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  1. #1
    Just a regular guy Todd@RUPES's Avatar
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    Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher




    Choosing the correct machine can be tricky and confusing. After all they are significant investment and there is a lot of information, sometimes conflicting information about the machine polisher`s you can purchase for your car.

    All machine polishers work by creating friction on the paint`s surface. This friction caused by the movement the machine polisher creates as it moves a polishing pad across the surface. It should be noted that since all machine polishers create friction and the process of polishing paint means that you are removing paint, there is always some risk involved.

    Types of Polishers:

    • Dual Action Polishers: Dual Action Polisher, or DA Polishers, work by moving the pad in two patterns at the same time. They combine an oscillating movement (tiny orbital movement) with a spinning movement. Depending on the type of machine, the spinning action can be free wheeling (Random Orbital ) or direct (Forced Rotation).
    • Rotary Polishers: Rotary Polishers, which are also referred to as Variable Speed, High Speed, and/or Circular polishers work by moving the pad in a spinning motion. These machines generally create much higher friction due to the rapid rate at which they move the pad.



    DA Polisher Types: - Since this article focuses on choosing the correct Random Orbital Style Polisher, we will look at the two types of DA Polisher Types: Random Orbital and Forced Rotation

    Random Orbital DA Polishers: Random Orbital DA Polishers have a free-spinning or free-wheeling pad. There is no direct drive between the pad spinning and the motor. Random Orbital DA Polishers instead drive the pad in a tiny orbital movement that very much mimics the movement of your hand if you where applying wax in the Mr. Myagi "wax on/wax off" motion, only much smaller circles and a much higher rate of speed.

    A free-spinning bearing connects the backing plate (pad mount) to the machine. Centrifugal force, created by the tiny orbital motion, allows the pad to spin. Since there is no direct link between the machine and the rotation of the pad, applying too much pressure will cause the pad to stop rotating. This can prevent over heating the paint as well as prevent to much paint removal.

    On the surface, Random Orbital DA Polishers are the safest and easiest to control for new users. Random Orbital Polishers have another unique advantage. Because there is no direct link between the rotation and orbital movements, it allows the pad`s to create an infinitely variable (hence Random) pattern of movement across the paint. Manipulation of this pattern, by experienced users, can dramatically increase the cutting power or finishing ability.

    Random Orbital Polishers-

    Porter Cable 7424 XP- Porter Cable, with the original 7424, is the company that introduced DA polishing to enthusiasts. The "XP" has more power, more speed, and less vibrations. While some would say it "only" features a 1-year warrenty, many would argue that they never need one to begin with.

    Griot`s Garage 6 Inch DA- The Griot`s Garage is a power house with a life-time warrenty. It features a power 850 watt motor that may resist bogging more than the other models.


    Meguiar`s G110v2- The Meguiar`s G110v2 features a soft start feature, rubberized soft-touch body, and ultra smooth performance. It also has the same high speed as the other polishers and a powerful motor. It is a little more polished then the other machines, but just as capable. It also features an extremely accurate speed dial.



    Forced Rotation DA Polishers: Forced Rotation DA Polishers get their namesake because the directly drive both the orbital motion and the rotational movement of the pad. The pattern the pad creates as it moves across the paint`s surface is controlled and never changes; the only variable is the rate (speed) of the movement. These machines are very much a blend between Random Orbital DA Polishers and direct-drive Rotary Polishers.

    Instead of a free-spinning bearing assembly, Forced Rotation DA Polishers use some type of gearing system to tie both movements together. This adds to the complexity of the machine, but also increases the available polishing power, particularly when pressure is applied. With a Random Orbital DA Polisher the pad may stop spinning under pressure. With the Forced Rotation DA Polisher it will continue to spin (and orbit) increasing the potential for polishing power.

    Since the pattern of movement of the pad is fixed (the pad will orbit a fixed number of times per rotation) the only variable the operator controls is the rate (speed) of movement and the pressure. This actually shortens the learning curve of the machine and allows almost new users to achieve maximum results with little learn time.

    The flip-side is because the motion is directly driven there is more heat transfer to the paint. Forced Rotation DA Polishers will also drive or stear more across the paint as they work. You do trade some safety for the increase in polishing power, although it still remains an extremely safe way to polish paint.

    Forced Rotation DA Polishers-

    Makita BO6040 Polisher- The Makita "Two-Mode` is unique in that it features both a Random Orbital mode and a Forced Rotation mode. Simply turn a dial to switch between the different functions. Unlike the other polishers in this article, it features a smaller, 3/16th in stroke (the distance of the orbit) which makes it great for machine sanding in Random Orbital Mode.


