How do you know a sealant won't bond to a wax?????

D

DM101

New member
May be opening a can of worms but How do you know a sealant won't bond to a wax?????



Have there been any studies on this? Have manufactures claimed this?

I know we have always hear that sealants won't bond but is there proof. Don't get fired up now just asking..........
 
I don't think you can generalise. Megs sealants bond to their waxes without issues. I can't find the thread but on MOL a Megs staffer explained the importance of oils (which waxes contain) in allowing sealants to bond to paint. I wish I could find it again. :(
 
This is an interesting subject. I'd think, even if it did bond it wouldn't last nearly as long. Sealant longevity far outlives a layer of carnuaba wax, so as the carnuaba wears off where does the sealant go?



And even more confusing: Dr. G of Optimum technologies says you can use Opti-Seal over wax, and that it'll "migrate" the Opti-Seal layer under the wax. That would be interesting to hear a technical explanation as to how that's possible.
 
And I know the fact a nuba just "sits" on the surface of your paint. Sealants cross-link to you clean car finish. Nuba's do not cross-link. I think visually you can not tell if it has bonded or not.
 
The oils probably prevent the sealant to cross-link to the paint. Some sealants claim to have nuba waxes in them,



Alfisti said:
I don't think you can generalise. Megs sealants bond to their waxes without issues. I can't find the thread but on MOL a Megs staffer explained the importance of oils (which waxes contain) in allowing sealants to bond to paint. I wish I could find it again. :(
Click to expand...
 
When a sealant *really* doesn't bond, it just smears around on top of the wax. Even after it flashes/dries it's like a slimy mess on top of the wax.



I had this happen in a huge way when I applied UPP v1.0 over 1Z *consumer line* MPwW. It was like a super-thin layer of salad oil all over the S8...what a mess, what a waste of time fixing it (and then two days later I deered it!). You *could* see it, pseudo-holograms that were quite visible even on the silver paint. And no, trying to buff it off (for ages) didn't solve the problem to my satisfaction; for some reason I just couldn't get it all off that way.
 
Mindflux said:
This is an interesting subject. I'd think, even if it did bond it wouldn't last nearly as long. Sealant longevity far outlives a layer of carnuaba wax, so as the carnuaba wears off where does the sealant go?



And even more confusing: Dr. G of Optimum technologies says you can use Opti-Seal over wax, and that it'll "migrate" the Opti-Seal layer under the wax. That would be interesting to hear a technical explanation as to how that's possible.
Click to expand...



If someone can find that Megs post it will explain much in understanding this issue.



MDRX8 said:
And I know the fact a nuba just "sits" on the surface of your paint. Sealants cross-link to you clean car finish. Nuba's do not cross-link. I think visually you can not tell if it has bonded or not.
Click to expand...



How many canaubas do you know that aren't hybrid waxes (carnauba/polymers)? Most contain polymers which cross-link. That's the foundation for any sealant applied over it.



MDRX8 said:
The oils probably prevent the sealant to cross-link to the paint. Some sealants claim to have nuba waxes in them,
Click to expand...



According to that post I mentioned oils are critical to sealants/polymers attaching to the paint.
 
Well like Mike P has said before, it's not like it's going to slide off the paint into a pool on the floor.



Will there be some streaking issues? Possibly, but it will vary depending on the products.

Will it diminish durability? Likely, but again it will depend on the products.





I say stick with the manufactures instructions and you shouldn't have to worry about it.





FWIW, I've never really understood the point of topping multiple waxes/sealants as I just don't see a difference.
 
I think the answer to these questions depend on what the polymer base is comprised of. Most car waxes and sealants are silicone or acrylic based. There might be other polymers but I doubt that any manufacturers are gonna reveal their secrets.
 
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