Detailing consultant...

I

imported_Ivan Rajic

New member
Recently, I was asked by a very small local dealer to do some consulting and training on site with intentions that the owner will soon stop spending $300-400 on me to detail every nicer car he gets and his employees, who currently maintain the cars by washing and waxing now and then, will learn enough skill to still fairly quickly but with more quality detail the inventory.



(ok.. pause after a looong and probably horribly written sentence)



I have pretty much accepted the job on a note that we should get together soon and talk about it.



I'm here asking if any of the more experienced quality detailers on here have some consulting experience and can share tips, advice, etc. on how exactly to charge for such a service. I obviously have ideas (one is to charge not hourly but a flat rate for each service... so washing would be $500 for a week, polishing much more, etc... just throwing random numbers out there, didn't' really sit and think too much about it).



Any and all constructive advice is greatly appreciated.



Thanks,



Ivan
 
What if you asked for a sum up front and a small percentage of each sale for x amount of cars sold or x amount of time ?
 
I would charge X$ per stage. By "per stage" I mean washing, claying is one, leather and interior another, polishing and waxing, etc. And you can even break those down into beginner and advanced trainings. Don't charge by the hour, charge by the service and give the dealer a detailed list of what you will be teaching in each course. This way there's not qualms later!
 
D Tailor said:
What if you asked for a sum up front and a small percentage of each sale for x amount of cars sold or x amount of time ?
Click to expand...



I don't think a commission here will fly, nor do I think it would be fair as he wants to exact opposite, to save money. He loves my work and after the training is complete he wishes to continue working with me on some of the higher end cars (stuff like newer BMW 7s and Ms, newer Porsches, etc. nothing too fancy) but he does want to have employees who are trained to detail a car in 3-4 hours and do good work rather than paying me 4-5x as much per hour to detail it in 5-6hrs. This would cover stuff like your average 02-05 Civics, etc., mainly $15-30ish thousand value range.



Apollo_Auto said:
I would charge X$ per stage. By "per stage" I mean washing, claying is one, leather and interior another, polishing and waxing, etc. And you can even break those down into beginner and advanced trainings. Don't charge by the hour, charge by the service and give the dealer a detailed list of what you will be teaching in each course. This way there's not qualms later!
Click to expand...



That is exactly what I was thinking because each step can definitely get more and more involved. Any idea on actual $$ value? I was thinking to construct some packages, then roughly estimate the time necessary to teach, answer questions, etc., then use 100-150% of my hourly rate for detailing to put together different packages... You can PM me if you want as I know $$ values like to stay private.



Thanks to both suggestions.
 
wait, so you wont be detailing his cars anymore???? how much business did you get from him last year? I would charge that amount as he will see a return in less than a year since his guys will be knocking cars out faster and saving him more money!



I read that as you are getting the boot, NO? Like someone saying teach me to do your job so I dont have to pay as much
 
I personally wouldn't accept the job as a consultant. Dignity, man. Dignity.



Here's my tips, if you must accept the job as a one-time contract consultant, teach the staff the very standard procedures. Don't teach the staff the special tricks or secret techniques of the trade. These staff are supposed to learn these techniques themselves, either acquired through experience or by reading on internet sites. Simply teach them what they need to know to adequately do their jobs. Don't teach them methods on how to save money or time. As paid personnels, these staff are suppose to acquire these skills themselves.



I am not telling you to teach the guys the incorrect methods of car detailing, but you've gotta think for yourself. In the future, if the local dealer finds that his staff are not doing the jobs up to his standard, you may have your chance to work at the dealer again.
 
