A warning on "paint wrinkle"!!!

RaskyR1

RaskyR1

Rasky's Auto Detailing
This thread was created to warn others detailers, novice, experienced, and even the pros.



So I was working on a new Honda Element last Sunday, only very minor correction needed. The plan of attack was to use M205 via the Flex and a polishing pad. There was however a few RIDS that needed M105 and the rotary. The front of the car also had some sort of white over spray on it and since I had my rotary out I thought I’d try and remove what the clay had not. I was running my Makita on a speed of 2 with M105 and a PFW pad. I applied medium pressure and with in seconds the paint wrinkled!!!:eek:

Yes, even someone with 20 years experience running a rotary can mess up now and then…just sucks it happened to me.:(

I’m really kicking myself in the butt over this one because I had seen the warnings in threads before about this so called “paint wrinkle”, which can occur when polishing plastic bumpers with a rotary buffer. I honestly didn’t give it too much thought since I have been doing this for so long and have never had it happen to me before.:wall

In talking with others it seems that the flex agent added to the paint for plastic pieces, makes them much more susceptible to paint wrinkle. I’d more inclined to say it’s more of a problem on the newer cars, since I’ve never had this happen before, but I really can’t say for sure…paint really has been changing a lot over the years as the EPA clamps down on auto manufacturers.



For those who are wondering, I dropped the vehicle off this morning to have the bumper cover repainted, and the owner should have it back sometime tomorrow. My father works for one of the elite body shops in the twin cities, so the car will definitely be in good hands.:bigups

I’d also like to say that the owner has been very understanding with this whole deal, which definitely makes things a little easier on me. I also feel better knowing I haven’t lost his business and that he still wants me to do his wife’s car and has also referred me to some others.

Pic of the paint wrinkle…
IMG_1266.jpg
 
i had the paint wrinkle on me a few months back while polishing a custom paint job done with water based paint ..i was low speed on the front of the hood an wham it wrinkled up on me ..i almost puked on the spot i was so bummed out but the owner has had nothing but trouble with the guy who painted it so he was cool ..i think the paint wasnt fully cured ..it was sprayed in a home made booth ...i think these new paints need special drying equipment ...sorry to hear
 
Sorry to hear that Rasky. Time to throw that rotary in the garbage.:crazy2:

Seriously. I have not touched my rotary in months. My FLEX has done everything I have needed it to do without the risks of using a rotary.
 
Sorry to hear this and every detailers nightmare for sure.

Why dose that paint look more chipped than burned? When ever I seen this (have not done it myself) the area looks more smudged or burned looking from extreme heat of friction.

That looks chipped and the paint is flaking off.

Any chance this was repainted?

I'd like to add those cracks seem real deep, if that is just paint over plastic, that's some thick paint?

You should ask the body shop if this car has been repainted or is there any bondo on that bumper?

Something doesn't look right to me.
 
RaskyR1 said:
Pic of the paint wrinkle…
IMG_1266.jpg
Click to expand...

I have to agree with beemerboy. That sure looks like something other than damage caused by a rotary. Unless the rotary lost it's pad and hit the surface with just the backing plate. I have wrinkled paint before and it looked more like a wrinkle in the paint than this.:hmmm:

BTW. Thanks for pointing to it in the pic. I wouldn't have noticed it otherwise. :lmfao Yea I know... I'm a jerk. Making fun of you when you're bummed about having to fix damage. Shame on me.:sorry:
 
Better mark this one on the calendar, Troy agrees with me. :D:D:D

I would also wonder if this bumper was hit lightly compromising the paint, meaning hair line cracks and the rotary just loosened those up?




Troy@DetailCity said:
I have to agree with beemerboy. That sure looks like something other than damage caused by a rotary. Unless the rotary lost it's pad and hit the surface with just the backing plate. I have wrinkled paint before and it looked more like a wrinkle in the paint than this.:hmmm:

BTW. Thanks for pointing to it in the pic. I wouldn't have noticed it otherwise. :lmfao Yea I know... I'm a jerk. Making fun of you when you're bummed about having to fix damage. Shame on me.:sorry:
Click to expand...
 
