find it strong enough for scratches.
 
Keep in mind that you don't "remove" scratches.
You bring the surrounding paint down to the level of the scratches.
As has been mentioned, the finger nail test is a pretty good indication of when the damage may require paint work.

Charles
 
Sorry, I should have stated that you can't "catch" your fingernail on the scratchs. They're just very visable and make the paint look dull and hazy. Looked like Beavis and Butthead tried to clean it. I ordered some 85,84 and 1 along with #7 glaze. I have WG sealer and Natty's Blue, ass-u-ming I can get the scratches out, which LSP would ya'll suggest?
 
Junebug said:
Sorry, I should have stated that you can't "catch" your fingernail on the scratchs. They're just very visable and make the paint look dull and hazy. Looked like Beavis and Butthead tried to clean it. I ordered some 85,84 and 1 along with #7 glaze. I have WG sealer and Natty's Blue, ass-u-ming I can get the scratches out, which LSP would ya'll suggest?
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You might want to check, but Meguiar's #85, #84, and #1 used to be for rotary use and may not break down with a PC. #1 was reformulated and it may be suitable for use with a random orbital, but I would want to be sure before I used it.

Charles
 
Junebug said:
Sorry, I should have stated that you can't "catch" your fingernail on the scratchs. They're just very visable and make the paint look dull and hazy. Looked like Beavis and Butthead tried to clean it. I ordered some 85,84 and 1 along with #7 glaze. I have WG sealer and Natty's Blue, ass-u-ming I can get the scratches out, which LSP would ya'll suggest?
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Where you will improve the scratches with a PC, this sounds like it might be a job for a rotary.....and maybe some wet sanding...on the BMW that I brought there were some scratches on the hood right by the windshield, where the wipers connect to the car....to me it looked like a cat had slept there....wet sanding lightly and a rotary with SSR2.5 and a cutting pad took them out....I polished after that and they where gone.
 
Thanks Mr. Beemer, what grade sand paper did you use? I'll get some, but I want to try the Megs first - yellow pad, or wool - maybe both, before I give up and wet sand.
 
Junebug said:
Thanks Mr. Beemer, what grade sand paper did you use? I'll get some, but I want to try the Megs first - yellow pad, or wool - maybe both, before I give up and wet sand.
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I use 400 grit 3M paper...its like a finger nail board grit....for me wet sanding I want the very least grit that I can have to start with...you can cut threw the clear pretty fast
 
Wow, 400 - that's pretty strong. I thought you were talking about 1200 or so, did you use a block or just free-hand?
 
Junebug said:
Wow, 400 - that's pretty strong. I thought you were talking about 1200 or so, did you use a block or just free-hand?
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I think that 3M has there own scale because this is real fine...much like 1200 or greater..that's my guess
 
OK, got it Thanks, I'm thinking of going by my old boss (auto-body shop) and see if he has some "extras" - not like I didn't earn a few tokens of appreciation. And Thanks to DETAIL CITY - you guys are great, I appreciate you helping a guy out.
 
Junebug said:
OK, got it Thanks, I'm thinking of going by my old boss (auto-body shop) and see if he has some "extras" - not like I didn't earn a few tokens of appreciation. And Thanks to DETAIL CITY - you guys are great, I appreciate you helping a guy out.
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Glad that I can help and good luck
 
Well, talked to my old boss, he thought some 2000 grit - block sanding and then some polish. He uses 3M Perfect II - what Megs product comes the closest to that?
 
yep -- #2 or #6

In my experience, there really isn't anything from Megs that compares to what Perfect-it II does (which is quite simmular to Finesse-it), however, the question was "what Megs product comes the closest..."

#2 will remove heavy surface marring/scratching as well as removal of colorsanding scratches up to 1500 -- even when using some good old fashioned hand muscle (this is from experience). #6 will also remove minor surface marring/scratching when used with a rotary and/or hand. #6 tends to gum up the pads though when used by machine. I would use these products as a multi-step process #2, then #6, followed up with #3, #7, (one is a hand glaze, the other a machine) or a LSP.

As for the 3M line, perfect-it would be a first step, then mach glaze, followed up with a hand glaze. As for me, I prefer Finesse-it over Perfect-it, just a prefrence though -- use what works best for you.
 
dr_detail said:
yep -- #2 or #6

In my experience, there really isn't anything from Megs that compares to what Perfect-it II does (which is quite simmular to Finesse-it), however, the question was "what Megs product comes the closest..."

#2 will remove heavy surface marring/scratching as well as removal of colorsanding scratches up to 1500 -- even when using some good old fashioned hand muscle (this is from experience). #6 will also remove minor surface marring/scratching when used with a rotary and/or hand. #6 tends to gum up the pads though when used by machine. I would use these products as a multi-step process #2, then #6, followed up with #3, #7, (one is a hand glaze, the other a machine) or a LSP.

