advice needed on minor swirls removal

K

konsole

New member
I want to remove 2 spots of swirl/spider web marks on the hood of my sage green metallic color car. Both spots are about 6"x6" in area and dont appear to be deep. I don't have a power buffer and I would prefer just doing it by hand because I really dont think I will get enough use out of a buffer costing a few hundred dollars. If it requires a power buffer to completely remove the swirls then I guess removing as much as possible by hand is what I'm interested in.

This is what I have...

microfiber towels
foam applicator pads
foam paint brushes to apply the paints
polishing compound
rubbing compound
dawn dish soap
spray bottle filled with carwash
few different grit sandpaper including a 2000
paint that matches my car
clearcoat paint
wax

I can see the use of a clay bar but I really dont think I need it.

This is what I was planning on doing...

1. use the dawn dish soap to remove any remaining wax
2. wash the area well with the car wash and microfiber towel
3. dry the area with microfiber towel
4. either wet sand with the 2000 grit sandpaper sponge or use the polishing compound with a foam applicator pad, in straight lines, to remove the swirls. Maybe try the rubbing compound or one of the heavier grit sandpaper sponges if the lighter stuff doesnt work, then followed up with the lighter stuff.
5. wash and dry the area again
6. If I get all the way down to the colored paint then reapply 1 or 2 coats of the colored paint as needed with the foam brush.
7. use the 2000 grit wet sandpaper or the polishing compound to smooth down the colored paint
8. wash and dry the area again
9. apply 2 or 3 coats of the clear coat paint with the foam brush
10. use the 2000 grit wet sandpaper or the polishing compound to smooth down the clear coat paint
11. wash and dry the area again
12. apply 1 or 2 coats of wax

Do you guys think this will yield good results or am I gonna be left with swirls/spider webs no matter what?

Do you think I am going to need to smooth down each paint application with the wet sanding or polishing compound or should I be ok with just smoothing down the final clear coat application?

Do you think a paint cleaner is really needed?
 
Rule of thumb is to use the LEAST aggressive product and pad combo to get the job done. Forget about wetsanding for swirls marks, thats a nono. Brake down the hood into 4 sections. Use back and forth motions and side to side motions with a polish. Inspect if swirls are still visible step up to a more aggressive polish but not to strong.
 
wallyStang said:
Rule of thumb is to use the LEAST aggressive product and pad combo to get the job done. Forget about wetsanding for swirls marks, thats a nono. Brake down the hood into 4 sections. Use back and forth motions and side to side motions with a polish. Inspect if swirls are still visible step up to a more aggressive polish but not to strong.
Click to expand...

So applying polishing compound with a foam applicator pad is less aggresive then wetsanding with a 2000 grit sandpaper?

I originally got the swirl marks when I was trying to repair 2 paint chips in the hood. Instead of just dabbing a few drops of the colored paint into the chip and then a few drops of clearcoat and being satisfied with something that was pretty good, I decided to try a slightly more aggressive approach and get the paint surface nice and smooth. Well I got it smooth but left minor swirl marks on the surface. Of course I made the mistake of trying the rubbing compound first and moving in circular motions. I think that using the polishing compound only and going in straight lines I'll probably be able to get a decent result.
 
Yes try straight lines and use a light polish. It takes alot of patience. I would recommend poorboys world SSR 1 or SSR 2.5. If you need to buy product locally i would recommend meguiers #9.
 
I used the turtle wax polishing compound and I seemed to have removed the slightly harsher swirl marks using this compound and a foam pad but what I am left with is more lighter spider-web scratches.

See this doesnt make sense to me. How can you remove any severity of scratch on a highly glossy surface without using an abrasive while at the same time adding more lighter scratches, since the abrasive doesnt just polish out the heavier scratches? How are machine buffers able to remove tiny scratches without introducing more even smaller ones? I guess it must be all about using a polish that is such a weak abrasive that the scratches it makes are not visible to people?

I had high hopes for my method because I tried it on a highly polished aluminum surface first making light scratches with the rubbing compound and then using a couple applications of the polishing compound to polish it out, and this worked great. Theres gotta be something out there that doesnt simply fill in the micro scratches but can also be done by hand and will bring back the near perfect glossy mirror shine.

