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  1. #46
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Weíll see when it rains. Maybe these guys come back alive, but my guess is theyíre pretty roasted. Lots of miles, lots of washes.

    I generally get 5-6 months out of most these sealants when Iím not constantly stressing them. I think constant washing makes the biggest impact... but just my observation.
    As promised, below are some quick post-rain shots from today 07/21/2020. Seems all protection is still present based on beading observation (middle roof looking pretty ugly though) and my previous hose tests were showing degraded LSPs, but not particularly ďdeadĒ LSPs.







    Different folks on the forum will have different opinions as to when they would call an LSP dead, and most of us would re-apply based on the last hose test. But if I never did the hose test and only observed regular behavior under precipitation, then one could argue that these are all alive still and will probably be alive for some time more. Performance over lifetime and actual longevity are two different attributes, each worthy of their own respect.

    At some point Iíll decide how long itís worth to track them, but for now they will remain.
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  2. #47

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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    I generally get 5-6 months out of most these sealants when Iím not constantly stressing them. I think constant washing makes the biggest impact... but just my observation.
    "Biggest impact" for better or worse? Heh heh, bet that sounds kinda clueless, but I did have to ask!

    FWIW, I`ve never really noticed much diff in my FK1000P related to how often I wash it. I`ll sometimes let it go for so long that, well...I won`t post it ...and OTOH I`ll sometimes wash (seemingly) all the [freakin`] time, but I don`t see it mattering much. Not like how some shampoos strip my LSPs like magic even though they`re supposedly "gentle".

  3. #48
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    "Biggest impact" for better or worse? Heh heh, bet that sounds kinda clueless, but I did have to ask!

    FWIW, I`ve never really noticed much diff in my FK1000P related to how often I wash it. I`ll sometimes let it go for so long that, well...I won`t post it ...and OTOH I`ll sometimes wash (seemingly) all the [freakin`] time, but I don`t see it mattering much. Not like how some shampoos strip my LSPs like magic even though they`re supposedly "gentle".
    In my experience, washing very often will hurt the longevity of the LSP. It’s a trade off, car looks nice more often which is the ultimate goal for me, but I tend to notice a shorter life. Whenever I get busy in life and don’t wash as often, it seems to me like the LSP during that stretch shows little wear.

    I should note that I typically towel dry, sometimes less careful than other times depending on my schedule. I don’t like my Water blow dryer and rarely use it (but plan to get a better one when I move). I’m sure washing 3x/wk with a mitt and towel drying (touching the paint) plays some roll in diminishing the LSP.

  4. #49

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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    In my experience, washing very often will hurt the longevity of the LSP. It’s a trade off, car looks nice more often which is the ultimate goal for me, but I tend to notice a shorter life. Whenever I get busy in life and don’t wash as often, it seems to me like the LSP during that stretch shows little wear.
    IME some LSP/shampoo combos do better/worse than others, like how BF`s and Pinnacle`s shampoos would always kill my LSPs; no such issues with the GG + 3D mix, at least not on FK1000P (though it`s probably tough on OCW`d A8, but I usually do it every wash anyhow since I`m using it as Drying Aid).
    I should note that I typically towel dry, sometimes less careful than other times depending on my schedule..
    Same here, except when doing a Home-Touchless. But I do always blow 99% of the water off first.

    .. I’m sure washing 3x/wk with a mitt and towel drying (touching the paint) plays some roll in diminishing the LSP.
    Heh heh, I used to do things like that too, but now I`m not washing 3X/*month* if I can help it.
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  5. #50
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Thanks for this test @acuRAS82. I was curious about the SiO2 since I was running out of my DGPS. .....which has me wondering if it the SiO2 would play well with the DGPS or if it would need to be stripped.

    btw, you`re right about Accumulator. I haven`t been on these forums in a long time but I got a lot of useful info from him over the years including several other "old timers". ....and yeah, he turned me on to FK1000P as well and like you folks, I`m a little baffled as well at your results. That has to be one of the toughest (if not the toughest) sealant I`ve used. ....very durable. Hell, I recall having issues with going a little too thick on my first application in a couple spots and man, was it a bear to get that stuff off.