If you get a lot of business from him, then I think you should be charging a pretty big amount of money to teach his workers. You can explain to him that it is costing a lot because they are being trained properly. I've looked at some of your work and I must say it is incredible. He will understand that to learn from the best it wont be cheap. It may look like alot to him but in the long run he will eventually save money. I think you should charge whatever you feel like your time is worth. Nobody can say that your training isn't worth it, you do wonderful work. You can try to get more money by saying that your pricing will be for each individual person you are working with. If he has 5 staff members that he wants trained, then you will be making 5 times as much. I know those Detail King training classes can run as much as $1,500 per person. I really don't know what you are looking to make off this, so you could charge something close to that per person, or more since your training will be more hands on and they will probably learn more of the correct technique...Also put into consideration that if you get these staff members doing really good details, this dealership may open a detailing section. They may say the staff has been trained by you, taking some of your potential customers that think they will be getting the same quality work you provide, just at a low dealer price..Just some food for thought.
 
toyotaguy said:
wait, so you wont be detailing his cars anymore???? how much business did you get from him last year? I would charge that amount as he will see a return in less than a year since his guys will be knocking cars out faster and saving him more money!



I read that as you are getting the boot, NO? Like someone saying teach me to do your job so I dont have to pay as much
Click to expand...

Yeah but to be realistic, this doesn't make sense. No one is going to pay what is probably tens of thousands up font right away just for some consulting. Realize that the dealer gets his detailing expense (or part of it) back when they sell the vehicle, so say $500 goes out to have the vehicle detailed, dealer sells it and gets $300 back, pays out another $450 for another vehicle, gets $400 back when it sells, and so the cycle goes. Saying "hey I want $20K up front right away" isn't exactly practical from a business perspective. Also note that the OP said he will still be working for the dealer, just not on ALL the vehicles.



Also, as a business-thinking person, I'd have to agree with the dealer. If he's got a bunch of guys sitting around doing not much, why pay some outside "contractor" to do the detailing work ? If he's got excess capacity, it only makes business sense that he fill it up.



Put it this way. You own a detail shop. You employ, say, 5 people. Say on average, you have 3 guys doing **** all for about 6 hours a week, but you have them at the shop. Now, your shop offers decaling service, but it's outsourced to a 3rd party. In trying to determine how to fill that 6 hour void for your 3 guys, it occurs to you that if they could do decaling, you'd have filled the void, and dropped a 3rd party "contractor" that was probably costing you a pretty penny, more than what you pay your employees.



How is that any different ? Just because you're on the short end of the stick this time ? The OP seems like he runs a decent business, so I'm sure he'll fill his vacancies.

the_invisible said:
I personally wouldn't accept the job as a consultant. Dignity, man. Dignity.



Here's my tips, if you must accept the job as a one-time contract consultant, teach the staff the very standard procedures. Don't teach the staff the special tricks or secret techniques of the trade. These staff are supposed to learn these techniques themselves, either acquired through experience or by reading on internet sites. Simply teach them what they need to know to adequately do their jobs. Don't teach them methods on how to save money or time. As paid personnels, these staff are suppose to acquire these skills themselves.



I am not telling you to teach the guys the incorrect methods of car detailing, but you've gotta think for yourself. In the future, if the local dealer finds that his staff are not doing the jobs up to his standard, you may have your chance to work at the dealer again.
Click to expand...

Dignity ? So it's better to just walk away from that client altogether from one second to the next ?



I do agree 100% with you though, teach the staff the basics so they can adequately detail, don't go crazy teaching them everything you know.



Again, the OP has stated that he will still be working for the dealer, just not on ALL the vehicles.
 
the picture I'm getting is the dealer wants to cut costs (understandable) and wants to get the people he pays 9 dollars an hour, to be able to do work that he can charge 50/hour for.



The dealer wants the same quality but doesnt want to pay for it. If you are the kind of detailer whos full time and has his schedule book is packed for months ahead of time then it wouldn't be that big of a deal to "consult" for this guy.



If you are the kind who's earning money but always gotta keep on your toes for clients this all this is going to do is take money out of your pocket in the long run. Sure you might still get to do "big" jobs for the dealer, but I'm assuming you wouldn't be able to charge more to make up for the other missed jobs.



