Interesting e-mails about waxing fresh paint.

GlossyTundra

GlossyTundra

Tractor Detailer
I placed some emails to Sal at Zaino and David at Optimum regarding putting Zaino and OCW on fresh paint. In all the threads I have been reading about what to put on fresh paint, most suggest a glaze is all that can be done. Well, I cant do that. I tried to put some #7 on this weekend and it looked fine, but when I re-washed the truck today, there were terrible water spots on the whole truck. We have really hard water around our area, and a drop will spot almost permenantly. So I decided I needed a new approach and wanted to try to put something on the paint that will leave some protection. Then I remembered Zaino and OCW were rumored ok on fresh paint so I emailed the companies and they responded as such.



Sal's response.



There's alot of misinformation about waiting three months for the paint to

cure.



I am a custom painter by trade. I am very familar with Dupont, PPG and

all the other paint manufacturers.



The most I personally would wait on fresh "aftermarket body shop" paint

before

polishing with Zaino Show Car Polish is 1 week. That's more than sufficient

curing time.



Zaino contains no wax, silicones or abrasives.....



The new paints are catalyzed. A chemical reaction cures the paint. The

older lacquers and enamels needed time for the solvents to release. This

is not the case anymore. Believe me if that paint need 3 months to dry

than it will never dry.... Just the facts.



For the Ultimate in paint protection and an incredible Show Car finish on your above scenario. I recommend purchasing the Zaino Bros' Total Protection Show Car Kit.. Code# ZKIT-1



NOTE: Z-18 CLAYbar is not necessary on fresh paint...





David from Optimum



Dear Mr. Wiggins:



Thank you for your interest in the Optimum Car Care products. Optimum Car Wax is safe to use on fresh paint since it is water-based and has not abrasives or solvents. It will also provide great protection for the new paint. Please let us know if we can be of further assistance. Thanks again.







Both of them just seem to want to sell product, and they will agree that Zaino and OCW is ok on fresh paint just to get a sell. I do feel more comforatable putting something like Z-5 or Z-8 on the paint. I may go ahead and put it on the paint this weekend, I have to prevent water spots so they arent bad enough after 2months that the paint looks hellish.



Brandon
 
Hey Brandon

You will be fine if you put z5 on. I did a car that had newly painted fenders on and was only 2 or 3 weeks old paint. Z5 worked perfect and it had no problems at all. It made the new paint really glow.



Paint has changed a lot and most still think you have to wait for cure time. I still would wait at least 7 days. I use to paint cars too.



You just have to be careful of solvent based silicones.
 
Both of them just seem to want to sell product, and they will agree that Zaino and OCW is ok on fresh paint just to get a sell.



I think you are being a bit hard on both of them. You asked both a question and both answered your question and suggested their product line to fill your need. If you don't want to use their products take a trip to WalMart and get some NXT or Mothers FX.
 
I mean no offense here but just about anyone you contact (those who sell and manufacture) is going to recommend one of their products so of course the info is going to sound like a sales pitch for their products.



The information given is correct by both Sal and David.



Anthony
 
Have you seen Davids credentials.

Dr. Ghodoussi has over 12 years of experience as an Organic Chemist overseeing research and development focused in polymers and automotive paint formulations. He received his Ph.D. and Master's degrees in Polymer and Organic Chemistry from Oregon State University and an MBA from University of Memphis. He also holds Bachelor's of Science degrees in Chemical Engineering and in Chemistry from the University of California in Santa Barbara.





I didn't see that he was trying to sell you any thing. He told you that it was safe and if you needed further assistance to contact him.

David is not a sales man and he would be the first to tell you this.





Sal is a sales man.
 
Ok, I didnt mean anything by the "sales" comment, I just wanted to make sure that these guys arent crappin me on this subject. I want the best for my paint, and as controversial as Zaino/OCW on fresh paint is, I want to make sure that they are safe.



So would yall use Zaino or OCW judging by the responses or yalls experiences?
 
Brandon1 said:
Ok, I didnt mean anything by the "sales" comment, I just wanted to make sure that these guys arent crappin me on this subject. I want the best for my paint, and as controversial as Zaino/OCW on fresh paint is, I want to make sure that they are safe.



So would yall use Zaino or OCW judging by the responses or yalls experiences?
Click to expand...







The body shop that is next to me has me wet and and polish all of the BMW's and Mercedes that go through the shop. After we do the work we wash the carts and wipe them down with Optimum spray wax. I have been doing this for two years and no problems. Some cars come back a month later wrecked again and no signs of any problems. No customer complaints.
 
