Body Shops Without Baking Booths

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III

97 bonneville/98 Z71
I've been looking for another body shop in my area the last couple of weeks. I just haven't been satisfied with the ones I've been to over the years. No surprize hey? I found one place that I like, but they don't have a baking booth. The guy said it just takes longer for the paint to dry, and that he uses something special in the clear coat or paint to help the process.



My question is this: Should baking booths be a factor in looking for a good quality shop? I guess I'm drawn to this place because it's a small operation. It's not like the dealers, or other shops where they want to repair as many vehicles as they can, and send you on your way.
 
Depends on where the vehicle is left to dry. If it is shot in a booth and left in there, I really don't see an issue. I've been to body shops where they shoot the car then pull it right outside.....you want to talk about clear coat contamination! The bake booth assists in lowering dry/cure time. My best advice would be to watch them shoot a car and see what happens after that. Also check some of the vehicles that they have done. I'm sure there are a few that are near complete still around the shop.



Walter

Co-owner
 
Wetwerks said:
Depends on where the vehicle is left to dry. If it is shot in a booth and left in there, I really don't see an issue. I've been to body shops where they shoot the car then pull it right outside.....you want to talk about clear coat contamination! The bake booth assists in lowering dry/cure time. My best advice would be to watch them shoot a car and see what happens after that. Also check some of the vehicles that they have done. I'm sure there are a few that are near complete still around the shop.



Walter

Co-owner
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Some good advice. It seems most places don't use a baking booth.



Hey, where about in WI do you live. I know of two good places in Green Bay. I've never had any work done but I hear good things. My friend had their Escalade done at one and it looked great.
 
Not all places use a bake booth. The car will be painted, left to dry for a day and then wetsanded and rubbed out. You will be fine. Just let the paint cure for a few months and don't listen to the painter if he tells you to wax it in a week.
 
Danase said:
Just let the paint cure for a few months and don't listen to the painter if he tells you to wax it in a week.
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Wish I would have known that about a year ago. Got my tailgated repainted and waxed it about an hour after I got home. Didn't seem to do any harm. Oh well, live and learn.
 
Danase said:
Not all places use a bake booth. The car will be painted, left to dry for a day and then wetsanded and rubbed out.
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Interesting point Bob. I just assumed that all shops have baking booths, and going to a shop with a baking booth would be better.



BlueZero, I live in Racine. Just south of Milwaukee.
 
The shop I picked to work on my car this time does not have a heat booth. It's a low-volume shop that mostly does custom work, very little in the way of insurance work. I respect the talent of the guy enough that I'm glad to have him work on my car even if he can't justify the cost of a heat booth. Sure, it "kick-starts" the curing process, but it still takes months for the car to finish curing anyway.



Does anyone have a clue how much of a head start a heat booth actually gives for curing?
 
velobard said:
The shop I picked to work on my car this time does not have a heat booth. It's a low-volume shop that mostly does custom work, very little in the way of insurance work. I respect the talent of the guy enough that I'm glad to have him work on my car even if he can't justify the cost of a heat booth...
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Same here.



IIRC when MirrorFinishMan queried the paint makers about cure times, none of them mentioned baking factoring in.
 
Accumulator said:
Same here.



IIRC when MirrorFinishMan queried the paint makers about cure times, none of them mentioned baking factoring in.
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I recently PM'd MFM with a question about that. He said heat booths were a variable that wasn't brought up in his dialog with the paint companies.
 
I owned 2 downdraft booths in my shop that also baked finishes. I couldn't imagine painting a car without baking them. The risk is just not worth it.



Those accelerator additives that make the clear cure faster are not anything that I would have used in my shop. I had two paint systems, Sikkens and Glasurit and baked everything except when we edged a fender or the underside of a hood or trunk.
 
velobard said:
... Sure, it "kick-starts" the curing process, but it still takes months for the car to finish curing anyway.



Does anyone have a clue how much of a head start a heat booth actually gives for curing?
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It varies from paint system to paint system but it’s typically in minutes or hours per coat and maybe a half day or one day for a whole paint job. (It seems most people, many painters included, somehow believe it speeds things up by weeks or months. It doesn't.)



The point of re-spray baking is to get it out the door faster, increasing throughput and profits.



Quality comes from the painter’s skill and attention to detail, whether baked or air dried.