I would tell them I would love to continue working for them - but business is business and I will not be able to give away my trade secrets. Do you think you could pay a doctor a one time fee to come to your house and teach you how to fix broken bones, write prescriptions, and perform minor surgeries? Would a mechanic who's fixing your brake system for some extra money show you how to fix it yourself so you "never have to see him again" for the brakes?



If the person running the dealership who you speak with is a TRUE business man he or she would understand and not take any offense at you declining the one time job.
 
As already stated, this is a tough decision. First off if you go for it, draw up a contract that you expect X amount of dollars for top end details for a year or two. Secondly never teach top end detailing without the proper compensation.



If they want you to make their shop more efficient, than you could charge a consultant fee on top of the actual time you spend in their shop.



I will share my story. I worked at a small (30-40 car) used dealership for 8 years (over 20 years experience total) so my knowledge and skills were already set before i started. They paid the time and money to bring most, back to best condition, which made them known for top end cars. More and easier sales followed for them.



So I quit three years ago, on not the best of terms. They tried to find a replacement for quality and knowledge. Well one year later they phoned about a detail and now they make up 75% of my business again, which now costs them more.



Bottom line is always the dollar, if you can make them money and some for yourself then go for it.
 
toxin440 said:
the picture I'm getting is the dealer wants to cut costs (understandable) and wants to get the people he pays 9 dollars an hour, to be able to do work that he can charge 50/hour for.
Click to expand...

Who says the dealer is charging $50 an hour to their own customer ? Sure you can mark up the price of a used vehicle to recoup some of the "restoration" costs, but the used car market is pretty aggressive.

toxin440 said:
The dealer wants the same quality but doesnt want to pay for it. If you are the kind of detailer whos full time and has his schedule book is packed for months ahead of time then it wouldn't be that big of a deal to "consult" for this guy.
Click to expand...

The dealer is trying to fill capacity that he obviously has. Doesn't mean he isn't willing to pay for quality work... otherwise the OP wouldn't ever have worked for him to begin with...

toxin440 said:
If you are the kind who's earning money but always gotta keep on your toes for clients this all this is going to do is take money out of your pocket in the long run. Sure you might still get to do "big" jobs for the dealer, but I'm assuming you wouldn't be able to charge more to make up for the other missed jobs.
Click to expand...

How is it that "all this does is take money out of your pocket" ? Obviously the dealer is going to bring some of the detailing in-house, regardless if the OP helps him or tells him to **** off. All he has to do is go to another detail shop and contract them to do some learning sessions, done. Or, if it were me, I'd make a deal with a detail shop where a few of my guys would go there for a week or two and learn, but also work for that detail shop for free (so learning in exchange for free labour).

toxin440 said:
I would tell them I would love to continue working for them - but business is business and I will not be able to give away my trade secrets. Do you think you could pay a doctor a one time fee to come to your house and teach you how to fix broken bones, write prescriptions, and perform minor surgeries? Would a mechanic who's fixing your brake system for some extra money show you how to fix it yourself so you "never have to see him again" for the brakes?
Click to expand...

You can take first aid classes and eliminate half of the reasons the average person goes to an ER for. If I remember correctly, first aid classes cost a few hundred dollars and only take a few days to complete. Most drive-thru oil change places will let you into the pit if you ask, and you can watch how an oil change is done. You have to remember, our industry does not exist because we hold secrets that no one else knows. Ever change a faucet on a kitchen sink ? It's supremely easy to do, yet there is a large group of people that will still call a plumber and pay $x.x / hour to have it done for them. The reasons differ, from too lazy to not enough free time to do it themselves, to "I just want a professional to do it". The same is true in our industry, people use us because we're the professionals and it's what we do for a living and it's what we're skilled and experienced in, not because we have some secrets of the trade that we refuse to share. Not to mention, there are some people who just aren't any good at detailing, even if they know how to do it. It's just like some people suck at baseball, although they understand the technicals of the game perfectly.

toxin440 said:
If the person running the dealership who you speak with is a TRUE business man he or she would understand and not take any offense at you declining the one time job.
Click to expand...

