Is it really possible to remove all the swirls and spider webbing?

[Mirror Images]

I have seen some pretty impressive before and after photo`s. When I actually saw the car in person, don`t get me wrong, it looked really really really really good! However, you could still see swirls. Are people really able to get rid of the swirls or is it more of an optical illusion? You know, the products have good fillers and at angles in combibation with the sun reflecting off the car they look flawless.

With my car, I have used several coats of Z5 and Z2. The metallic red really jumps out in the sun (almost like the car is on fire) and you can`t see the swirls unless you position yourself at the right angle, then you can slighlty see them. I have never used a buffer on my car, all has been done by hand. Thanks for the input.

[togwt]

Quote: Is it really possible to remove all the swirls and spider webbing





~One mans opinion / observations~



Yes it is possible to remove all swirl marks and spider webbing, but with qualification.

Some surface imperfections are too deep into the paint/clear coat that removing them would reduce it to the point of failure. Basically there are some surface imperfections you have to learn to â€Ëœliveâ€â„¢ with



Clear coat has a thickness of 2-3Mils; the top half of this layer contains UV radiation protection. Removing more that 0.3 mil (0.0003") of clear coat will cause premature paint film failure.



As a point of reference a sheet of copy paper is 3.5Mil (0.0035") a surface scratch that will `catch` your fingernail is approximately 0.004" deep



~Hope this helps~



Knowledge unshared is experience wasted

justadumbarchitect / so I question everything/ Jon

[Mirror Images]

Ok TOGWT, so the scratches that are too deep to remove without taking all the clearcoat off and replaceing it stay. So then the fillers and carnuba help mask/hide those scratches you can`t get out?

[Bill D]

They could but even focusing on the marring/ swirls that are removable can be incredibly long and meticulous work involving, when not using multiple pads and polishes, lots and lots of time viewing panels under different lighting conditions and different angles. Definitely a labor of love.

[Accumulator]

Since this is in the Pro forum, I`ll point out that removing *every* bit of marring from a customer`s car can be risky because of the paint-thinning issue. Assuming it`ll get marred again, how many times can you do this :nixweiss Get the customer used to a truly perfect finish and you`ll probably have to soon explain why you can`t do it any more- "well, since you keep scratching your paint I`m running out of clear to work with..." doesn`t sound too good.



Pro or not, I honestly don`t see much point in removing every last flaw (assuming they *can* be safely removed) unless you have reason to believe the finish won`t get marred again.



I try to keep the S8 marring-free, but on my other vehicles, I generally settle for imperfect *but original* paint. The MPV inexplicably stays marring free, but that`s unusual and not something I really expect with a beater.

[Scottwax]

On some vehicles, you can probably remove 95%+ but they will come back at some point. Improper washing, people rubbing against the car when it is dirty, etc.

[Anthony O.]

I concur with the others here......it is possible to get much of the marring out but at what cost?



Get the car as nice as possible without degrading the CC beyond the point of no return, use a glaze if needed and most importantly......wash and dry the car with care.



Anthony

[Mirror Images]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the info.

[03COBRA]

I used to wonder the same thing until yesterday. I am a PC user and I knew that removing swirls would be difficult, I guess with a rotary is a little bit easier. But I didn`t think I would be able to get as many swirls out as I did. This pic is yesterday`s detail I did on my aunts car. I removed this with an LC cutting pad, PC on 6, using DACP. I guess I have not had enough experience to see if you can remove all swirls, but I would say some are probably to deep to get out!

[Anthony O.]

Those are not swirls but rather "halo scratches". Swirls are introduced into the paint as micro-scratches caused by a rotary and an aggressive pad/product combination. They take on the appearance of a 3-D ribbon like hologram.



Halo scratches are much easier to remove than swirls as most halo scratches are usually very light in nature. Swirls can go so deep that at times only wetsanding can fully remove them.



So where is the AFTER pics? We would love to see your results!



Take care,

Anthony

[Mr. Clean]

Originally posted by Anthony Orosco

So where is the AFTER pics? We would love to see your results!

Uhhhmmm, am I missing something? My monitor shows a distinct line down the middle of the panel (appearing as though the panel was taped working only half) showing what appears to be the before AND after. :nixweiss

[stevet]

Originally posted by Mr. Clean

Uhhhmmm, am I missing something? My monitor shows a distinct line down the middle of the panel (appearing as though the panel was taped working only half) showing what appears to be the before AND after. :nixweiss

Yeah, same here. Very nice results to.

[03COBRA]

I always thought they were swirls. Here are the results if you guys want to see them. Thanks for the compliments guys!

http://www.autopia.org/forums/showth...9&goto=newpost

[Anthony O.]

Hey...may bad....after taking a second look there it is right in front of me. DOH!