Dent's & Details said:
Sal is a sales man.
Click to expand...



Wow! That's a pretty bold statement. Being that Sal owned a premier auto shop for many years and is a custom painter, I definitely think he has the credentials, like david, to make the claims about the fresh paint. I too had the same question, and Sal said I was good to go after a week. I sealed my paint, and had no problems.



Either way, David and Sal are both VERY knowledgeable in the field. You can trust what they are telling you. They would never tell you to do something that would harm your paint just to put a couple extra bucks in their pocket.





Greg
 
Ok, that is what I needed to know.



I do still have one question. I know that Carnauba is NOT ok for fresh paint, but isnt OCW a carnauba base?
 
GregCavi said:
Wow! That's a pretty bold statement. Being that Sal owned a premier auto shop for many years and is a custom painter, I definitely think he has the credentials

Greg
Click to expand...



I did not say that he didn't.

I have spoken to Sal over the phone and he was very pleasant. Not angry and short tempered as others have posted. That being said. Sal didn't get to be where he is today not being a sales man.



My statement is not any bolder then Sal's.
 
Dent's & Details said:
I did not say that he didn't.

I have spoken to Sal over the phone and he was very pleasant. Not angry and short tempered as others have posted. That being said. Sal didn't get to be where he is today not being a sales man.



My statement is not any bolder then Sal's.
Click to expand...



Very well. I guess I mis-understood your statement. I have found Sal to, "say it as it is." Straight and to the point.



greg
 
Brandon1 said:
Ok, that is what I needed to know.



I do still have one question. I know that Carnauba is NOT ok for fresh paint, but isnt OCW a carnauba base?
Click to expand...



Why isn't carnauba OK for fresh paint? Even Ron Ketchum with ValuGard says that one of their wax products is perfectly fine for fresh paint.



People say that a layer of wax will not allow the paint to gas out but what they are not thinking about is this, how is the base coat gassing out since it has a clear coat applied over it? Paint is far smaller on the molecular level than wax, wax just lays on top of paint and cannot penetrate it.



So what many people are saying is that the paint is able to gas out through the clear coat but a thin layer of wax will stop it. Doesn't make sense to me. Think about this also....they wet sand and buff fresh paint with abrasive products shortly after being sprayed....both OEM and after market. So wax will not keep paint from drying properly.



Anthony
 
Brandon1 said:
Ok, that is what I needed to know.



I do still have one question. I know that Carnauba is NOT ok for fresh paint, but isnt OCW a carnauba base?
Click to expand...



OCW is polymer based with UV protection and carnauba added. I've used it on fresh paint (a few weeks after the paint job) and never had a problem.
 
The paint company (PPG) said only wash with plain water for the first 2 months and after that only use carnauba wax, no silicones or synthetics.
 
Brandon1 said:
The paint company (PPG) said only wash with plain water for the first 2 months and after that only use carnauba wax, no silicones or synthetics.
Click to expand...



:wow: The larger the company the more uninformed employees they hire. Wash with plain water= scratch city. Sounds like PPG wants to sell more paint.
 
i think either way you decide to go will be good for you and the paint, i personally use zaino products so i can't speak for optimum products, i'm sure they work great also. about your water problem, why not invest in a water filtering device to prevent the water spotting. i have the mr. clean filter that i use on my car and it does exactly what it says. just my 2 cents.:waxing:
 
The paint manufacturer will tell you to wait 3 months or longer on some clears. Like I Have said before, I know of a shop that waxes every car that leaves and have NEVER had a problem in the past 30 years. As mentioned before, paint is not the same as it use to be especially if it goes through the baking process. I mean, if you can take a vehicle out of the booth and color sand and buff the thing after it cools down that means that it is cured. It even tells you on the side of the clear that you can do that. The shop I refer to talked to their sherwin williams rep about this and he said that there is no need to wait before waxing. Personally I've never known of anyone to wait.
 
I was told the wait to wax fresh paint varies depending on weather conditions, if it is below 40 degrees that the catalyzed paint slows to crawl in the curing process. I was also told, like Anthony has state, that if paint can outgas thought several layers of clear a micron layer of Carnauba wax will not stop it – total wives-tail and internet rumors. Product that contain abrasive should be used – how about all the polishing that is done to new paint job? I was also told that the last micron of paint during the outgasing process is the softest and last to completely cure, that makes it the easy to damage. This guys take was don’t use any products that chemical bonding to the paint surface since it can penetrate the last micron of paint. I was told this by a retired employee of one of the three major auto paint manufactures and at retirement was in charge of the lab that test new products and trouble paint applications.
 
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