How thick should Collinite 476S be applied?

M

mikebai1990

New member
Accumulator mentioned that I may be getting less durability from my Collinite 476S than what most people get. I've been thinking about it, and I have a feeling that there is something wrong with my application.



Here's my problem: I use a Meguiars Gold Class yellow foam pad to hand apply the Collinite. When I apply the Collinite to a dry paint surface, I feel lots of resistance when making my circular motions when applying the wax. When I look at the paint, it seems the wax is not entirely/evenly covering the paint. However, when I look at it with the reflection of the sun, I can see the wax haze. Because of this, I have assumed that as long as I can see the wax haze, even if it's under the sun, there should be enough wax on the surface.



However, due to the relatively low durability I have gotten out of the wax, I'm wondering whether I'm not applying the wax thick enough. When you guys apply Collinite, how often do you put the applicator back into the tin and swab the wax out? How much wax do you put onto your applicator? I find that when I apply the wax, I'm making around 2 light swabs into my tin can to cover ~2.5 square feet of paint. This may not be accurate..



Also do you guys think that using the spit shine method by spraying water onto the surface will be a better idea? I've found that by doing so, I am able to easily glide the applicator across the paint surface. However, 1)The applicator gets quite damp and wet after a while, 2)After covering an area, and the water dries off, I'm not sure whether enough wax was applied.



Of course, I know other causes could be bad paint prep, possibly incompatible car shampoo (Meguiars GC), etc... But I was just wondering whether I'm simply not applying enough wax.



Thanks for your help!
 
try taking a mf applicator like this

autopia_1927_941126




wet it then squeeze all the water out of it so its just damp

then apply it thin you should feel alot less resistance and just see a clearish film very thin
 
When using a hard wax like 476 or Meg's #16 I really like to use the PC to apply it. I find I can get a thin and more even application that way. If you don't have a PC then I would try the LC Pads with a handle kit.



I would say if you can see a haze then it is thick enough, but you might want to throw on another layer just to make sure you get everything covered. 476 is about the most durable wax I've ever used, so if the surface is clean (polished and clayed if needed) you should get a lot of mileage from 476.
 
Yea, I usually layer the Collinite also. Recently, I've been adding layers on every time I wash to prepare to winter. Obviously, I wasn't prepared for the unseasonably warm weather :)
 
no doubt about the unseasonably warm weather, I had put 3 coats on one car and 2 on the other just to see if there was any difference in durability but it has been too warm to resist totry other stuff like poliseal on them



I usually apply it as thin as I can, my car is parked under a tree at home so it takes a beating LSP wise :aww: been impressed with 476 so far though
 
I always apply my waxes in very thin layers, as if its on too thick you end up just buffing away a lot of waste product... I too use Megs foam applicators to apply 476 by hand. What I really like to do is lightly spritz the applicator pad with a little qd (I use Meguiars Last Touch) before starting to wax and this seems to aid me in getting a nice even layer of the wax.



After one application out of the 476 tin of a reasonable size car, it looks like the tin has hardly been touched. Two layers easily sees me through a Scottish winter with a good four months durability - I reckon it would get more, but when the spring comes round I always strip back the protection and begin with my summer glazes and waxes. :)
 
CamV6 said:
What's the best way to get 476 onto a 6" PC pad?
Click to expand...



I actually use a knife, and scrape a very small amount out and spread it like butter on the pad - though a very very small amount like this, and onto a spritzed pad. A little of this wax will go a long way.
 
Dave KG said:
I actually use a knife, and scrape a very small amount out and spread it like butter on the pad - though a very very small amount like this, and onto a spritzed pad. A little of this wax will go a long way.
Click to expand...



Hmm, interesting, thank-you.



Would you say you get that much better a finish using a PC to apply the wax 9and buff off I presume) than by hand?
 
To be honest with you, I dont see all that much of a difference in applying a wax like 476 by hand or machine and I actually prefer doing it by hand and working the wax ontop the paint by hand and then removing by hand - there's no detrement in the finish in just doing it by hand... Its slower... but its horses for courses at the end of the day.
 
CamV6 said:
What's the best way to get 476 onto a 6" PC pad?
Click to expand...
For a 6" (or larger) pad I use a 1" plastic putty knife to apply a very small amount to the pad. Lately I've been using 4" pads that will fit into the larger wax tins.
 
It sounds like you are applying the right amount. I apply it with a blue propel pad via PC, and generally looking straight at the paint you cannot see the product. Looking at an angle into the light, you can see the wax haze. Apply to the whole car, then buff off. When you apply it very thin, it is extremely easy to work with.



As for applying to the PC pad, I use a plastic putty knife that is just a tiny bit smaller than the opening to the can. I stick it in the can and just shave some wax off the surface. Use the knife to spread a very thing layer over the pad, then scrape off any excess.
 
mikebai1990- Looks like you already got plenty of good advice, and I mirrored some of it over at the MPV forum.



Often (IMO) that "uneven looking appearance" after you first apply the wax is simply due to the *over-applied* areas looking "better waxed" than the areas that have merely enough.



FWIW, I believe I *do* get slightly better results applying my waxes by machine, usually the Cyclo. While it's not as dramatic with 476S as it is with #16, the heat/speed/whatever of the machine application tends to *IMO* render the paste wax somewhat liquid and thus ensure at least a more uniform application. I also prefer removal by machine using MF bonnets; besides getting the excess off efficiently I believe it can provide some light additional burnishing.