    Anyhow, thanks again for posting up. While not a true Autopian anymore (bad back issues have finally caught up to me), I still try to protect my cars and make them easier to clean by getting something on there. ....but "ease of application / removal" is a more important factor these days and DGPS was about as easy as they get IMO / IME.
    2010 Challenger R/T
    2020 Forester
    1986 4Runner
    1969 Charger SE

  6. #51
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kean View Post
    Thanks for this test @acuRAS82. I was curious about the SiO2 since I was running out of my DGPS. .....which has me wondering if it the SiO2 would play well with the DGPS or if it would need to be stripped.

    btw, you`re right about Accumulator. I haven`t been on these forums in a long time but I got a lot of useful info from him over the years including several other "old timers". ....and yeah, he turned me on to FK1000P as well and like you folks, I`m a little baffled as well at your results. That has to be one of the toughest (if not the toughest) sealant I`ve used. ....very durable. Hell, I recall having issues with going a little too thick on my first application in a couple spots and man, was it a bear to get that stuff off.

    Anyhow, thanks again for posting up. While not a true Autopian anymore (bad back issues have finally caught up to me), I still try to protect my cars and make them easier to clean by getting something on there. ....but "ease of application / removal" is a more important factor these days and DGPS was about as easy as they get IMO / IME.
    There’s been talk about if/how DGPS would be compatible with WG SiO2 PS. Maybe you can put SiO2 on top without much performance drop but I think it’s better to strip to get these full benefits, and if anything maybe do a panel with DGPS underneath to compare.

    Regarding FK1000p, if you do enough of these small-area applications its bound to get some anomalies or odd variations. I’ve seen quite a few things not perform as well in a tight spot compared to when I was fully focused applying to an entire car. Furthermore, any tests of any kind that I do going forward will likely have 2 coats. I think that reduces chances of issues such as poor prep, poor application, poor wipe off, cooler temps... the more you can solidify a product on itself via second coat the better or more consistent it behaves, for me.

    However, part of me also wonders if maybe the very top layer of a wax can get dried out a bit. And given I’m only doing a quick swipe off the top of the wax to apply to a tiny area. I first wondered this when I got lesser results from Synergy. Could it be hurting the application that the applicator isn’t getting more saturated or digging into the wax more, only taking a very small amount out for a 1’x3’ area instead.

    Aditionally I try to keep saying it, but FK might last another 5 months. It just doesn’t have the high performance in this test that a WG SiO2, PNS or our surprise guest UPP has. But I understand that FK users do expect that kind of high performance. I probably can’t point to anything besides user area or the paint itself that is causing poor performance. It’s not like prep is a huge issue for these traditional sealants. I think it’s either my fault OR that very top thin layer is just not the cream of the crop within that tin.

  7. #52
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Yeah, I always do at least two coats if for anything, to help mitigate the potential issues of any unevenness or missed spots. I should update my signature as my wife`s `08 Forester was just replaced by a new 2020 Forester. .....and I had just applied 2 coats of DGPS to it and one to my Challenger. ....I usually wait a day or two or perhaps the next wash between coats.

    Thanks for the feedback. So I take it SiO2 is as easy to apply as DPGS if not more? I think that may be my next purchase to replace my nearly empty bottle as my next "go to".
    2010 Challenger R/T
    2020 Forester
    1986 4Runner
    1969 Charger SE

  8. #53
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by Kean View Post
    Thanks for the feedback. So I take it SiO2 is as easy to apply as DPGS if not more? I think that may be my next purchase to replace my nearly empty bottle as my next "go to".
    As easy, or easier... it’s hard to compare two extremely easy tasks.

  9. #54
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Well, if it`s at least as easy, I`m sold. ....but yeah, I get it. . Thanks again.
    2010 Challenger R/T
    2020 Forester
    1986 4Runner
    1969 Charger SE
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  10. #55

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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    We had a thread discussion on WHY Autopians use a particular Last Step Product (or LSP, meaning wax/sealant/coating) and I think some of the factors are, in no particular order of importance:
    1) Protection from environmental fallout (bug guts, bird bombs, acid rain, pollen, tree sap or leaves, ancillary fungus)
    2) Water beading or sheeting
    3) Self-cleaning characteristics
    4) Look or reflective-ness
    5) Longevity (How long it lasts or maintains the above four factors)
    6) Ease of application and removal (including does it stain plastic trim!)
    7) Cost per application (Good waxes are cheap compared to coatings, BUT require more time for more-frequent applications)
    8) Product`s life expectancy (how long does the product stay usable or good in the container)
    9) Purchase availability (Over-the-counter, boutique/web stores, or limited to licensed installers)
    10) Smell (If you are fragrance/chemical-sensitive, it matters!)
    11) Manufacturer`s warranty or guarantee of longevity or satisfaction of its look or ease of application (Please return unused portion of product for a full refund. Riiiiiight....).

