Audi S4 - Mold Removal

SeaJays

SeaJays

New member
This client came to me as a referral from a newer client of mine.



He believes one of the sunroof drains is clogged and leaking into the rear passenger floor pan. When I arrived there was about 2 inches of water sitting in that area.



I also informed the owner that I could not guarantee that all mold would be removed or that I could get the smell to go completely away. A full interior tear out is going to be needed. He is going to tackle this himself and may call me back in to clean all the parts when he has them out of the car.





Equipment Used:



Vapor Clean Gaia - Steamer

Terry cloth towels - Were all thrown away after

Various MF's

Various brushes

Air-Zone Ozone Generator

Rigid Wet/Dry vac



Products Used:



Folex

OPC - Diluted 3:1

303 Aerospace

Stoners Invisible Glass

Lexol Leather Conditioner



So after sitting in 2 hours of traffic to get to this clients home. I inspected the vehicle to find the mold issue was far worse than I was lead to believe. I informed the client that I would be charging more than initially quoted over the phone.



Onto the photos!



This was the puddle I mentioned.



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Sunroof was covered in water drops from the moisture build up



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And the Afters...



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Overall the interior cleaned up very nice. The musty smell was still there even after running my ozone generator for an hour with the heat running. However it was much better than when I initially arrived.



Thanks for looking! Now I'm going to go take another shower after looking at those photos again!
 
Nothing beats steam to neutralize mould spores. DrivePur or AQuartz Clean Air will eliminate the musty odour
 
Very nice job, (lol i'm starting to itch afther those pics)



One thing baffles me, the owner didn't think to do something about it before it got that bad ????????? how could you drive around like that
 
Looks great.



I would have had him tear out everything ahead of time and worked on it out of the car. I'm sure there are areas you weren't able to get to in order to clean. Guaranteed moisture still remained under the carpet and in the seat cushions as well.



Did you run the ozone right after finishing? WARNING!!! H2O (Water) and O3 (Ozone) react to create O2 (Oxygen) and H2O2 (Peroxide) and can bleach materials it comes in contact with. (Don't ask me how I know that.:frusty::cry:) With that said, I think several hours may be necessary with the ozone generator to effectively eliminate the mold.:painkiller:



You were clearly under a time constraint, given the 2 hour commute. From a visual standpoint, you did an excellent job.:thumb:
 
Nth Degree said:
Looks great.



I would have had him tear out everything ahead of time and worked on it out of the car. I'm sure there are areas you weren't able to get to in order to clean. Guaranteed moisture still remained under the carpet and in the seat cushions as well.



Did you run the ozone right after finishing? WARNING!!! H2O (Water) and O3 (Ozone) react to create O2 (Oxygen) and H2O2 (Peroxide) and can bleach materials it comes in contact with. (Don't ask me how I know that.:frusty::cry:) With that said, I think several hours may be necessary with the ozone generator to effectively eliminate the mold.:painkiller:



You were clearly under a time constraint, given the 2 hour commute. From a visual standpoint, you did an excellent job.:thumb:
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Ozone actually reacts using a free-radical mechanism and produces OH- and eventually is consumed with like radials and the radical byproducts. Peroxide is not a side-product of a reaction with ozone and water. The reason O3 is so effect as a cleaning agent in car detailing is its ability to 'cleave' bonds between molecules.
 
Wow! while your camera has captured some amazing pictures it has not captured the real picture of what is taking place inside this vehicle. My comments are not intended to criticize or to be unkind but to offer some constructive insight into this kind of remediation.



Our first concern as professionals should be the health, safety and well being of the occupants of the vehicle. We should know our limitatons and know if we are unable to eliminate the problem then send this customer to qualified, experienced professional who will. This is not a failure on your part but a recognition that this is beyond your expertise it is a win-win situation as the customer gets the best service availble and you avoid exposure to possible litigation should the customer become ill.



This vehicle should have been completely dis-mantled the underside, of the headliner, seat covers, carpet, floor pan, sponges, underpadding are mold ridden and some of the components should be replaced with new. There is still water in the floor pan and the underpadding is is possibly water laden and very moldy. The ventilation system is also moldy.

Experience would have told you that Audi/VW’s have a history of significant water leaks from many places. (sun-roofs, windshield, heater box, door panels) and it is possible the electronic modules in the passenger floor pan area could have been exposed to moisture. Additionaly this client may be entitled to compensation from an Audi/VW class action law suit that has set aside monies to remediate this problem for owners.



I should say that no amount of steam or ozone machine could resolve this type of mold problem as the source of the problem “moisture” is still within the vehicle and it continues to the be food source to grow continous mold.
 
silvergray said:
Ozone actually reacts using a free-radical mechanism and produces OH- and eventually is consumed with like radials and the radical byproducts. Peroxide is not a side-product of a reaction with ozone and water. The reason O3 is so effect as a cleaning agent in car detailing is its ability to 'cleave' bonds between molecules.
Click to expand...



Have to offer an alternative view - Ozone is far more reactive than oxygen. Because the third oxygen atom is so loosely bonded, it takes far less persuasion to break away and bind with other substances so it has far greater oxidizing power.



The bleach Hydrogen Peroxide is formed when ozone dissolves in water. And this is what happens when it comes into contact with moisture in your eyes, nose and lungs. Ozone can also perish rubber and some plastics.