Or is it not possible to restore the glossy mirror shine by machine or by hand without using some fillers to temporarily fill the micro scratches in?
 
Im not sure how aggressive that turtle wax compound is. Next step would be to apply a polish with no compound. Very fine polish. If still no luck you might need to step up to a buffer.
 
I assume the polishing compound I have has light abrasives in it and the "pure polish" your referring to doesnt have any abrasives in it. How then would this pure polish remove the swirls if it doesnt have any cutting power. Won't it just fill the swirls in and be maybe a few months fix before the filler wears out?
 
ok the more and more I read about machines like the Porter Cable 7424 that everyone seems to rave about, the more and more I decide that it may not be a bad idea, even if I dont have that much work to do and considering I'll have it for years and years into the future.

Is it possible to completely eliminate light swirling with this machine or will the final result ultimately just fill in the swirl marks? Reason I ask is again going back to what I said earlier, I don't see how something can be non-abrasive (like pure polish) but still remove (not hide) the swirls. If it just hides the swirls then I might as well just get some swirl concealer that I can apply by hand.
 
Purchase a Porter cable! Detailing is a very fun and addicting hobby! Also when you get good at it you can detail freinds and neighbors cars for money :) Just read on this forum all that you can and practice and your swirls will be gone in no time :) On black vehicles it can be very frustrating! Belive me I know but the end result is well worth it :) Im sure more will chime in.
 
If your polishing with a foam applicator its not going to get the bite that's needed. You should be using cotton of something like that, and not micro fiber
 
Beemerboy is right. Try taking a very soft Tee-shirt cutting it out without seams; and taking the front half folded till you get a 4 X 4 section for one compound and using the back half for the next finer compound. Using opposite directions you should be able to remove your problems, unless you have sanded somewhere; these are deeper corrections. It sounds like you are pretty picky from your post. If you go through the clear coat from what I read you will never be happy wth brush touching what you have. LEAST AGGRESSIVE is best. A tee shirt will hold compound and take out minor problems but too much pressure can marr and even dent the panel. I always reccomend practicing inside the door jamb to see if the process you want to use will meet up to your satisfaction..
 
I have used the turtle wax compound also scratch-out and while not the best stuff on the market it will work.

You will need something with more bite than the foam do like Beemerboy said and add one more thing a lot of PATIENCE it takes a LOT OF RUBBING to do it by hand.
 
konsole said:
I used the turtle wax polishing compound and I seemed to have removed the slightly harsher swirl marks using this compound and a foam pad but what I am left with is more lighter spider-web scratches.

See this doesnt make sense to me. How can you remove any severity of scratch on a highly glossy surface without using an abrasive while at the same time adding more lighter scratches, since the abrasive doesnt just polish out the heavier scratches? How are machine buffers able to remove tiny scratches without introducing more even smaller ones? I guess it must be all about using a polish that is such a weak abrasive that the scratches it makes are not visible to people?

I had high hopes for my method because I tried it on a highly polished aluminum surface first making light scratches with the rubbing compound and then using a couple applications of the polishing compound to polish it out, and this worked great. Theres gotta be something out there that doesnt simply fill in the micro scratches but can also be done by hand and will bring back the near perfect glossy mirror shine.

Or is it not possible to restore the glossy mirror shine by machine or by hand without using some fillers to temporarily fill the micro scratches in?
Click to expand...

You know how when you sand wood, you start w/ 100 grit, then 150, then 220, maybe finish w/ 400 or 600? By the time you finish w/ the 400 grit, the wood feels pretty darn smooth. All of these grits are abrasive, but the finer you go, the better the finish will be.