    FLEX 3401 VRG Dual Action Polisher- The FLEX 3401 is one of the most popular polishers on the market and for good reason. It gives polishers the ability to remove serious paint defects quickly on the first use. A variable speed dial and variable speed trigger allows the user to find the right speed for the application and the rugged design never seems to dissappoint.


    Picking the right polisher:

    Before deciding on the exact model it is good to first evaluate your needs and the style of Dual Action Polisher will fit you.

    Random Orbital Polishers (Porter Cable, Griot`s, Meguiar`s) used to be considered under-powered beginner`s tools. Now with the advent of modern pad systems (low profile foam pads and microfiber discs) and abrasives this is no longer the case. In fact there has been a resurgence in Random Orbital Polisher use with advanced and experienced users. Learning how to master the Random Orbital DA Polisher takes a lot of time, but for the few that have, you will rarely see them use another machine.

    Forced Rotation Polishers combine many aspects from Random Orbital DA Polishers and Rotary Polishers. The result is a polisher that has near the cutting power of a rotary while being nearly as safe as a Random Orbital DA. For many enthusiasts this is the style of choice. With minimal experience they can generate incredible results, quickly.

    Regardless of the sytle of DA Polisher you choose, Autopia-CarCare has the support team and the tools (pads/polishes/towels/misc items) to make sure you are on your way to high level polishing.

  2. #2
    rider9195's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Nice thread Todd. This should be a sticky!

  3. #3
    Just a regular guy Todd@RUPES's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Quote Originally Posted by rider9195 View Post
    Nice thread Todd. This should be a sticky!
    Thanks!

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    My name is Mike mjlinane's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Great info, Todd. I agree - sticky.

  5. #5
    Just a regular guy Todd@RUPES's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher


  6. #6
    addysdaddy's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Like many here on the forum, I`ve read a ton of posts about the different features and attributes of the different polishing tools available. It might help those trying to make a buying decision if those who have used these various units (Mr Helme) spoke to why they reach for a specific tool in a specific set of circumstances. Guess I`m saying try to explain in more detail "the right tool for the right job" concept, since a newbie doesn`t know how to answer that question. I could be wrong but I`m assuming a pro knows the tasks he/she needs to perform and then goes out and purchases the right tool for that job. Again to the newbie side of the equation, the fact that one tool is direct drive with forced rotation versus a dual action polisher, difficult to cut through all of that for the novice. It might be more helpful to explain the conditions that dictate using one machine over another. I`m just asking...

  7. #7

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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Great Post...I did alot of research before making my choice of the Griot Garage 6" DA Polisher. The front runner was the PC 7424XP but once I learned that I would have to buy a backing plate that would cost me $30 I went with the GG Polisher since I was using their pads already and it was less plus I got a 15% discount at the Griots location.

  8. #8
    Rocket's Avatar
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    Nice post Todd. I have a PC and Flex. I use both of them but the Flex is what I pick up when I`m needing more correcting power

  9. #9
    skibik's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    I am a novice. I was never that much into the detail thing until I bought my current ride. I have made mistakes on buying things but that was before I found this site. The one thing I got right before I found this site was I purchased a Griot`s Garage Random DA polisher. I did research on the different polishers out there and this one had good reviews and I liked the warranty and thought it was the best bang for the buck. It come with a DVD that is quite informative. It is easy to use. I have used it mainly for waxing but actually used it for polishing a couple weeks ago to get the car prepared for a good wax coat for winter driving and it worked wonders using it for polishing out the micro or swirl marks. I could not imagine going back to putting wax on by hand.

    Dean.

  10. #10
    Super Moderator Pats300zx's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Great info Todd !!!!
    Only Z Best Detailing-Automotive Concours Detailing Services
    http://ozbdetailing.com
    https://www.facebook.com/ozbautodetailing

  11. #11
    BobbyG's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Todd,

    Your write-ups are the most in-depth and complete of anyone I`ve read. This writing is clear, concise, easy t read and follow. I like the way you embed product links making it a breeze for the reader to quickly be directed to that page.

    Anyone inclined to add a polisher or two to their arsenal should thoroughly read this write-up in order to educate themselves before making an uninformed purchase....

    Very well written.....


    BobbyG

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    addysdaddy's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyG View Post
    Todd,

    Your write-ups are the most in-depth and complete of anyone I`ve read. This writing is clear, concise, easy t read and follow. I like the way you embed product links making it a breeze for the reader to quickly be directed to that page.

    Anyone inclined to add a polisher or two to their arsenal should thoroughly read this write-up in order to educate themselves before making an uninformed purchase....

    Very well written.....
    I would totally agree with your post Bobby.