I'd agree, yep. However, I think the person running the dealership has made a good move by asking the OP to consult for them, instead of going elsewhere where it may be cheaper. I don't think the dealership is really trying to "screw" the OP.
 
If you are able to save the dealership time and money, your services as a consultant could be very valuable. Dealerships spend a lot of money on maintaining the cars on the lot, reconditioning used cars, and retail detailing (if they offer it). If you come in and re-design their whole process, so that it saves them a lot of money, it would make sense for them to pay you well. This all assumes you have the capabilities to pull something like that off.
 
Something else I might add, and I know this will come off as sounding rude, but I honestly don't mean it to, because I think the OP will do just fine.



If losing this dealership means the OP can't make a decent profit running his detailing business anymore, then perhaps he should get out of the detailing business ? Hell, in our current economy, the dealership could go bankrupt and close next week, who knows. Dynamics change all the time in any business, and one has to be able to adapt in order to survive. If one is unable to do that, then one shouldn't be taking such a risk being in business.



Again, I don't mean this to sound rude or insinuate that the OP can't run his business, I mean this as an overall "food for thought" for all of us.
 
If I were in your position, this is what I'd do.



Don't train anyone. Let the manager know that you completely understand his position and wanting to save money, but you don't sell your knowledge and experience to these guys. They will become your competition.



I'd tell the GM that if he ever needs me for a detail I will be happy to take care of him.



He WILL call back because no other great detailer will sell their knowledge/experience and he won't find anyone to do your caliber of work for less than what you charge. He WILL get tired of rehashes and screw ups. Once a GM gets a taste of a great detailer they have a really hard time going back to shoddy work.



It's like growing up eating filet mignon then being told all you get is hot dogs now.
 
toyotaguy said:
wait, so you wont be detailing his cars anymore???? how much business did you get from him last year? I would charge that amount as he will see a return in less than a year since his guys will be knocking cars out faster and saving him more money!



I read that as you are getting the boot, NO? Like someone saying teach me to do your job so I dont have to pay as much
Click to expand...





All true, and then some.



Ask him to show you how to open a dealership next door to his!





I see it two ways, both suck:



1. He is trying to break you down and make you give up and go to work for him F/T for less than he pays out now.



2. He is silly enough to think that the clean-up boys in his store deserve training and will benefit him long term from it. (why wouldn't they learn the skills, leave their job, and do what you train them to do...)



Give him my number if he needs a reality check. That is just ridiculous. This is a new car franchise???





If you do want to consult, go for a day rate. Pick a number in the 2,000-3,000 per day range. Concentrate the delivery of skills into a five day boot camp. Make the workers tell the owner that you are a lunatic and taught them so much.

When they quit two weeks later, not only will you have your business back, you'll have the $15k consulting fees.



Dont miss the boat.
 
jdoria said:
1. He is trying to break you down and make you give up and go to work for him F/T for less than he pays out now.



2. He is silly enough to think that the clean-up boys in his store deserve training and will benefit him long term from it. (why wouldn't they learn the skills, leave their job, and do what you train them to do...)



Give him my number if he needs a reality check. That is just ridiculous. This is a new car franchise???
Click to expand...

1. Ummmm, the dealer has said that the OP will still work on vehicles... just not ALL of them. Why is it that everyone is missing this point ?



2. Since when is basic detailing above what "clean-up boys" should learn ? And why would the dealer be silly to believe that his lot boys deserve some training to fill their down time ? Would YOU pay guys to sit around doing nothing in YOUR shop ?



I find it interesting that so many folks here take such offense to this. Maybe I'm more business-minded, or I understand business more than others, but this is a simple situation that makes complete sense, and the OP shouldn't be taking personal offense to it.
 
Hey Ivan. Old thread I know, sorry. :D



One thing I wanted to add to this is that the owner may find himself out a few good employees once they learn how to detail correctly and realize the can make more money on their own. Just something you may want to let him know as it's rare to see long term employees at a detail shop. ;)



Rasky
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top