please answer about PBMG products

**glen e** · 01-30-2013, 04:26 PM

Gents:

This was posted on a Honda site I moderate and I think it`s a good question , how do you see the difference in these lines?

"I keep seeing all these different products listed, is it me or does anyone notice all the same "types" of Products with different names and fancy labels listed. After checking it appears PBMG Palm Beach Motor Group manufactures Blackfire, Wolfgang, Pinnacle, Detailers Pro Series, and Diamondite. Would be easier with less to choose from."

Thanks!

**BobbyG** · 01-30-2013, 06:00 PM

Hey Glen,

I`ve tried many different products from all of these lines except for Diamondite and do see differences in their performance.

Keep in mind we all have opinions of what works best for us and this may not hold true for someone else. The variables out there are almost endless and it`s not surprising we see differences.

Correction and Finishing

I personally find much higher correction and finishing performance with Wolfgang Total Swirl Remover 3.0 and Wolfgang Finishing Glaze 3.0 vs Pinnacle Advanced Swirl Remover and Pinnacle Advanced Finishing Polish.

Sealants (wipe on and walk away)

Wolfgang Deep Gloss Liquid Seal

Sealant (apply and let haze)

BlackFire Wet Diamond

Shampoo

Detailer’s Pro Series Xtreme Foam Formula

Wax

Wolfgang Fuzion

I could go on and on but I think you see what I mean...

**Rsurfer** · 01-30-2013, 09:21 PM

Originally Posted by glen e

Gents:

This was posted on a Honda site I moderate and I think it`s a good question , how so you see the difference in these lines?

"I keep seeing all these different products listed, is it me or does anyone notice all the same "types" of Products with different names and fancy labels listed. After checking it appears PBMG Palm Beach Motor Group manufactures Blackfire, Wolfgang, Pinnacle, Detailers Pro Series, and Diamondite. Would be easier with less to choose from."

Thanks!

Why, just because PBMG owns these products doesn`t mean they all work the same. If these were just re-labled products I would agree, but there not.

**Nth Degree** · 01-30-2013, 09:32 PM

Originally Posted by Rsurfer

Why, just because PBMG owns these products doesn`t mean they all work the same. If these were just re-labled products I would agree, but there not.

Agreed. I have a lot of "redundant" products. I don`t need them all, but I find that some products work/look better on certain paints. An enthusiast would probably be very happy with any one product from a category. It often isn`t until doing a side by side comparison that the differences are noticeable.

**Todd@RUPES** · 01-31-2013, 08:27 AM

PBMG is certainty one of the leaders in premium car care and have acquired many lines throughout their history. Pinnacle is based on natural ingredients and carnauba wax, Wolfgang is based on German technology and the latest in polymer advancements, Detailers is a quality alternative to bulk chemicals (for detailers) and so on and so on...

**RZJZA80** · 01-31-2013, 11:56 AM

There`s a thread on another forum that alludes that the house brands and a few others are just relabeled products, basically only different in color and scent, I guess that`s not true after all.

**Todd@RUPES** · 01-31-2013, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by RZJZA80

There`s a thread on another forum that alludes that the house brands and a few others are just relabeled products, basically only different in color and scent, I guess that`s not true after all.

That would be some people`s assumptions.

**glen e** · 01-31-2013, 12:25 PM

I am asking as someone else asked...I can see a total diff between pinnacle, Wolfgang and BF, (the ones I`ve used). They all make the car look diff - done plenty of side by side tests....I land on BF products because of the ease of use....as you get older with a bad back, that becomes a huge priority ...LOL

We have created a huge following for BF at our accord site - see the BF posts here:

Maintenance & Detailing - Drive Accord Honda Forums

**BobbyG** · 01-31-2013, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by RZJZA80

There`s a thread on another forum that alludes that the house brands and a few others are just relabeled products, basically only different in color and scent, I guess that`s not true after all.

It`s possible some product lines are but I don`t feel that`s the case with PBMG house brands. I`ve used enough like products from each like to get a good sampling and they`re not even close..

Todd`s reply articulating the immediate differences is an important read. While I`ve used many Pinnacle products I never knew their base was natural ingredients. We learn something new every day...

I`m a huge fan of Menzerna products and most com from Germany, that`s probably why I`ve had outstanding results with Wolfgang due to many similarities..

**RTexasF** · 01-31-2013, 12:44 PM

Seems like the person that asked that would be equally confused at a grocery store, a tire store, a shoe store, or just about anywhere.

**BobbyG** · 01-31-2013, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by glen e

I am asking as someone else asked...I can see a total diff between pinnacle, Wolfgang and BF, (the ones I`ve used). They all make the car look diff - done plenty of side by side tests....I land on BF products because of the ease of use....as you get older with a bad back, that becomes a huge priority ...LOL

We have created a huge following for BF at our accord site - see the BF posts here:

Maintenance & Detailing - Drive Accord Honda Forums

Cool site Glen, I just took a look!!

**RZJZA80** · 01-31-2013, 12:45 PM

I think the accusations are sometimes more for bashing a competitor than anything else. Where are the house brands mentioned manufactured?

**Swanicyouth** · 01-31-2013, 04:53 PM

Oh... You mean Fuzion isn`t just BFMS with red dye? Damn, there goes that conspiracy theory.... Shame on these people. I`ve used quite a few PBMG products and I think they are all top notch. They work even BETTER when they are purchased on BOGO.

If like to know exactly what products are thought of as the same. No more the same than 4*, Ultima, & Sonus.

**psnt1ol** · 01-31-2013, 11:07 PM

I been in retail management for all of my life and I feel that the public generally fails to see the concept of house brands for what they are. I worked for a large retailer and we "as a company" created many house brands to compete directly with the vendors we carried in the store.

In our case, the reasons are in several folds.

1. Create loyalty.

2. To address a need that is currently not being address in the vendor community.

3. Higher profit margins to remain afloat in this current ultra-competitive market while keeping the cost low for the consumer.

4. Faster reaction time to deal with a change/shift in the marketplace.

Like many successful company, PBMG also did their homework. They tailored each house brand to the needs of a particular targeted segment. Each brand represent a different approach to tackle the same problem.

At the end of the day, the brand name doesn`t really matter....its the product that counts. No hype or fancy marketing can guarantee longevity and consumer confidence in a bad product.

**Lou Bunn** · 02-01-2013, 08:23 AM

After a successful career in the insurance biz, my Dad decided that retirement sucked and he wanted to get out of the house. That`s what happens when your only hobby is smoking cigars and doing the crossword puzzle everyday in the paper. So, he got a part time job at a hardware store/grain mill. The owner was an old family friend and showed my Dad many products that were essentially the same thing but at different price points. The best example was chicken feed - there were 4 types, all had different names - like chicken starter or laying mash, but - they were all the same blend, different packaging! Why? you failed Marketing 101?
Bottom line - "most" fancy smancy sounding boutique stuff aint a bit better. I`m looking at you - high dollar waxes!
Call me cheap but I`ll look for value that gets results every time.