  13. #13
    Just a regular guy Todd@RUPES's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Quote Originally Posted by addysdaddy View Post
    Like many here on the forum, I`ve read a ton of posts about the different features and attributes of the different polishing tools available. It might help those trying to make a buying decision if those who have used these various units (Mr Helme) spoke to why they reach for a specific tool in a specific set of circumstances. Guess I`m saying try to explain in more detail "the right tool for the right job" concept, since a newbie doesn`t know how to answer that question. I could be wrong but I`m assuming a pro knows the tasks he/she needs to perform and then goes out and purchases the right tool for that job. Again to the newbie side of the equation, the fact that one tool is direct drive with forced rotation versus a dual action polisher, difficult to cut through all of that for the novice. It might be more helpful to explain the conditions that dictate using one machine over another. I`m just asking...
    I will do my best to come up with something along this nature. At some points, past the nuts and bolts of the machine and the chemistry of the paint, polishing becomes an art form. I often reach for the machine and polish combination that I feel will yield the best results and then begin to tweak from their.

  14. #14
    addysdaddy's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Helme View Post
    I will do my best to come up with something along this nature. At some points, past the nuts and bolts of the machine and the chemistry of the paint, polishing becomes an art form. I often reach for the machine and polish combination that I feel will yield the best results and then begin to tweak from their.
    Understood, but you are the exception my friend. Few ever reach that point, even in the pro ranks. For those newbies & serious hobbyist, they detail their own family cars on a regular basis and that`s it. Once the heavy lifting has been accomplished, they go onto the maintenance mode. Do they really "need" the big guns - probably not. Do they "want" a big gun, perhaps. But my guess is that most non pros don`t need a rotary or a Flex. My cars are all in terrific shape at this point. Do I need a Flex - the answer is absolutely not. Will I buy a Flex - maybe but not because I need it. Every time I break out my PCXP it seems that I learn something new, so there is still a lot of room for me to improve my technique. It would be great to have it and a blast to use but the machine is not going to make me a better detailer.

    As see this everyday as a pro photographer. The camera doesn`t take the picture, it`s the photographer but people lose track of that. I`m not saying the Flex or any of these other tools aren`t great - but the first question I believe someone should ask is what do I need to do and what tool will get it done at a price point I can live with. That`s why I made my earlier post - if you could explain when you reach for a certain machine instead of another, I believe that could be very helpful. Sorry for going on, but I`ve read so many threads about which machine should I buy....when the real question is...what do you want to do and how often will you be doing it. And hey, I`ll be the first one to plead guilty to simply wanting a Flex (or whatever) and saying give me the best thing out there and let`s go have so fun. Nothing wrong with that in my book. I could be all wrong here Todd, but unless you going to be encountering cars that are in poor condition on a fairly regular basis, you probably would be served well with one of the DA machines.

  15. #15
    Just a regular guy Todd@RUPES's Avatar
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    Re: Choosing the right style and type of DA polisher

    Quote Originally Posted by addysdaddy View Post
    Understood, but you are the exception my friend. Few ever reach that point, even in the pro ranks. For those newbies & serious hobbyist, they detail their own family cars on a regular basis and that`s it. Once the heavy lifting has been accomplished, they go onto the maintenance mode. Do they really "need" the big guns - probably not. Do they "want" a big gun, perhaps. But my guess is that most non pros don`t need a rotary or a Flex. My cars are all in terrific shape at this point. Do I need a Flex - the answer is absolutely not. Will I buy a Flex - maybe but not because I need it. Every time I break out my PCXP it seems that I learn something new, so there is still a lot of room for me to improve my technique. It would be great to have it and a blast to use but the machine is not going to make me a better detailer.

    As see this everyday as a pro photographer. The camera doesn`t take the picture, it`s the photographer but people lose track of that. I`m not saying the Flex or any of these other tools aren`t great - but the first question I believe someone should ask is what do I need to do and what tool will get it done at a price point I can live with. That`s why I made my earlier post - if you could explain when you reach for a certain machine instead of another, I believe that could be very helpful. Sorry for going on, but I`ve read so many threads about which machine should I buy....when the real question is...what do you want to do and how often will you be doing it. And hey, I`ll be the first one to plead guilty to simply wanting a Flex (or whatever) and saying give me the best thing out there and let`s go have so fun. Nothing wrong with that in my book. I could be all wrong here Todd, but unless you going to be encountering cars that are in poor condition on a fairly regular basis, you probably would be served well with one of the DA machines.
    Thank you for the compliment

    I understanding what you are saying and I agree with your thought process 100%. The first question I ask somebody if they ask me to what polisher to purchase is, what are you working on, followed by skill level, expectations, etc...

    I will play with the idea on how to answer this question thoroughly. The problem, if you will, is that all of these machines are capable of doing just about anything (except sanding with rotary). So I am not sure if there is a flow-chart that would dictate which is the best for who. It is also my belief that Random Orbital DA polishers are the most versatile machines and capable of some really amazing feats if you really invest the time in using them to their fullest potential.

 

 
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