FWIW, I applied the last coat of 476S to the Blazer on (checking my records...) Sept. 7. Noting that I'm using a carnauba-rich QD after every wash (which can skew things when it comes to evaluating durability), after the wash/rinse the 476S still beads like crazy and feels very slick.



In my experience, using a QD when waxing (the "psuedo-spitshine" method) can have mixed results. My general observation has been that it results in a better appearance and a more uniform application, just like Dave KG has found. More sherical beading too, and the beads really fly off the panels. BUT I also find slightly less impressive durability, so for me it's a trade-off; sometimes I do it, other times I don't. I elaborated a bit more on this pseudo-spitshining over at the MPV forum.



Oh, and plastic razor blades can work well for getting paste waxes on the pads too. I used to leave one in each can of wax, but the one in my can of (pre-VOC) 476S curled up a bit...made me wonder what the solvents are doing to the plastic and what the plastic might be doing to the wax...so I quit leaving it in the can.
 
I was just thinking - maybe you aren't working the wax "into" the paint enough.. Wax needs a gentle but thorough massaging when applied by hand, something the PC makes a lot easier.
 
That seems like a probably cause. I don't really work the wax into the paint, in fears of creating marring. Maybe I'll try spending more time "working" it in.
 
mikebai1990 said:
I don't really work the wax into the paint, in fears of creating marring. Maybe I'll try spending more time "working" it in.
Click to expand...



That might pay off, especially if the paint isn't in absolutely perfect condition (the wax gets worked into the pores/micro-fissures better). Good call, Zet.



As long as you're using the right applicator and keeping an eye peeled for contamination (I'd just have a few applicators handy and swap them out as needed) marring shouldn't be an issue. FWIW I really *work* the wax with the Cyclo and I do believe it turns out a little better than when I do it by hand.
 
So I bought a PC yesterday, and I have a few questions which are still regarding the thickness of application.



When putting the Collinite paste on the pad (I'm using the white pad that came with the PC), how do you get it on evenly? I used a plastic scraper to smear the wax onto the pad, but I realized that the wax on the pad was by no means spread out evenly. There were smears all over the pad, and after application, the wax didn't really spread out on the pad.



How much Collinite do you put on the pad? I wasn't sure but I thought that I was maybe using more than I usually would in a hand application. Again, I'm not exactly sure, because with the PC, I scraped out the wax, thus seeing the glob of wax, whereas in hand application I just stuff my applicator into the tin can to get the wax out.



Last question: When the Collinite is applied onto the paint, is the wax haze supposed to be very visible? I found that when I applied the Collinite via PC, the wax was barely visible, and the wax buffer marks were extremely faint, and in some areas wax was not visible at all under the cloudy sky. There was no sun, so I couldn't view the surface from an angle as I would usually try to. I know that with a very faint wax haze, there should be enough to have that "molecular" (to use Accumulator's phrase) layer of wax. Maybe the PC is just a lot better at creating a thin layer of wax on the paint surface?



Thanks for reading the long post :)
 
mikebai1990- Yikes, I sure wouldn't use the pad that comes with the PC on automotive paint :eek: Hope you didn't mess anything up, those pads are functionally abrasive on lots of surfaces. *NOW* I tell you, huh?



To get the wax on the pad, I use either a plastic razor blade or a rubber bladed spatula (cut to fit in the can). Others put it on a small applicator pad and then rub *that* on the PC pad. At any rate, get as even a coating of wax on the pad as you can and then *scrape as much wax as you can back off the pad* in an even manner. You don't need as much on there as you might think.



Apply at speed 4-4.5.



The wax residue should *not* be "very visible". It should be a very thin coating so it won't jump out at you. If you just can't believe you got enough on there, do a spit-shine type of second application to put your mind at ease. I understand that it takes a bit of experience to gain confidence that the super-thin application is sufficient.



Yeah, the PC is better at this than you are ;) Consider that (assuming you don't press down so hard that it merely "jiggles"), assuming you have a nice even coating of wax on the pad, the PC is moving that pad around in it's "random orbital" movements...doing it a few *thousand* orbits per minute! The idea that, while doing all those orbits, it somehow *misses* a spot is pretty far-fetched when you really think about it in that light, at least IMO.



Get the wax evenly distributed on the pad in the first place, let *that* be your area of concern. You want every bit of the pad to be able to help apply the wax, that way you *won't* get any skipped spots.



Heh heh, and you think *yours* was a long post :chuckle: Consider the average length of *my* posts :o
 
Unfortunately, I've already taken the white pad to my paint on the Acura already. Yesterday it was cloudy so I don't know if I've done any damage. My mom has driven the car to work, so I won't know if I've messed up the paint until she comes back... Well, I made sure to put very little pressure (just the weight of the PC itself) on the paint, so hopefully I didn't make any serious scratches or swirls.



Well, I'll be ordering a backing plate and 3 Lake Country CCS foam pads soon, so I'll just lay off the PC until I get those pads :) I'm also going to need to get some polishing products eventually (after the winter, probably), I'm looking forward to removing all those ugly swirls I thought I would never have the chance to remove :)



Also, thanks for the clarification on the wax thickness. It's good to know.
 
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