Does foam=no swirls?

M

mikebai1990

New member
I read from Accumulator's post about "swirl-free washing" and he mentioned that it's better to have less foam when you are mixing up your soap solution because lubricity is more important than amount of bubbles. I'm currently using Meguiars Gold Class, no foam gun (yet :)) I began experimenting with foam last wash when I used a hand soap product that had a foam head which turned soap solution into foam (softsoap foam fun or something). So I twisted the foam head off, cleaned it, and stuck in into my car soap solution and squirted some foam onto my wash mitt. With the extra foam, it seemed like the mitt was easier to glide around without feeling applying too much pressure to get the soap to stick to the surface of the car. What are your thoughts regarding foam and its relationship to swirling?
 
I started using my pinnnacle foam gun yesterday and lets put it this way. The difference between using a bucket and mitt compared to a foam gun is night and day. I experienced litterly no swirling (on a black vehicle) or atleast that was easly noticable.



Im never going back to a bucket/mitt that's for sure :) Except for ONR in the winter (in the garage)
 
I always thought swirls were the result of improper use of rotary equipment or old style circular waxing on a vehicle that wasn't clean (where the grit scratches the paint). Seems unlikely that you'd get circular swirls regardless of wash methods, which usually are back and forth or up and down, not circular. What am I missing?
 
abbeysdad said:
I always thought swirls were the result of improper use of rotary equipment or old style circular waxing on a vehicle that wasn't clean (where the grit scratches the paint). Seems unlikely that you'd get circular swirls regardless of wash methods, which usually are back and forth or up and down, not circular. What am I missing?
Click to expand...



Much to the consternation of some detailers (mainly old-school pros) the word "swirl" has come to mean most any kind of non-linear marring. Plenty of people don't wash in straight lines anyhow, so "swirls" generally just means light scratches as best I can tell. I know some people who always wash in straight lines and their marring might not be circular/elliptical, but man is it bad!



So let's just say the topic of concern is "wash induced marring" :D



mikebai1990- The foamgun/amount of suds/related factors are just part of the overall situation. Think about the root cause of wash-induced marring: moving abrasive dirt across the paint while applying pressure to said dirt. Anything you can do to minimize this effect will be beneficial. Your approach helped lessen the pressure exerted against the dirt, so it was beneficial.



While I advocate a "dislodge and flush" approach, where the volume of sudsy wash solution (i.e., "foam" from the foamgun) and the lubricity of that solution are *IMO* the key, that's not to say that other approaches won't work great too. Any change in technique that reduces your wash-induced marring shows that you're on the right track. If you basically *eliminate* it, you've found the method that works for you.



Heh heh, not having to polish something big as the MPV makes good wash techniques well worth the extra effort ;)
 
I don't believe that circular waxing is considered "old style". It seems like many people (myself included) still use the circular waxing method. The advantages of circular waxing is that it will provide even coverage and will make it easier to spread the wax. As long as the surface is well washed, using circular motions will not produce any swirling.



I'm also curious why circular swirling could be caused by straight strokes when using a washing mitt. Maybe the circular swirls are just more visible when the sun shines on it?
 
Swirl, marring, micro marring, spider webs....where's the darn play book.



I remember years ago a young fellow that worked for me often told me 'I get more dirt off when I wax than when I wash the car'. Now I'll be he had SWIRLS !



I guess I was saying 'old school' because a couple of (polymer) products I have say to apply a thin, even layer either over the entire vehicle (or a section at a time), let dry to a haze and wipe off.

But nowhere does it recommend to apply using a circular motion. That's the way dad and dad's dad did it and perhaps very specific to carnubas?

I would agree that if the surface is clean, circular motion - left/right - up/down - sideways - back 'n forth - whatever ... doesn't matter.
 
I would agree that if the surface is clean, circular motion - left/right - up/down - sideways - back 'n forth - whatever ... doesn't matter.



I mean doesn't make swirls.
 
I've been using a foam gun all summer and have been very very impressed. I get far less marring than I did last year with a bucket. I wash two black cars and a graphite gray truck.



Personally I think it helps to really foam up the surface and start to break the dirt down. With a traditional bucket wash I was just hosing the car down to get it wet, then thowing on some suds with the mitt.

With the foam gun I suds it up really good, then go over it with a soapy mitt. The combination has really helped. All three vehicles are "marr-free" so far! :D
 
Yeah I think the superb lubricity of today's washes mainly comes from the bubbles which are supposed to attract and encapsulate dirt from the car. At least that's the marketing BS...
 
We all have different techniques.

I have managed to keep my dark blue metallic paint almost swirl free and marring free for a year



Although most will say my method is insane, this is the way I like to do it

High pressure wheel arches and wheels but not the body.



Medium pressure rinse the body from side on (water slides across the paint, not at it) with 10 pattern sprayer nozzle

Sometimes I use a foam gun, today I did not.

Four buckets ( 2 x water, 2 x JW and prima mystique wash mix)

Five x microfibre mitts (sonus & eurow)

Purified water is added to shampoo buckets and a little optimum no rinse as well



slow straight line wipe (from left to the right, not back and forth) from top to bottom with no pressure and heaps of shampoo.

Both sides of mitts are used on each panel.

I wash half a panel, blast the crap out of mitt with spray nozzle then dunk in water bucket and clean it

Using 1 mitt per every 2 panels.



Dry with four pakshak WW towels, folded to clean section after each panel

Towel is folded twice, panel sprayed with acrylic glos or prima slick and towel is slowly glided from left to right and then I turn towel over and continue from top to bottom



It takes two hours to wash & dry but I don't care and actually enjoy the 99.9% marring free process

Paint is just as slick as it was when I polished and sealed paint back in january.



It is probably mad but it works for me and people marvel at the glowing paint that can be in total sunlight or sodium vapour lights and only show the imperfections that are in the paint from factory and previous owner mistakes that only a repaint can fix.
 
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