[EDIT: added 12/10 ] It’s been replaced with newer technology but ozone was used to sterilise water (i.e. bleach)
 
[This vehicle should have been completely dis-mantled the underside, of the headliner, seat covers, carpet, floor pan, sponges, underpadding are mold ridden and some of the components should be replaced with new. There is still water in the floor pan and the underpadding is is possibly water laden and very moldy. The ventilation system is also moldy.]



The OP stated [I also informed the owner that I could not guarantee that all mold would be removed or that I could get the smell to go completely away. A full interior tear out is going to be needed. He is going to tackle this himself and may call me back in to clean all the parts when he has them out of the car.]
 
TOGWT said:
[This vehicle should have been completely dis-mantled the underside, of the headliner, seat covers, carpet, floor pan, sponges, underpadding are mold ridden and some of the components should be replaced with new. There is still water in the floor pan and the underpadding is is possibly water laden and very moldy. The ventilation system is also moldy.]



The OP stated [I also informed the owner that I could not guarantee that all mold would be removed or that I could get the smell to go completely away. A full interior tear out is going to be needed. He is going to tackle this himself and may call me back in to clean all the parts when he has them out of the car.]
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Exactly. Sounds like the owner understood what he was and wasn't getting.
 
Shiny Lil Detlr said:
Exactly. Sounds like the owner understood what he was and wasn't getting.
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I am sure the owner understood what he wasn't getting...but that does not mean we are not the professionals here (very much like the relationship between Doctor and patient) we need to ensure the best interest of the client and more important our professional reputation. Over the long run that is what builds credibility and sets one apart from others.
 
Automania said:
I am sure the owner understood what he wasn't getting...but that does not mean we are not the professionals here (very much like the relationship between Doctor and patient) we need to ensure the best interest of the client and more important our professional reputation. Over the long run that is what builds credibility and sets one apart from others.
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I do understand what you are saying and agree with you to a point.



I did explain the health hazards of the issue and that all the mold was not going to be removed. I did suggest taking it to a place to have the inside torn out and properly cleaned but he insisted that he wanted to do the tear out. Just wanted me to get the rest of the vehicle as clean as I could so he wouldn't be covered in mold.



So, I took the job with a jump in my price for hazard work. I took all necessary precautions to protect myself as well. (Gloves, mask, eye wear). Either way it was not a job that I want to have to do again. For my own health it worried me.



This was my first time dealing with a real mold issue and did the best with what I had to work with. This was also explained to the owner that I was no means a professional at mold removal. I could clean and sanitize the areas I can see and reach but that was as far as I go.



I consider myself a professional and always ensure my customers are fully aware of any issues and explain their options, especially when it comes to their health. I am certainly not as experienced as a lot of detailers out there but I'm by no means an amateur.



I am by no means offended and appreciate the feed back!
 
SeaJay's said:
I took all necessary precautions to protect myself as well. (Gloves, mask, eye wear). Either way it was not a job that I want to have to do again. For my own health it worried me.
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Very glad to hear this. I think you did a good job of doing a basic cleanup, and if it is just a project car, hopefully he will rip the interior out anyway. I'd be more concerned if this was his daily driver or something and he was going to start exposing himself.
 
Automania said:
we need to ensure the best interest of the client and more important our professional reputation.
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Basically what you're saying is that the customer isn't always right, and we are not supposed to let them tell us what they want -- we are meant to tell them what they need. My experience has always been that's not how business works. We as professionals can certainly suggest to a customer what they should be having us do, but in situations such as this where the customer plans to tear the vehicle apart after a surface-layer cleanup is completed, I see absolutely no reason why this would reflect negatively on the detailer's "professional reputation."



Could he have turned away the job completely? Absolutely. I sure would have. But I don't begrudge him the work he did do given the full disclosure to the customer about realistic expectations. That fulfills his obligation as a credible professional in my eyes.
 
TOGWT said:
Have to offer an alternative view - Ozone is far more reactive than oxygen. Because the third oxygen atom is so loosely bonded, it takes far less persuasion to break away and bind with other substances so it has far greater oxidizing power.



The bleach Hydrogen Peroxide is formed when ozone dissolves in water. And this is what happens when it comes into contact with moisture in your eyes, nose and lungs. Ozone can also perish rubber and some plastics.
Click to expand...



I agree with the first part. Ozone is a resonance stabilized polar molecule and is willing to donate its negatively charged oxygen atom to electrophiles (hence it being an oxidizing agent). However, peroxide isn't a byproduct of radical reactions with ozone. This radical reaction in and of itself causes the damage and discoloration we sometimes see. Many organic and inorganic molecules are held together with 'double' and 'triple' bonds and ozone is able to break these bonds and therefore break the molecules apart for new reactions, filtration, etc.



I'll try to dig up some articles about homes catching fire after heavy ozone machine use. Chemists founds that ozone molecules cleaved the double bonds (alkenes) that most copper wire insulation is made of - leading to arcs (and fire!) inside the walls.
 
Op it seems like Audi's are prone to this, and I feel your pain on this job. I did this Allroad with mold http://www.autopia.org/forum/click-...ld-remova-restoration-signature-detailed.html



I also had the client refuse any removal of interior parts, which was very concerning to me. I am making it look nice, but am allowing him to then sell the car with a "pretty" interior, that underneath it all probably isn't so pretty.



So what as detailers should we do? Decline the job for someone else to take? Or take it fully knowing it probably will never be right again. This leaves us with a conundrum. Fix what we can with the potential for someone to buy the car after and let them deal witht he future issues, or simply refuse the job.



Awesome JOB BTW :D
 
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