    Based on all of these factors, which of these sealants that were tested would you choose??
    For me, it is still about the looks of ANY LSP I apply to my personal vehicle. But then maybe it is about protection for you or your client. Or application cost.
    We all have different priorities and expectations of what what an LSP should be.

    Thanks to acuRAS82 for doing this sealant test! Based on this test, it is pretty easy to see that the Wolfgang`s Si02 is a pretty good sealant to use
    And, yes, I have resisted the need to try FK1000P despite Accumulator`s incessant promptings and recommendations.
    (We always thought you were a fool, Captain Obvious. Now we know...just sayin`)
    GB detailer
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  11. #56

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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by acuRAS82 View Post
    Regarding FK1000p....part of me also wonders if maybe the very top layer of a wax can get dried out a bit. And given I’m only doing a quick swipe off the top of the wax to apply to a tiny area...[maybe]...that very top thin layer is just not the cream of the crop within that tin..
    Good thinking, but I`d bet "not". Consider that the experiences that lead me to become a fanboy for it were based on the little sample tin of it that was so dried-out I had to spray FK425 on it, and then let that dwell, work it into product, spray more, etc. etc. just to be able to use the stuff.

    I keep thinking it`s just *that paint*. Seems just like the rear bumpercover of my wife`s A8, which has been a LSP-killer ever since the last repaint. If I bothered to FK1000P it, I bet it`d die off just as fast as everything else does...on that one panel. I oughta try it some time just to see, but it`d make that one panel look awfully different from the rest of the (OCW`ed) car.

    ..Aditionally I try to keep saying it, but FK might last another 5 months. It just doesn’t have the high performance in this test that a WG SiO2, PNS or our surprise guest UPP has...
    Surprise is right! Hey, what *color* is your UPP? I have one bottle each of tan/blue and can`t remember which is the v1.0/v2.0. AND...I`d be kinda surprised if they haven`t reformulated it since then.

    But I understand that FK users do expect that kind of high performance...
    Around here, that`s quite possibly the result of all my posting about it I sure don`t want people to feel they wasted their $ (let alone *time*, which I value even more) by listening to me! I do try to emphasize the "YMMV" aspect of it...

    I probably can’t point to anything besides user area or the paint itself that is causing poor performance. It’s not like prep is a huge issue for these traditional sealants. I think it’s either my fault...
    You`re right about the FK *NOT* being finicky about prep, so I sure wouldn`t say it`s your fault. Other than making things hard by overapplying (too much or too many layers in quick succession), it`s pretty hard to botch that one up (or else it`d have bitten me by now).

  12. #57
    wannafbody
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Just a thought about SIO2 infused waxes and coatings. It seems that traditional thought has been that thinner is better when applying polymer products. But it stands to reason that a wax would last longer with a thicker application, although just how much gets wiped off after flashing is a question. Now with Coatings it seems that if a particular product actually lays down a thicker layer than a traditional polymer sealant that applying it thick with a foam applicator would provide better long term results than a thin application that gets wiped around with a microfiber towel that possibly misses small spots. I can`t help but think that a fair amount of the coating would get sucked up by the microfiber towel.

  13. #58
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by wannafbody View Post
    Just a thought about SIO2 infused waxes and coatings. It seems that traditional thought has been that thinner is better when applying polymer products. But it stands to reason that a wax would last longer with a thicker application, although just how much gets wiped off after flashing is a question. Now with Coatings it seems that if a particular product actually lays down a thicker layer than a traditional polymer sealant that applying it thick with a foam applicator would provide better long term results than a thin application that gets wiped around with a microfiber towel that possibly misses small spots. I can`t help but think that a fair amount of the coating would get sucked up by the microfiber towel.
    Interesting point. I’ll be curious if the long time coating users have any thoughts. From the perspective of Ceramic Sprays and Waxes, I already mentioned I tend to see better results after a buildup of a few applications over days/weeks. I don’t know the answer as to whether a thicker coat would leave more behind (or at least prevent missing tiny spots), but it seems feasible.

  14. #59
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by Accumulator View Post
    Good thinking, but I`d bet "not". Consider that the experiences that lead me to become a fanboy for it were based on the little sample tin of it that was so dried-out I had to spray FK425 on it, and then let that dwell, work it into product, spray more, etc. etc. just to be able to use the stuff.
    Understood, and I know itís a long shot. Just trying to make sense for a lesser performance.