By using only the Turtle Wax Rubbing Cmpd, then Polishing Cmpd, you are doing the wood equivalent of quitting at grit 150. You've got the big stuff out, but you need to finish w/ finer abrasives. The PB SSR2.5 and SSR1 is a good recommendation for finer polishes (abrasives).
 
kinda misleading because when I think of "polish" I think of making something smooth with plenty of shine. If something has any abrasives in it at all I think it should not called a polish. Oh well I decided to take some heavy grit sandpaper to the hood so that I could repaint it a flat black color instead. I already applied 2 coats so 1 or 2 more should do it. I'll probably skip a clear paint application on it because the rough texture of the paint combined with the flat back color will make it very easy to touch up should I experience any problems with it in the future, and I also would rather deal with more coats of one color rather then a few coats of one and a few coats of clear coat.. Plus there are plenty of other flat black all over the the car that it matches to.
 
ifimayputmy .02 cents into it, i am currently trying to remove the swirl marks in my car, i have tried the turtle wax polishing compound with a cotton pad...no good just adds more swirls into the finish, i went out and purchased some ultimate compound and some new cotton pads with no effort what so ever 90 percent of the swirls are gone on the first application, sorry i dont have any pics, i plan on doing at least one more application but this time with some elbow grease...so i would suggest to just throw away the turtle wax and go get some utlimate compound
 
As another member advised start with the least aggresive then work your way up if needed. Also If you give your general location maybe a member of the forum could lend a hand.
 
konsole said:
kinda misleading because when I think of "polish" I think of making something smooth with plenty of shine. If something has any abrasives in it at all I think it should not called a polish. Oh well I decided to take some heavy grit sandpaper to the hood so that I could repaint it a flat black color instead. I already applied 2 coats so 1 or 2 more should do it. I'll probably skip a clear paint application on it because the rough texture of the paint combined with the flat back color will make it very easy to touch up should I experience any problems with it in the future, and I also would rather deal with more coats of one color rather then a few coats of one and a few coats of clear coat.. Plus there are plenty of other flat black all over the the car that it matches to.
Click to expand...

If it has abrasives it shouldn't be called a polish? I guess Poorboy's, Menzerna, Meguiar's etc. have got it all wrong. Sorry everybody has been misleading you.

This is from Autogeek, forum sponsor, if you care to read it:

Swirl Removers, Compounds & Car Polishes: remove swirls with swirl mark removers, scratch removers, spiderwebs, car polish, rubbing compound,
 
chet31 said:
If it has abrasives it shouldn't be called a polish? I guess Poorboy's, Menzerna, Meguiar's etc. have got it all wrong. Sorry everybody has been misleading you.

This is from Autogeek, forum sponsor, if you care to read it:

Swirl Removers, Compounds & Car Polishes: remove swirls with swirl mark removers, scratch removers, spiderwebs, car polish, rubbing compound,
Click to expand...

Your right it may be that the industry general assumes polish has a certain degree of abrasives in it. I don't have much experience using it so I was going on my first assumption that polish meant no cutting action at all. I guess it does make sense that any undissolved solid that is in a substance and is harder then the material its being used on, could be considered an abrasive. Up until recently when I heard "polish" I always thought about shoe polish and didnt think much about how it actually made the shoes shine. The foam roller makes it smooth to look good but at the same time make it rugged enough to resist damage and be easier to touch up in the future.

I don't like the idea of swirl mark fillers that simply fill in the scratches temporarily. May be ok for concealed places but I'd prefer not to use it on any place that makes friends with the wash mitt. Just the thought of the scratches still being there, and having to reapply after a few months bugs me a bit, plus the chances of these reapplications creating more scratches. I know there are cars out there that are completely painted matte flat color and I love this idea because I'd paint 3 or 4 coats of this color and then skip the clear coat altogether. I guess I really dont care much for the mirror shine achieved by clear coat, since the clear coat just makes it more difficult to touch up and I don't need to be blinded by the suns reflection. After having painted my hood a flat black color and giving it a little texture with a foam roller, I really like it and planning on doing this for the door sills for the driver and passenger doors and the trunk sill, all areas that can easily scratch up. The foam roller gives the paint a smooth enough texture were it looks good but its rugged enough were it resists damage and is easier to touch up in the future.
 
It can be confusing, because there are a few (not many) companies that mislabel (in my opinion) sealants and waxes as "polishes." Most of the big boys do not do this.

If you want to get rid of scratches, you must use abrasives, which would be sandpaper, compounds, or polishes. A compound can be looked at as a polish w/ heavy abrasives. You can get a great final finish using a polish w/ very fine abrasives. You can hide scratches to a certain degree w/ glazes, sealants, and waxes.
 
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