Beemerboy said:
Sorry to hear this and every detailers nightmare for sure.

Why dose that paint look more chipped than burned? When ever I seen this (have not done it myself) the area looks more smudged or burned looking from extreme heat of friction.

That looks chipped and the paint is flaking off.

Any chance this was repainted?

I'd like to add those cracks seem real deep, if that is just paint over plastic, that's some thick paint?

You should ask the body shop if this car has been repainted or is there any bondo on that bumper?

Something doesn't look right to me.
Click to expand...

I can spot a repaint a mile away...definitely not the case here.

Paint wrinkle is different from a burn in that it does not actually melt the paint. While It did not feel hot to the touch after it happened, it had to have been enough heat to cause the paint to loose adhesion from the plastic panel. The paint literally wrinkles up and chips off like you see in the pic. Too much pressure and too slow of arm speed is likely the cause in my case as the rpm's were only about 1000. (I was trying to remove over spray after all)

I have been much, much more aggressive with plastic bumpers before....lesson learned. :redface:
 
the chipping probably occurred after it had already wrinkled up and the pad was still spinning over the area.
 
RaskyR1 said:
I can spot a repaint a mile away...definitely not the case.

Paint wrinkle is different from a burn in that it does not actually melt the paint. While It did not feel hot to the touch after it happened, it had to have been enough heat to cause the paint to loose adhesion from the plastic panel. The paint literally wrinkles up and chips off like you see in the pic. Too much pressure and too slow of arm speed is likely the cause in my case as the rpm's were only about 1000.

I have been much, much more aggressive with plastic bumpers before....lesson learned. :redface:
Click to expand...

OK then why dose the paint look so thick in the pics...It could be just what the camera is picking up...OEM paint is not that thick.

All I can say is I have a hard time thinking that pressure alone caused this, something else is playing into this IMO
 
Beemerboy said:
OK then why dose the paint look so thick in the pics...It could be just what the camera is picking up...OEM paint is not that thick.

All I can say is I have a hard time thinking that pressure alone caused this, something else is playing into this IMO
Click to expand...

I think it's CC,BC,and primer...
 
I just don't want to have people thinking the paint itself had issues...this was 100% my fault.
 
Troy@DetailCity said:
I have to agree with beemerboy. That sure looks like something other than damage caused by a rotary. Unless the rotary lost it's pad and hit the surface with just the backing plate. I have wrinkled paint before and it looked more like a wrinkle in the paint than this.:hmmm:

BTW. Thanks for pointing to it in the pic. I wouldn't have noticed it otherwise. :lmfao Yea I know... I'm a jerk. Making fun of you when you're bummed about having to fix damage. Shame on me.:sorry:
Click to expand...

LOL. I was pointing at it so the camera could focus better :D
 
RaskyR1 said:
I think it's CC,BC,and primer...
Click to expand...

That's the point that I am making, based on that pic, it looks real thick...again could be just the pic and what the camera picked up...in the years that I have seen paint chip to the metal, it not thick looking like that looks.
 
RaskyR1 said:
I just don't want to have people thinking the paint itself had issues...this was 100% my fault.
Click to expand...

That's the right thing to do..and why you will get repeat biz.

Just make sure to ask the body shop about what I said...untimely you want to make it right for the customer. That doesn't mean that what you did, was wrong if there was something else going in with that area.
 
Beemerboy said:
That's the point that I am making, based on that pic, it looks real thick...again could be just the pic and what the camera picked up...in the years that I have seen paint chip to the metal, it not thick looking like that looks.
Click to expand...

I'm sure the compound on the edge of the chip makes it look thicker too.

I have pretty much been raised up in a body shop and I definitely would be able to tell if it had been repainted.

On a side note my old man said they have issues with some bumpers from time to time when sanding and especially stripe removal. He said they get sort of gummy when sanding and during stripe removal it will rip the paint right off.
 
It seems that a few other times I saw this happen to others , they too were using M105 on bumpers. Just an observation.
 
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