As for the 3M line, perfect-it would be a first step, then mach glaze, followed up with a hand glaze. As for me, I prefer Finesse-it over Perfect-it, just a prefrence though -- use what works best for you.
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Since you are the professional and I'm just a hobby detailer, you should know.
#2 seems pretty mild for "heavy surface marring/removal" and # 6 has very little corrective capability from my use of it.
I'm not at all familiar with the 3M line, but Meguiar's has quite a few products that I would choose over those you have suggested.
#83 DACP is more abrasive than #2 for removal of some marring, but I don't think either one will do much for sanding marks. Neither one should require a follw-up polish after use. If you plan to use #6 as your wax, it should be fine after the #2 or the #83 and it shouldn't need #3, (which has some abrasives), or #7 after it. If you feel the need for a product like #7, #81 Hand Polish is a lot easier to use.
Do you actually use #6 to remove paint defects? Could you be thinking of #66?

Just as a reference, Meguiar's abrasive rating on a scale of 0 to 10 for some of their products, taken from Meguiar's 2006 Professional Catalog:
#85 Diamond Cut Compound 2.0 = 10 This is some powerful stuff.
#84 Compound Power Cleaner = 9
#4 Heavy-Cut Cleaner = 8
#1 Medium-Cut Cleaner = 7
#83 Double Action Cleaner Polish = 6
#2 Fine-Cut Cleaner = 5
#80 Speed Glaze = 4
# 66 Quick Detailer = 4 This is a cleaner/wax and not a QD like most of us are familiar with.
#82 Swirl Free Polish = 3
#9 Swirl Remover 2.0 = 3
#3 Machine Glaze = 1
#81 Hand Polish = 1
None of the following are listed by Meguiar's as having any abrasive rating.
#5 New Car Glaze
#6 Cleaner/Wax
#7 Show Car Glaze
#26 H-Tech Yellow Wax
#20 Poymer Sealant
#21 Synthetic Sealant

Charles
 
You certainly do know your megs products, along with all the marketing hype promoting them. I did mean #6 not #66. If I remember right, #66 is a spay -- similar to #34 except #66 is not body-shop safe (#66 contains silicone and/or wax). You're right about the abrasive chart, and according to it, there are more abrasive products available. I was trying to offer products found over the counter at most retail outlets from coast to coast. With the exception of #4, which I find just to un-uniformly scratchy, most listed above #2 are found at professional supply outlets. Perfect-it (found at professional outlets) contains a very fine uniform silica; IMO, very much like #2 however it is much less creamy than #2. And yes, from experience, when used liberally, #2 with a cutting pad on a rotary set below 1750rpm or with some heavy hand work using a diaper, will remove 1500 sanding scratches.

Big thing here is for us to share our experience in offering suggestions which can help a user find the solution they are seeking -- not to argue what is the best method of repairing a finish of a vehicle that only they can see. I'm trying to do that by sharing what has worked for me over the last 20 years of pushing towels around vehicles. What works for you Charles in removing scratches, with over the counter products, that are not so deep that a fingernail clicks but deep enough that they are visiable -- those that look like they were the result of someone using a bug sponge upon the paint?
 
One of the things that causes problems with people understanding Meguiar's products is the messed up names they have for some of their stuff.
#66 Quick Detailer isn't a spray. It is a liquid, fairly abrasive cleaner/wax intended for high volume use. In fact, it isn't even available in less than gallon sizes. The spray that is similar to #34 is Quik Detailer with no "c" in the quik. It was in the maroon bottle in the consumer line. I'm not sure it is even available anymore.
The Meguiar's professional line, (in the tan bottles), should be available from most any good body/paint supply store. Many auto parts stores carry many of the professional line, but not all will have the complete line.
My personal experience with Meguiar's has been good, but if 3M or any of the several professional line products had been as readily available, I'm sure I would have been happy with them as well. Meguiar's was a choice of convenience. :)
As far as OTC for minor paint correction, (which is all I consider myself capable of), Meguiar's #80 seems to work about as good as any. It's not as aggressive as some, but that keeps me out of trouble. :) It also leaves a finish that is LSP ready and that makes for a little less work. On occasion, I might use Meg's #83, but not very often.
Here again, I don't do this professionally, just for my own, family and friends' vehicles. Because of that, most of the vehicles I work on are in pretty good shape to start with.
As far as arguing, I don't consider a discussion with respectful disagreement an argument. Our exchange was, IMO, far from that.
When it comes to car care, so many options can be right that it is not likely all will agree on what is best. Not just polish or wax, but oil, tires, gas, even what make of vehicle to buy.
Actually, I guess that's probably true about most everything.

wavey.gif

Charles
 
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