    Surprise is right! Hey, what *color* is your UPP? I have one bottle each of tan/blue and can`t remember which is the v1.0/v2.0. AND...I`d be kinda surprised if they haven`t reformulated it since then.
    I bought my UPP in 2018. Mine is tan, hereís the bottle:








    Around here, that`s quite possibly the result of all my posting about it I sure don`t want people to feel they wasted their $ (let alone *time*, which I value even more) by listening to me! I do try to emphasize the "YMMV" aspect of it...
    Accumulator, I would not worry about a small test area of mine discrediting your recommendations. Youíve used this over and over, as have many others here. My instance is a first use applied to a tiny area. No one should let my result keep them away from such a highly praised product.

  15. #60
    acuRAS82's Avatar
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    Re: Wolfgang SiO2 Paint Sealant versus Traditional Sealants - Test!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnie View Post
    We had a thread discussion on WHY Autopians use a particular Last Step Product (or LSP, meaning wax/sealant/coating) and I think some of the factors are, in no particular order of importance:
    1) Protection from environmental fallout (bug guts, bird bombs, acid rain, pollen, tree sap or leaves, ancillary fungus)
    2) Water beading or sheeting
    3) Self-cleaning characteristics
    4) Look or reflective-ness
    5) Longevity (How long it lasts or maintains the above four factors)
    6) Ease of application and removal (including does it stain plastic trim!)
    7) Cost per application (Good waxes are cheap compared to coatings, BUT require more time for more-frequent applications)
    8) Product`s life expectancy (how long does the product stay usable or good in the container)
    9) Purchase availability (Over-the-counter, boutique/web stores, or limited to licensed installers)
    10) Smell (If you are fragrance/chemical-sensitive, it matters!)
    11) Manufacturer`s warranty or guarantee of longevity or satisfaction of its look or ease of application (Please return unused portion of product for a full refund. Riiiiiight....).

    Based on all of these factors, which of these sealants that were tested would you choose??
    For me, it is still about the looks of ANY LSP I apply to my personal vehicle. But then maybe it is about protection for you or your client. Or application cost.
    We all have different priorities and expectations of what what an LSP should be.

    Thanks to acuRAS82 for doing this sealant test! Based on this test, it is pretty easy to see that the Wolfgang`s Si02 is a pretty good sealant to use
    And, yes, I have resisted the need to try FK1000P despite Accumulator`s incessant promptings and recommendations.
    (We always thought you were a fool, Captain Obvious. Now we know...just sayin`)
    Great post and question. One thing is clear from this test and another Iíve finished: WG SiO2 has great performance and good longevity, at a minimum. Since PNS is a favorite among forum members, Iíll do a quick compare:

    Beading, sheeting, and self cleaning is great. I believe it sheets better (when car is in motion) and self-cleans better than PNS. This is close though. PNS beads a bit better. WG has many more applications in a bottle than PNS (Iím guessing on DGPS that this holds 20-30 applications; PNS I understand gets you about 5-6 per 340ml can). So even at an original price point $10 higher, cost per application is better for WG. WG is as easy to apply as any sealant Iíve used. PNS has the grabby wipe off. Both seem chemical resistant equally. Iím not a huge fan of PNS looks on dark (though itís awesome on lighter IMO), and WG I will withhold my opinion due to small test areas but based on other reviews it is quite a looker.

    I mention price per application above, but in general price isnít a critical category for me. Iím an enthusiast and I try a lot of things. I care most about looks, performance and application; what I would call the ďfun attributesĒ.
    But since I do detail family members and friends cars in the past, longevity and resistance to chemicals are also important to me, for their satisfaction. But on my own cars these categories donít matter as much. Iím Autopian.

    So honestly, per this test, WG checks all the boxes that I care about. Itís my new favorite. PNS is very close in performance but I really donít like application... so much that itís not my second favorite despite incredible performance.

    Others that check all the boxes for me but donít have performance (water behavior and self-clean) to match SiO2 or PNS are DGPS, M37 Hi Def, PBL, 845, 915. Note that I consider 915 to be a beauty wax on durability-steroids and not a traditional sealant.

    Based on this test alone, I must add UPP as a potential new favorite traditional sealant. But this is a one-time experience, Iíve applied elsewhere but never saw it in action long term after application. If it performs like this all the time for me, it may pass PBL as my favorite traditional sealant.

    DGPS and Mckees Hi Def havenít stood out in this test, but Iíve used both quite a bit and they are both great and check all the boxes, only behind in water performance to SiO2 and PNS.

    Iím sure Powerlock is awesome based on reviews and probably stands close to my favorite traditional sealants as far as checking boxes, but Iíve only reached for it a few times. The sealants mentioned above I have more experience with.

    I like BF a lot but it doesnít have the longevity or resistance of my favorites. So I put it a tier behind. It looks so good on dark cars though.
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