PC.
 
the other pc said:
The point of re-spray baking is to get it out the door faster, increasing throughput and profits.
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Bingo. That is exactly what this guy told me about him not having a baking system.
 
the other pc said:
It varies from paint system to paint system but it’s typically in minutes or hours per coat and maybe a half day or one day for a whole paint job. (It seems most people, many painters included, somehow believe it speeds things up by weeks or months. It doesn't.)



The point of re-spray baking is to get it out the door faster, increasing throughput and profits.



Quality comes from the painter’s skill and attention to detail, whether baked or air dried.





PC.
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This sounds in line with what what I would've guessed. The shop my car is at uses Sikkens and is a one-man operation. I'm not sure exactly how long he leaves cars in the booth once he's done painting, but I've been to his shop before and know he doesn't rush cars back outside right away. I'll probably ask him about it tomorrow.
 
A baking booth is no longer required today with high solids low solvent paints, however a clean room spray booth is still required when spraying. Today's paint dry in less than 2 minutes. They paint in the morning and you take delivery in the afternoon.
 
EdLancer said:
A baking booth is no longer required today with high solids low solvent paints, however a clean room spray booth is still required when spraying. Today's paint dry in less than 2 minutes. They paint in the morning and you take delivery in the afternoon.
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Then why do they still bake paint at the factory? If they could eliminate that step, you can bet they would love to save the money.
 
velobard said:
Then why do they still bake paint at the factory? If they could eliminate that step, you can bet they would love to save the money.
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Being dry enough to drive off and being fully cured are two different things.



The baking in a body shop will only help the paint dry a little faster and get the curing process started. The much higher heat used at the factory will dry and cure the paint because it is done w/o any trim, interior, rubber, etc. on the car.



To the OP: I wouldn't let the lack of a baking booth stop me from selecting a skilled painter. Those booths in a body shop don't get all that hot anyway, or else your rubber and plastic would melt.
 
Eliot Ness said:
Being dry enough to drive off and being fully cured are two different things.



The baking in a body shop will only help the paint dry a little faster and get the curing process started. The much higher heat used at the factory will dry and cure the paint because it is done w/o any trim, interior, rubber, etc. on the car.



To the OP: I wouldn't let the lack of a baking booth stop me from selecting a skilled painter. Those booths in a body shop don't get all that hot anyway, or else your rubber and plastic would melt.
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I understand the difference between drying and curing, my point was just that heat still can serve a legitimate role.



Does anyone actually know how hot they bake the paint at the factory? I've read plenty of times that they use much higher heat, but I've also heard that it really isn't that much more than a body shop would use, that the paint formulation and other factors actually have more to do with how quickly it cures. Obviously painting at a factory provides infinitely more controlled circumstances than a body shop.



The temps a body shop uses aren't all that much more than leaving a car in the summer sun in Phoenix. I know, I used to live there, never again. ;)
 
velobard said:
.......Does anyone actually know how hot they bake the paint at the factory? I've read plenty of times that they use much higher heat, but I've also heard that it really isn't that much more than a body shop would use, that the paint formulation and other factors actually have more to do with how quickly it cures........
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According to the following article it is 265-285 degrees Fahrenheit or 140-165 degrees depending on the type of paint:



OEM Auto Paint Finishes



I'm not sure how old or accurate that article is, but I found parts of it interesting.
 
Eliot Ness said:
According to the following article it is 265-285 degrees Fahrenheit or 140-165 degrees depending on the type of paint:



OEM Auto Paint Finishes



I'm not sure how old or accurate that article is, but I found parts of it interesting.
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Yep, High Bake (over 180) and Low Bake (under 180). One can't really compare the paint process at the factories to the one's used afterwards (bodyshop's and such) as they are different and as such use paint made with a different composition.



Painting after the factory is referred to as "re"-finishing and the paint/clear is formulated for that. That drying process could be air, bake, or infared (short-medium length waves).



Were as factory paint will almost always be baked on at very high temps. Temps that would cause probelms for re-finishing paint.



All paints/clears have a specification for "time out of dust" on their sheets. This is the period of time for which the fresh product must remain in a clean environment to avoid contaimination during drying. They also have a spec for "time to touch".



In the end a lot will depend on the paint used. Some paints/clears need to be baked on, some can be cured with infared or left to air dry. Most of the high end stuff needs to be baked on though. As they are trying to get as close to a factory job as possible which is probaly the best (application wise) your every going to get.



MorBiD
 
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