Clarification regarding Trade Secret and Pinnacle Souveran

MattZ28

MattZ28

New member
Many people think that Top of the Line's Trade Secret wax is the same as Pinnacle Souveran.



They are NOT the same.



After speaking with Max and Jason from Autogeek, I will tell you that they are in no way the same - the color is different, the scent is different, the whole formula is different. Pinnacle does not manufacture wax for Top of the Line.



Yes, they use the same jars. Top of the Line gets their jars from the same manufacturer as Pinnacle. This is the ONLY thing these waxes have in common.



Some confusion may also lie in the fact that the cost of Trade Secret has risen to nearly $40, putting it in the league of "higher end" waxes.



Yes, Trade Secret is decent, but it's no Souveran.
 
There's a lot of products that use the same containers; clearkote and poorboys seem to use the same bottles, and sonus, blackfire, wolfgang, and pinnacle all seem to get theirs from the same place too. I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting, but those are the ones the immediately come to mind.



I wonder why people have never said anything of those lines being made by the same manufacturer, but they do of TS and souveran?



Thanks for looking into it, matt.
 
Containers don't matter, I agree.



However, neither does scent or color IMO. I know there are products I have used before that are different scents, colors, and even consistencys but have performed the same, time after time. Coincidence, maybe.





I'm not gonna compare TS and Souveran because I have never used Souveran. I just know that TS gives me excellent results.
 
This is not meant disrespectfully, but you Florida folk tend to ride in Autogeek's pocket way too much.
 
ZaneO said:
This is not meant disrespectfully, but you Florida folk tend to ride in Autogeek's pocket way too much.
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As you might say "it's a matter of personal preference". Yeah, you tend to push Zaino alot. Am I complaining? No, because I don't give a crap what products you use.



Autogeek has been good to me since I first knew about them, and I'm sure everyone else who has done business with them can say the same.



Max is a very cool, friendly guy, and lives a few blocks away from me. Since no one else on here has the privelege to contact him personally, I can take the opportunity to ask him whatever I want. Is there a problem with that, officer?



If you don't want to read my posts, then don't. Just trying to clarify a huge misunderstanding that seems to be pretty common on these boards.
 
Don't get all huffy. I said it wasn't meant disrepectfully to anyone, including you.



I do like Zaino...I also like many other products that I have purchased from Autogeek (ie. Poorboy's, Meguiar's, Lake Country, etc.) Autogeek is a great vendor, but that doesn't mean that I am going to pimp them out and take every word as gospel.



Let's all act like grown-ups here :)
 
I know you said it wasn't meant to be disrespectful, but do you really expect me to come back with something nice to say after you more or less call me a nutswinger?
 
This may be off the topic, but I have noticed a VERY close similarity to the color and smell of Pinnacle Signature and 3M Show Car Wax.
 
MattZ28 said:
after you more or less call me a nutswinger?
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Those are your words, not mine. I don't have any beef with you; it's just constructive criticism. It just means that some people, such as yourself, have migrated their product discussion largely to Autogeek's products and whatever else Autogeek has to say.



Have a great day, man :)
 
GSRstilez said:
Containers don't matter, I agree.



However, neither does scent or color IMO. I know there are products I have used before that are different scents, colors, and even consistencys but have performed the same, time after time. Coincidence, maybe.





I'm not gonna compare TS and Souveran because I have never used Souveran. I just know that TS gives me excellent results.
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Sean, the consistency of the waxes are also different. I don't know what more I need to say to prove they're not the same :nixweiss
 
Well, they arent EXACTLY the same. There are some differences. Its been "rumored" that ever since Terry @ CMA set the ball rolling on Souveran, he has released some very slightly different versions of Souveran, that are marketed under different names, by other companies. The Paste Glaz label was the first "different version", and was intended to compete with a Zymol product in its price range. Others versions that are "rumored" to be slightly altered in color and scent, also range in solvent content, changing the gloss and jetting slightly. Those "rumored" to be on that variance list include Souveran, Paste Glaz, Trade Secret, Pizaaz, P21S and S100. TS and P were labels made specially for Irene at TOL. Its also "rumored that Irene actually came up with the name "Souveran". P21S and S100 was labeled for some american guys in CT that marketed the line as "german" products.

Some think that the Signature Series label was merely a market approach to discontinue the Paste Glaz label. The lowest price/volume wax in their line.

If these "rumors" are not true, the products all show much more similarity in every way, than they do any differences. Perhaps it is all just a freak coincidence. This all only "rumors", of course.....



I have all but one of the above waxes. Some do differ very slightly in gloss and depth, even though all apply and react identically. I see no difference between Trade Secret and Souvaran at all. These are the most identical of all the different labels. These two look absolutely identical in every way. If theyre not from the very same vat, then someone must have discovered the secret formula for Souveran in the same drawer with all the Soup Nazi's secret recipes.



BTW, I believe the name Max is only ficticious. Bob Mckee is his real name. Bob is the owner of Autogeek. I think he was Terry's partner before all of the distributorship legal battles.



Much more on this subjects legal battles can be found through a search, both here and on Google.
 
I have used the "top of the line wax" and I see more depth of shine with Souveran. I would compare TOL's wax closer to P21s. If anything wax is closer to Souveran it has to be the Pinnacle Signature Series!!!!!!!!!!!
 
NozeBleedSpeed said:
Well, they arent EXACTLY the same. There are some differences. Its been "rumored" that ever since Terry @ CMA set the ball rolling on Souveran, he has released some very slightly different versions of Souveran, that are marketed under different names, by other companies. The Paste Glaz label was the first "different version", and was intended to compete with a Zymol product in its price range. Others versions that are "rumored" to be slightly altered in color and scent, also range in solvent content, changing the gloss and jetting slightly. Those "rumored" to be on that variance list include Souveran, Paste Glaz, Trade Secret, Pizaaz, P21S and S100. TS and P were labels made specially for Irene at TOL. Its also "rumored that Irene actually came up with the name "Souveran". P21S and S100 was labeled for some american guys in CT that marketed the line as "german" products.

Some think that the Signature Series label was merely a market approach to discontinue the Paste Glaz label. The lowest price/volume wax in their line.

If these "rumors" are not true, the products all show much more similarity in every way, than they do any differences. Perhaps it is all just a freak coincidence. This all only "rumors", of course.....



I have all but one of the above waxes. Some do differ very slightly in gloss and depth, even though all apply and react identically. I see no difference between Trade Secret and Souvaran at all. These are the most identical of all the different labels. These two look absolutely identical in every way. If theyre not from the very same vat, then someone must have discovered the secret formula for Souveran in the same drawer with all the Soup Nazi's secret recipes.



BTW, I believe the name Max is only ficticious. Bob Mckee is his real name. Bob is the owner of Autogeek. He was Terry's partner before all of the distributorship legal battles.



Much more on this subjects legal battles can be found through a search, both here and on Google.
Click to expand...



Well put. :)
 
travisdecpn said:
David has kindly asked you to stop, please listen.
Click to expand...



If you are referring to me, I am trying to be very diplomatic and polite. There is no malicious intent with what I am saying.



Have a great day :)
 
I called Autogeek and talked to Jason, he says Bob from Autogeek and Terry from Classic Motoring have been frends for over 20 years. They both do their own thing, but they have been and are still partners with the Pinnacle line. Hope that clears things up.
 
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